Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Tom Brady....from GOAT to just another Prima....yall know the rest

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Never heard of Payton Manning. I suppose you were attempting to refer to Peyton Manning.

That said, I never said I would want Brady. Just sharing and discussing the article. However, I'd take Sean Payton back in a second.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

YET:
San Francisco 49ers Regular season record: 48–46 (.511)
"Perception Is Not Reality"

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

If we're willing to sell the farm for a QB, why not Lamar Jackson

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Can he stay healthy? I know that Payton said he'd love to have him wherever he coaches next, but he's banged up again this year.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Therein lies the question for a running QB. They look sexy at times, but it's just a matter of time before a leg injury surfaces. The question then becomes why pay top dollar when one has to carry multiple QBs to support the kind of offense for a QB that is going to get hurt. The perfect blend is a QB that can on occasion effectively collect a first with a quick scamper and also read the field quickly and release the ball quickly and with motivation, touch, and anticipation. Yes, I know, the Burrows and Mahomes of the world are few and far between. Those guys deserves the big bucks. Lamar wants the same $. Good for him if he gets them. But he's not worth it IMHO. Neither was DW when the Saints inexplicably pursued him.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Meanwhile the damn Lions are winning (won the last 5 of 6 games) with some dude named Jared Goff at QB :rolleyes:.

Dan Campbell is turning it around quickly up in Motown - his MINDSET is off the charts. No excuses, they continue to improve every week.

Good for him.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Add Kyler Murray to the list.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

So first off I am not saying this to slam Campbell or promote Allen. Campbell could easily be a better head coach than Allen. He probably is.

Im also not trying to be argumentative like Guido has accused me of being in the past. Im jut trying to present a different viewpoint. It’s something my Dad taught me about looking at things from multiple sides. I like discussions about football.

Campbell is doing well now and the lions have played well recently. But Campbell had 3 wins in his first year as HC. A downgrade from the previous year. The management decided to give him a second year. He started this season with a 1-6 record before recent success.

So my point is that even though he has won 5 of 6, I’m sure there were many fans screaming for his head during what was a 4-19 stretch going back to last year. People calling for Allen’s head should think about that, especially if you are touting Campbell.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

It is what it is brother.

Dennis Allen isn't a leader of men or knows how to motivate.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

You could easily be correct Major, but you see my point, right?

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

For anyone interested in stats:

Dan Campbell hired in 2021 already has more CAREER WINS (14) than Allen (12) who has had TWO TENURES (Oakland and is currently in NO). Basically a 3-year start as HC :(.

At the end of the day, no owner/GM cares about "we didn't have X, we had this many guys out due to covid, mgt didn't do this", yadda, yadda.

Allen is below average at his job.

Wins and losses are all that matters.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Ok, so I guess that means you don’t see my point.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

FACTS are a bitter pill to swallow.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

What fact have I denied?

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Excellent points!

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Again, I’m not arguing how good/bad Campbell is. I’m just pointing out that as a DETROIT LIONS fan (forget his interem Miami gig cause that doesn’t mean much to a Lions fan) he was sitting with a record of 4-19. Don't you think there were Lions fans doubting him? I’m guessing you would have too had you been a lions fan.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

We have a Coaching Problem.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Don't know nor do I care how the "fans" feel.

Bottom line is that if you don't motivate, elevate, and prepare your men each week for play, you'll continue to take L's and/or eventually lose your job.

Owners want a winning product on Sundays, not excuses Boston. 2022 was a playoff roster (in my mind) & somehow went south quickly. In a terrible division, the Saints are currently the worst. Rewind to games this season .. Bengals, Carolina, Ravens, Steelers, Niners, etc. If you had a competent HC, you win at least 3, or 4 of those "close" ones.

I'm on to the Falcons brother. They tee it up at 12 sharp :bng:

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

I don’t disagree with any of this…but the things you say about Allen you would have said about Campbell had he been the Saints coach and had a 4-19 record like he did with the Lions.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

You are correct.

From a Lions forum - The Den - this season:

Poll: Should Dan Campbell be fired after loss to Pats?

Comments:

"He won’t be, but keeping Dan Campbell around is on the same level as letting Matt Patricia stay as long as the Lions did. Dan Campbell isn’t an NFL head coach."

"For those voting “No,” I have to know why. What are you seeing?"

"No. He’s got this season for sure. He’s done a terrible job. I’m not debating that"

"We were absolutely unprepared in every element of this game. It’s like we just walked in with our Playbook without scouting with the other team can do. Belichick is the greatest coach the NFL has ever seen and it obviously showed today because he 100% knew how to stop this offense. This team was absolutely embarrassing to watch today and that is 100% on the entirety of the coaching staff"

"I don’t see how you can keep him around. The season is lost, and he hasn’t shown any progress as a coach. I wouldn’t delay the inevitable at this point."

"The unpreparedness is what got me today. They were outcoached in every single aspect."

"Brian Daboll has the same amount of wins in 5 games with Daniel Jones as his QB as Dan Campbell has in 22 games."

"If the lions win less than 5 games, which is a probability, Campbell has to be let go. If the wheels fall off the offense this season is going to be unwatchable. Even worse than last year because we have more talent."

"Get rid of him now. Sheila needs to make a statement. Both she and the fans were sold a bill of goods."

"Just to do it? He’s 4-17-1, looks completely over his head, and his players look like they’re regressing across the board. If you want to salvage any of these young guys, you have to cut ties with Dan sooner rather than later, IMO."

