Who would Payton Bring With Him?

Rugby Saint II · 11-30-2022, 01:05 PM

I'm thinking Dennis Allen if we fire him after this season. Maybe Jeff Ireland, but l sure hope not.

MatthewT · 11-30-2022, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II

I'm thinking Dennis Allen if we fire him after this season. Maybe Jeff Ireland, but l sure hope not.

I agree if DA gets fired he will be hired by Payton. I also think it's pretty much a slam dunk that Pete Carmichael will follow Payton.

K Major · 11-30-2022, 01:32 PM

Highly unlikely the Saints move on from DA after year #1.

However, Pete Carmichael's OC seat is on fire.

AsylumGuido · 11-30-2022, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

Highly unlikely the Saints move on from DA after year #1.

However, Pete Carmichael's OC seat is on fire.

I hope so.

BakoSaint · 12-01-2022, 12:45 AM

If DA gets fired he may also go to Detroit with Dan Campbell if they get along. The Lions are a defense away from contending and have several former Saints like Analzone and Klein.

We should fire DA. Even if he’s not the problem at best he is average. Nothing to lose by moving on.

TheOak · 12-01-2022, 05:46 AM

A little critical thought here...

Why would Sean recreate what he left?

Why do you think Sean left if you think he is going to bring what he had with him?

Assuming he didn't retire because of Gayle or Mickey then whats left is, he either retired from the hole he made or wanted to start something new... Neither would be favorable for taking Saints staff.

I would also add, going back what a poorly designed organization looks like, and that is one where the Head Coaches contract doesn't have a 'no poaching' clause that covers at least a year after his or the candidate coaches separation.

MatthewT · 12-01-2022, 07:18 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

A little critical thought here...

Why would Sean recreate what he left?

Why do you think Sean left if you think he is going to bring what he had with him?

Assuming he didn't retire because of Gayle or Mickey then whats left is, he either retired from the hole he made or wanted to start something new... Neither would be favorable for taking Saints staff.

I would also add, going back what a poorly designed organization looks like, and that is one where the Head Coaches contract doesn't have a 'no poaching' clause that covers at least a year after his or the candidate coaches separation.

I think Sean left for several reasons, I will speculate that one of those reasons is roster issues and not issues with his coaches. There are glaring holes that need to be addressed, and no easy way of filling a lot of these. I think this year is a perfect example, the Saints probably had a great opportunity to unload a few veterans before the trade deadline, and if I am interpreting the salary cap correctly they couldn't have done it even if they wanted to. So from what I gather, the Saints have limited short term draft capital, a salary cap situation that is still very bad and will likely take several more years to dig out of, an aging roster with players they are stuck with, and no franchise QB anywhere to be found.

AsylumGuido · 12-01-2022, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

A little critical thought here...

Why would Sean recreate what he left?

Why do you think Sean left if you think he is going to bring what he had with him?

Assuming he didn't retire because of Gayle or Mickey then whats left is, he either retired from the hole he made or wanted to start something new... Neither would be favorable for taking Saints staff.

I would also add, going back what a poorly designed organization looks like, and that is one where the Head Coaches contract doesn't have a 'no poaching' clause that covers at least a year after his or the candidate coaches separation.

I believe Payton left for one reason and one reason only that he shared with one of his very best friends, Jay Glazer, a year earlier through his actions. According to Glazer, Payton was simply burned out and wanted a break from coaching altogether. He didn't leave to get away from the Saints. He left to get away from coaching in general for a time. During the offseason prior to the 2021 season, according to Glazer, Payton seemed to have lost the usually fire that he had always seen. Perhaps the pressures of the first year of the COVID pandemic was having a toll. Regardless, Glazer said he knew that Payton was seriously considering at least a temporary retirement following that season.

AsylumGuido · 12-01-2022, 09:30 AM

Originally Posted by MatthewT

I think Sean left for several reasons, I will speculate that one of those reasons is roster issues and not issues with his coaches. There are glaring holes that need to be addressed, and no easy way of filling a lot of these. I think this year is a perfect example, the Saints probably had a great opportunity to unload a few veterans before the trade deadline, and if I am interpreting the salary cap correctly they couldn't have done it even if they wanted to. So from what I gather, the Saints have limited short term draft capital, a salary cap situation that is still very bad and will likely take several more years to dig out of, an aging roster with players they are stuck with, and no franchise QB anywhere to be found.

The Saint have six picks in the upcoming draft, only one fewer than the norm. They also have close to $120 million in convertible cap that they intentionally built into their existing contracts via base salaries and roster/workout bonuses. They have no plan to "dig out" of anything. The whole financial strategy involves transference of current costs into future years where those costs make up a smaller percentage of the ever expanding cap. There are some good interviews out there with Khai Harley, the architect of the plan. That strategy can't change as long as either Loomis and/or Harley are still with the Saints and could very well continue after they leave as more and more teams are moving toward this model.

TheOak · 12-01-2022, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

I believe Payton left for one reason and one reason only that he shared with one of his very best friends, Jay Glazer, a year earlier through his actions. According to Glazer, Payton was simply burned out and wanted a break from coaching altogether. He didn't leave to get away from the Saints. He left to get away from coaching in general for a time. During the offseason prior to the 2021 season, according to Glazer, Payton seemed to have lost the usually fire that he had always seen. Perhaps the pressures of the first year of the COVID pandemic was having a toll. Regardless, Glazer said he knew that Payton was seriously considering at least a temporary retirement following that season.

Then he is back coaching the Saints next year.

11-30-2022, 01:12 PM	#2
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II I'm thinking Dennis Allen if we fire him after this season. Maybe Jeff Ireland, but l sure hope not. I agree if DA gets fired he will be hired by Payton. I also think it's pretty much a slam dunk that Pete Carmichael will follow Payton. Rugby Saint II likes this.

