Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs

K Major · 12-05-2022, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

I'm quite sure our coaches run practice every week and stress those very things. Once the player takes the field it's all on them.

AG - that's simply NOT true.

Have you ever watched Bill Bellichick or Andy Reid when they are down (4th quarter adjustments) by 2 scores in a game? Or Coach K or Saban perhaps? Do you ever wonder why there is no "panic" with these teams & coaches? High situational awareness - being able to execute on the fly with a dose of common sense. This is why there are assistants & guys breaking down formations in the booth.

Coaching definitely doesn't stop or "it's all on them once they hit the field" is very far from the truth.

AsylumGuido · 12-05-2022, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

The (good) COACH'S JOB is to make sure we aren't even having this conversation about HIS players.

If the Coach's job is to stand on the sidelines and say, "I'm not responsible for the train-wrecks (and the losses, week after week) on the field at game time", then the game has changed since I was a youngster. Call me an old fart.

The game has changed since both of us were youngsters. The time spent with players in practice is a fraction of what it was back then. Practice time in pads are even a tinier percentage. Players used to come to camp out of shape and a blank canvas that the coaches had to paint completely. These days the players are expected to come to camp at 90% of readiness with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time. Reps are extremely limited and the vast majority go to the slotted starters.

Sinner · 12-05-2022, 03:10 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

AG - that's simply NOT true.

Have you ever watched Bill Bellichick or Andy Reid when they are down (4th quarter adjustments) by 2 scores in a game? Or Coach K or Saban perhaps? Do you ever wonder why there is no "panic" with these teams & coaches? High situational awareness - being able to execute on the fly with a dose of common sense. This is why there are assistants & guys breaking down formations in the booth.

Coaching definitely doesn't stop or "it's all on them once they hit the field" is very far from the truth.

A (good) Coach will say, "IF we suck, then as Head Coach, that falls on ME. Pretty high up on my "to do" list as a HEAD COACH is to make sure we DON'T SUCK. Not at practice, not at game time, not at all, or as little as possible. THAT'S MY JOB."

A (good or great) Head Coach would never advise a (good or great) Fan to "Blame my players for sucking at game time".

mapcow · 12-05-2022, 03:16 PM

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Sinner · 12-05-2022, 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

The game has changed since both of us were youngsters. The time spent with players in practice is a fraction of what it was back then. Practice time in pads are even a tinier percentage. Players used to come to camp out of shape and a blank canvas that the coaches had to paint completely. These days the players are expected to come to camp at 90% of readiness with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time. Reps are extremely limited and the vast majority go to the slotted starters.

"with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time"... Our Coaches will have to try harder, with whatever amount of time (or players) they have left.

AsylumGuido · 12-05-2022, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

AG - that's simply NOT true.

Have you ever watched Bill Bellichick or Andy Reid when they are down (4th quarter adjustments) by 2 scores in a game? Or Coach K or Saban perhaps? Do you ever wonder why there is no "panic" with these teams & coaches? High situational awareness - being able to execute on the fly with a dose of common sense. This is why there are assistants & guys breaking down formations in the booth.

Coaching definitely doesn't stop or "it's all on them once they hit the field" is very far from the truth.

Don't be silly. Of course there's in game coaching. That's completely different than coaching fundamentals which is what we are discussing, K. Apples and oranges. Coaches can be and are absolutely responsible for everything that you just listed. There's no argument from me on that point. But once the fundamentals are taught (and should have been taught in little league, high school, and college) it is all on the players once they hit the field.

AsylumGuido · 12-05-2022, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

A (good) Coach will say, "IF we suck, then as Head Coach, that falls on ME. Pretty high up on my "to do" list as a HEAD COACH is to make sure we DON'T SUCK. Not at practice, not at game time, not at all, or as little as possible. THAT'S MY JOB."

A (good or great) Head Coach would never advise a (good or great) Fan to "Blame my players for sucking at game time".

No one is advising me of that fact. It's obvious to any informed fan that some players are simply not as gifted as others, regardless of how well they are coached.

AsylumGuido · 12-05-2022, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

"with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time"... Our Coaches will have to try harder, with whatever amount of time (or players) they have left.

You can only do so much as a coach with what God has or has not given the player. My late father-in-law, Cleveland Strong who is in the Louisiana High School Hall of Fame - Class of 1988, told me this once when talking about one of his best players on the way to one of his State Championships. At some point it is up to the player to use what he has been taught to the best of his abilities.

K Major · 12-05-2022, 04:28 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

Don't be silly. Of course there's in game coaching. That's completely different than coaching fundamentals which is what we are discussing, K. Apples and oranges. Coaches can be and are absolutely responsible for everything that you just listed. There's no argument from me on that point. But once the fundamentals are taught (and should have been taught in little league, high school, and college) it is all on the players once they hit the field.

No, YOU don't be silly.

Verbatim you made a 100% false statement about coaching as it relates to players once they take the field.

No one in this forum is trying to read what's in your mind

.

K Major · 12-05-2022, 04:33 PM

I won't go back and forth on this topic because the point is CRYSTAL CLEAR for 99.9% of us on B&G.

Coaching does matter & the current guy in charge doesn't have answers.

A career 12-36 HC record tells me he doesn't have a clue.