And it goes on and on. Sound familiar?

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

The roster pre-injury was a playoff roster in my mind as well. After being decimated, not so much. Although, if you had Michael Thomas, Marshon Lattimore, and the missing 3/5th's of the starting offensive line you win at least 3, or 4 of those close ones.

And we'll be there in section 229 pulling for that Falcons beat down.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Ripping off five wins is good for Dan Quinn. However, I think Four wins is the most that Dennis Allen ever had in one season. As was mentioned earlier, he is in his third year has head coach and is performing just as poorly now as he did his first year.

Like Boston said, there have been numerous devastating injuries to multiple starters and we are playing with a backup quarterback, so it is a little difficult to expect much from a coach in that situation.

However, Sean Payton did a fabulous job with the same circumstances while being relocated for the hurricane last season and came out with a winning record. If Dennis Allen is given another year I'll be able to understand the reasoning behind that move. However I would be quite happy if he found employment elsewhere next year.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

This is a tough discussion because of what we as fans are not able to witness. It would appear that Allen isn't the guy for the job and that players (hello Kamara) have given up on him but we aren't privy to what happens during practices, in meeting rooms, and conversations on the sidelines during game days. We have a very limited view. Sean Payton had multiple seasons of 7-9 outcomes but was given grace because he brought a championship to New Orleans. This is a "What have you done for me?" business so Allen gets a short leash.

For what it's worth, I was all for bringing in Allen because he was head coach for one game when Payton was out with a virus that he was vaccinated for and whipped the Bucs 9-0. I figured that continuity and previous HC experience would make him the best option in New Orleans. I might've been wrong but I just don't know to be honest.
I think I know but I don't know. And I never will.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

When DA was appointed, I watched the press conference and was convinced we'd made the right move. He just sounded like a motivated guy that would demand the best, especially following on from Payton and being on that staff.

Then he made it apparent that WR position needed to be upgraded, I was thrilled because that was one of my biggest annoyances about Payton.

However Allen, then let way too much defensive talent walk for nothing or next to nothing.

All of the guys that got interceptions for this D, are still getting interceptions, just for other teams.

We have what 3 or 4 interceptions on the season from the entire squad? Players Allen let walk have more than that.

That, is why the cap is so important. Had the FO not backed this team into a corner money-wise, we would have been able to keep the guys that deserved to get paid. But instead, we are left with guys in the secondary that are afraid to hit and can't generate turnovers.

Brees and Payton hid a lot of this teams deficiencies for years, which meant the cap situation didn't look as bad, because we were still competitive.
Now we are not, now we need cap space and they need to blank slate this team to achieve it, in my opinion.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

You are making the assumption, diz, that Allen was/is making the personnel decisions. I don't believe that's the case. Sean Payton earned that right after years of success. I believe that all personnel moves post Payton have come exclusively through the front office and continue to come from that source.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

It's fine you don't believe that's the case, that's your assumption.

And regardless, the point still stands. The team needs cap space to keep the players that made this team competitive. Because this type of season happens when they don't. Allen is not a good enough coach to hide the teams deficiencies like Payton did.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Given the fact that it is extremely rare for any head coach to be the personnel man, as well, I feel fairly confident my assumption is accurate in the case of a new head coach with zero experience in that decision making process. Besides Payton and Belichick, Mike Holmgren is possibly the only other that may make those decisions. Believe what you wish, however.

:D

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

I agree that Allen isn't anywhere near as good a coach as was Payton. As for cap space, the team had/has plenty of cap space available to retain those players, but decided to let them go, or in the case of Ceedy Duce, outright got rid of him. Coming into next season the Saints have over $100 million in convertible cap space available for Loomis and Company to hopefully make some good moves after covering the planned deficit.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

So my problem with that is then, who's making these decisions, if not Allen?

For the price we paid Mathieu and Maye, we could have just kept Marcus Williams, because neither of those players are anywhere near Marcus.

The team also let Trey Hendrickson go, and whilst he isn't a physical specimen like Davenport is, he was consistent.

Seeing this team not being able to sack even the most static QB's is painful.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Those decisions would have to be being made by Loomis, Michael Parenton (Director of Pro Personnel), and Parenton's staff. I suppose Jeff Ireland has some input as far as a player's value as compared to a college prospect.

Marcus Williams signed with the Ravens on a $70 million five year deal, $37 million guaranteed. Mathieu signed for a 3 year, $28 million with $18M guaranteed. Maye was signed for 3 years, $22.5M, $14.5 guaranteed.

I believe you also have to factor in the player's desires. Perhaps the Saints didn't want to commit to five years and Williams wouldn't settle for less than that.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Check out timestamp starting around 39:30 :

Nick was pretty adamant that if SP was still head coach our QB would have been Teddy B & drafted Kenny Pickett. Interesting ...

IDK, I'm kinda glad we selected Chris Olave (he's the truth) & Penning (jury still out but I like his ceiling potential) though.

Good interview.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Dennis isn't some "new head coach". He's worked in this organization 16 years so I doubt the front office was going against DA's advice. Especially when it came to defensive personnel.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

This is what some either are missing or simply ignore for whatever reason.

Re: Payton and Brady Teaming Up in NOLA?
 

Just because Allen wasn't a "new head coach" doesn't mean that Loomis and company would be willing to hand over the same level of autonomy in decision making that Sean Payton earned over his 15 year tenure. I'm not saying he wouldn't have input, but deciding whether or not to give into player contract demands are likely far out of his current level of authority.