11-30-2022, 01:32 PM	#3
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,589 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? Highly unlikely the Saints move on from DA after year #1. However, Pete Carmichael's OC seat is on fire. Rugby Saint II likes this.

11-30-2022, 02:03 PM	#4
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,048	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? Originally Posted by K Major Highly unlikely the Saints move on from DA after year #1. However, Pete Carmichael's OC seat is on fire. I hope so.

12-01-2022, 12:45 AM	#5
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,091	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? If DA gets fired he may also go to Detroit with Dan Campbell if they get along. The Lions are a defense away from contending and have several former Saints like Analzone and Klein. We should fire DA. Even if he’s not the problem at best he is average. Nothing to lose by moving on. MatthewT likes this.
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,091

12-01-2022, 05:46 AM	#6
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,019	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? A little critical thought here... Why would Sean recreate what he left? Why do you think Sean left if you think he is going to bring what he had with him? Assuming he didn't retire because of Gayle or Mickey then whats left is, he either retired from the hole he made or wanted to start something new... Neither would be favorable for taking Saints staff. I would also add, going back what a poorly designed organization looks like, and that is one where the Head Coaches contract doesn't have a 'no poaching' clause that covers at least a year after his or the candidate coaches separation. MatthewT and Rugby Saint II like this.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

11-30-2022, 01:05 PM	#1
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,043	Who would Payton Bring With Him? I'm thinking Dennis Allen if we fire him after this season. Maybe Jeff Ireland, but l sure hope not. MatthewT likes this.

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12-01-2022, 07:18 AM	#7
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? Originally Posted by TheOak A little critical thought here... Why would Sean recreate what he left? Why do you think Sean left if you think he is going to bring what he had with him? Assuming he didn't retire because of Gayle or Mickey then whats left is, he either retired from the hole he made or wanted to start something new... Neither would be favorable for taking Saints staff. I would also add, going back what a poorly designed organization looks like, and that is one where the Head Coaches contract doesn't have a 'no poaching' clause that covers at least a year after his or the candidate coaches separation. I think Sean left for several reasons, I will speculate that one of those reasons is roster issues and not issues with his coaches. There are glaring holes that need to be addressed, and no easy way of filling a lot of these. I think this year is a perfect example, the Saints probably had a great opportunity to unload a few veterans before the trade deadline, and if I am interpreting the salary cap correctly they couldn't have done it even if they wanted to. So from what I gather, the Saints have limited short term draft capital, a salary cap situation that is still very bad and will likely take several more years to dig out of, an aging roster with players they are stuck with, and no franchise QB anywhere to be found. Rugby Saint II likes this.

12-01-2022, 09:21 AM	#8
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,048	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? Originally Posted by TheOak A little critical thought here... Why would Sean recreate what he left? Why do you think Sean left if you think he is going to bring what he had with him? Assuming he didn't retire because of Gayle or Mickey then whats left is, he either retired from the hole he made or wanted to start something new... Neither would be favorable for taking Saints staff. I would also add, going back what a poorly designed organization looks like, and that is one where the Head Coaches contract doesn't have a 'no poaching' clause that covers at least a year after his or the candidate coaches separation. I believe Payton left for one reason and one reason only that he shared with one of his very best friends, Jay Glazer, a year earlier through his actions. According to Glazer, Payton was simply burned out and wanted a break from coaching altogether. He didn't leave to get away from the Saints. He left to get away from coaching in general for a time. During the offseason prior to the 2021 season, according to Glazer, Payton seemed to have lost the usually fire that he had always seen. Perhaps the pressures of the first year of the COVID pandemic was having a toll. Regardless, Glazer said he knew that Payton was seriously considering at least a temporary retirement following that season. Rugby Saint II likes this.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

12-01-2022, 09:30 AM	#9
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,048	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? Originally Posted by MatthewT I think Sean left for several reasons, I will speculate that one of those reasons is roster issues and not issues with his coaches. There are glaring holes that need to be addressed, and no easy way of filling a lot of these. I think this year is a perfect example, the Saints probably had a great opportunity to unload a few veterans before the trade deadline, and if I am interpreting the salary cap correctly they couldn't have done it even if they wanted to. So from what I gather, the Saints have limited short term draft capital, a salary cap situation that is still very bad and will likely take several more years to dig out of, an aging roster with players they are stuck with, and no franchise QB anywhere to be found. The Saint have six picks in the upcoming draft, only one fewer than the norm. They also have close to $120 million in convertible cap that they intentionally built into their existing contracts via base salaries and roster/workout bonuses. They have no plan to "dig out" of anything. The whole financial strategy involves transference of current costs into future years where those costs make up a smaller percentage of the ever expanding cap. There are some good interviews out there with Khai Harley, the architect of the plan. That strategy can't change as long as either Loomis and/or Harley are still with the Saints and could very well continue after they leave as more and more teams are moving toward this model.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

12-01-2022, 10:04 AM	#10
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,019	Re: Who would Payton Bring With Him? Originally Posted by AsylumGuido I believe Payton left for one reason and one reason only that he shared with one of his very best friends, Jay Glazer, a year earlier through his actions. According to Glazer, Payton was simply burned out and wanted a break from coaching altogether. He didn't leave to get away from the Saints. He left to get away from coaching in general for a time. During the offseason prior to the 2021 season, according to Glazer, Payton seemed to have lost the usually fire that he had always seen. Perhaps the pressures of the first year of the COVID pandemic was having a toll. Regardless, Glazer said he knew that Payton was seriously considering at least a temporary retirement following that season. Then he is back coaching the Saints next year. MatthewT and Boston Saint like this.