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What Went Wrong

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; I think the plan all along was for DA and Loomis to give themselves record extensions this year to match some of the highest paid coaches and GMs in the league and include guaranteed money long term. So, our offseason ...

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Old 12-28-2023, 06:18 PM   #11
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Re: What Went Wrong

I think the plan all along was for DA and Loomis to give themselves record extensions this year to match some of the highest paid coaches and GMs in the league and include guaranteed money long term. So, our offseason play was not just to go all in to win now, it was especially focused on that one goal.

Signing Carr was not just seen as a win now move but also a move to reinforce the idea of paying big money for leaders other people doubt. If it worked, DA and Loomis would present themselves as the next Carrs. Then we gave needless offseason and early season extensions to Jordan, Granderson, and Ruiz, all of whom were still under contract and not holding out. This was to reinforce the idea of keeping the band together and winning with continuity.

The first four games of the season were against the titans with a lame duck tannehill, the panthers with a rookie young player in his second game with no oline, a banged up packers with love replacing rodgers, and the bucs newly without brady and expected to be bottom dwellers. I think the idea was that we would go 4-0 or 3-1 in those easy games and after giving Granderson and Ruiz extensions it would be natural to give DA a deal topping Paytons and Loomis something similar for delivering us to the promised land. Instead of the game ball, Gayle would have given them big checks. The roster was managed with this plan in mind too. For example we greatly overcompensated for Kamara’s possible suspension signing a top FA RB and using one of our top draft picks at RB even though it would only effect the first few games. We didnt move on from older and more injury prone players unlikely to last all year, because we only needed them to last 4 games. We didnt worry about adding young depth or keeping a player like Ellis, because we were not playing the long game, and he would not have been on the field much until someone got hurt or slowed down.

The plan went perfect when we started 2-0 and were up on the Packers. Had we beat the Packers and gone to 3-0 with Carr healthy I think DA and Loomis’ new record contracts would have been announced on that Tuesday. But then the wheels fell off the oline, Carr went down with an injury that looked serious, and we lost the next two. But DA and Loomis were so close to their desired $100 million plus contracts that would allow them to really relax all week.
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Old 12-28-2023, 06:34 PM   #12
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by BakoSaint View Post
I think the plan all along was for DA and Loomis to give themselves record extensions this year to match some of the highest paid coaches and GMs in the league and include guaranteed money long term. So, our offseason play was not just to go all in to win now, it was especially focused on that one goal.

Signing Carr was not just seen as a win now move but also a move to reinforce the idea of paying big money for leaders other people doubt. If it worked, DA and Loomis would present themselves as the next Carrs. Then we gave needless offseason and early season extensions to Jordan, Granderson, and Ruiz, all of whom were still under contract and not holding out. This was to reinforce the idea of keeping the band together and winning with continuity.

The first four games of the season were against the titans with a lame duck tannehill, the panthers with a rookie young player in his second game with no oline, a banged up packers with love replacing rodgers, and the bucs newly without brady and expected to be bottom dwellers. I think the idea was that we would go 4-0 or 3-1 in those easy games and after giving Granderson and Ruiz extensions it would be natural to give DA a deal topping Paytons and Loomis something similar for delivering us to the promised land. Instead of the game ball, Gayle would have given them big checks. The roster was managed with this plan in mind too. For example we greatly overcompensated for Kamara’s possible suspension signing a top FA RB and using one of our top draft picks at RB even though it would only effect the first few games. We didnt move on from older and more injury prone players unlikely to last all year, because we only needed them to last 4 games. We didnt worry about adding young depth or keeping a player like Ellis, because we were not playing the long game, and he would not have been on the field much until someone got hurt or slowed down.

The plan went perfect when we started 2-0 and were up on the Packers. Had we beat the Packers and gone to 3-0 with Carr healthy I think DA and Loomis’ new record contracts would have been announced on that Tuesday. But then the wheels fell off the oline, Carr went down with an injury that looked serious, and we lost the next two. But DA and Loomis were so close to their desired $100 million plus contracts that would allow them to really relax all week.
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Old 12-28-2023, 06:40 PM   #13
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by BakoSaint View Post
I think the plan all along was for DA and Loomis to give themselves record extensions this year to match some of the highest paid coaches and GMs in the league and include guaranteed money long term. So, our offseason play was not just to go all in to win now, it was especially focused on that one goal.