12-05-2022, 03:04 PM	#61
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,622 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by AsylumGuido I'm quite sure our coaches run practice every week and stress those very things. Once the player takes the field it's all on them. AG - that's simply NOT true. Have you ever watched Bill Bellichick or Andy Reid when they are down (4th quarter adjustments) by 2 scores in a game? Or Coach K or Saban perhaps? Do you ever wonder why there is no "panic" with these teams & coaches? High situational awareness - being able to execute on the fly with a dose of common sense. This is why there are assistants & guys breaking down formations in the booth. Coaching definitely doesn't stop or "it's all on them once they hit the field" is very far from the truth. Sinner likes this.

12-05-2022, 03:08 PM	#62
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by Sinner The (good) COACH'S JOB is to make sure we aren't even having this conversation about HIS players. If the Coach's job is to stand on the sidelines and say, "I'm not responsible for the train-wrecks (and the losses, week after week) on the field at game time", then the game has changed since I was a youngster. Call me an old fart. The game has changed since both of us were youngsters. The time spent with players in practice is a fraction of what it was back then. Practice time in pads are even a tinier percentage. Players used to come to camp out of shape and a blank canvas that the coaches had to paint completely. These days the players are expected to come to camp at 90% of readiness with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time. Reps are extremely limited and the vast majority go to the slotted starters.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

12-05-2022, 03:10 PM	#63
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,952	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by K Major AG - that's simply NOT true. Have you ever watched Bill Bellichick or Andy Reid when they are down (4th quarter adjustments) by 2 scores in a game? Or Coach K or Saban perhaps? Do you ever wonder why there is no "panic" with these teams & coaches? High situational awareness - being able to execute on the fly with a dose of common sense. This is why there are assistants & guys breaking down formations in the booth. Coaching definitely doesn't stop or "it's all on them once they hit the field" is very far from the truth. A (good) Coach will say, "IF we suck, then as Head Coach, that falls on ME. Pretty high up on my "to do" list as a HEAD COACH is to make sure we DON'T SUCK. Not at practice, not at game time, not at all, or as little as possible. THAT'S MY JOB." A (good or great) Head Coach would never advise a (good or great) Fan to "Blame my players for sucking at game time". K Major likes this.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,952	Last edited by Sinner; 12-05-2022 at 03:28 PM..

12-05-2022, 03:17 PM	#65
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,952	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by AsylumGuido The game has changed since both of us were youngsters. The time spent with players in practice is a fraction of what it was back then. Practice time in pads are even a tinier percentage. Players used to come to camp out of shape and a blank canvas that the coaches had to paint completely. These days the players are expected to come to camp at 90% of readiness with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time. Reps are extremely limited and the vast majority go to the slotted starters. "with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time"... Our Coaches will have to try harder, with whatever amount of time (or players) they have left.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,952

12-05-2022, 04:05 PM	#66
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by K Major AG - that's simply NOT true. Have you ever watched Bill Bellichick or Andy Reid when they are down (4th quarter adjustments) by 2 scores in a game? Or Coach K or Saban perhaps? Do you ever wonder why there is no "panic" with these teams & coaches? High situational awareness - being able to execute on the fly with a dose of common sense. This is why there are assistants & guys breaking down formations in the booth. Coaching definitely doesn't stop or "it's all on them once they hit the field" is very far from the truth. Don't be silly. Of course there's in game coaching. That's completely different than coaching fundamentals which is what we are discussing, K. Apples and oranges. Coaches can be and are absolutely responsible for everything that you just listed. There's no argument from me on that point. But once the fundamentals are taught (and should have been taught in little league, high school, and college) it is all on the players once they hit the field.

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12-05-2022, 04:07 PM	#67
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by Sinner A (good) Coach will say, "IF we suck, then as Head Coach, that falls on ME. Pretty high up on my "to do" list as a HEAD COACH is to make sure we DON'T SUCK. Not at practice, not at game time, not at all, or as little as possible. THAT'S MY JOB." A (good or great) Head Coach would never advise a (good or great) Fan to "Blame my players for sucking at game time". No one is advising me of that fact. It's obvious to any informed fan that some players are simply not as gifted as others, regardless of how well they are coached.

12-05-2022, 04:14 PM	#68
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by Sinner "with the coaches having to try to smooth whatever sharp edges they can in a limited amount of time"... Our Coaches will have to try harder, with whatever amount of time (or players) they have left. You can only do so much as a coach with what God has or has not given the player. My late father-in-law, Cleveland Strong who is in the Louisiana High School Hall of Fame - Class of 1988, told me this once when talking about one of his best players on the way to one of his State Championships. At some point it is up to the player to use what he has been taught to the best of his abilities.

12-05-2022, 04:28 PM	#69
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,622 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs Originally Posted by AsylumGuido Don't be silly. Of course there's in game coaching. That's completely different than coaching fundamentals which is what we are discussing, K. Apples and oranges. Coaches can be and are absolutely responsible for everything that you just listed. There's no argument from me on that point. But once the fundamentals are taught (and should have been taught in little league, high school, and college) it is all on the players once they hit the field. No, YOU don't be silly. Verbatim you made a 100% false statement about coaching as it relates to players once they take the field. No one in this forum is trying to read what's in your mind . Sinner likes this.

12-05-2022, 04:33 PM	#70
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,622 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Week Thirteen: Saints @ Bucs I won't go back and forth on this topic because the point is CRYSTAL CLEAR for 99.9% of us on B&G. Coaching does matter & the current guy in charge doesn't have answers. A career 12-36 HC record tells me he doesn't have a clue. Sinner and frydaddy like this.