Signing Carr was not just seen as a win now move but also a move to reinforce the idea of paying big money for leaders other people doubt. If it worked, DA and Loomis would present themselves as the next Carrs. Then we gave needless offseason and early season extensions to Jordan, Granderson, and Ruiz, all of whom were still under contract and not holding out. This was to reinforce the idea of keeping the band together and winning with continuity.

The first four games of the season were against the titans with a lame duck tannehill, the panthers with a rookie young player in his second game with no oline, a banged up packers with love replacing rodgers, and the bucs newly without brady and expected to be bottom dwellers. I think the idea was that we would go 4-0 or 3-1 in those easy games and after giving Granderson and Ruiz extensions it would be natural to give DA a deal topping Paytons and Loomis something similar for delivering us to the promised land. Instead of the game ball, Gayle would have given them big checks. The roster was managed with this plan in mind too. For example we greatly overcompensated for Kamara’s possible suspension signing a top FA RB and using one of our top draft picks at RB even though it would only effect the first few games. We didnt move on from older and more injury prone players unlikely to last all year, because we only needed them to last 4 games. We didnt worry about adding young depth or keeping a player like Ellis, because we were not playing the long game, and he would not have been on the field much until someone got hurt or slowed down.

The plan went perfect when we started 2-0 and were up on the Packers. Had we beat the Packers and gone to 3-0 with Carr healthy I think DA and Loomis’ new record contracts would have been announced on that Tuesday. But then the wheels fell off the oline, Carr went down with an injury that looked serious, and we lost the next two. But DA and Loomis were so close to their desired $100 million plus contracts that would allow them to really relax all week.
Saw it play out with my own two eyes. Just like that. “But wait! There’s more!”
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Old 12-28-2023, 06:43 PM   #14
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by mapcow View Post
Saints are stuck at their current status for a couple more years, because of front office decisions; signing contracts with has been players and questionable coaches, along with piss poor planning guarantees sequential losing seasons. Thus getting closer to the 2030 deadline; and IMPOSSIBLE to rebuild a contender by then. Oh When the Saints.... go marching out.... Oh when the Saints... Idiots
.....or, maybe this was the plan all along. Kind of like those investment companies that "tombstone" vital businesses, all for the purpose of shutting them down, and collecting a check in the end. Look it up... worked for a company out of New Orleans that practiced this technique. ELANCAP
https://elancap.com/cases.html
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Old 12-28-2023, 06:48 PM   #15
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by mapcow View Post
.....or, maybe this was the plan all along.
Keep shopping for new merch or the tearorists win.
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Old 12-28-2023, 06:50 PM   #16
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by BakoSaint View Post
I think the plan all along was for DA and Loomis to give themselves record extensions this year to match some of the highest paid coaches and GMs in the league and include guaranteed money long term. So, our offseason play was not just to go all in to win now, it was especially focused on that one goal.

Signing Carr was not just seen as a win now move but also a move to reinforce the idea of paying big money for leaders other people doubt. If it worked, DA and Loomis would present themselves as the next Carrs. Then we gave needless offseason and early season extensions to Jordan, Granderson, and Ruiz, all of whom were still under contract and not holding out. This was to reinforce the idea of keeping the band together and winning with continuity.

The first four games of the season were against the titans with a lame duck tannehill, the panthers with a rookie young player in his second game with no oline, a banged up packers with love replacing rodgers, and the bucs newly without brady and expected to be bottom dwellers. I think the idea was that we would go 4-0 or 3-1 in those easy games and after giving Granderson and Ruiz extensions it would be natural to give DA a deal topping Paytons and Loomis something similar for delivering us to the promised land. Instead of the game ball, Gayle would have given them big checks. The roster was managed with this plan in mind too. For example we greatly overcompensated for Kamara’s possible suspension signing a top FA RB and using one of our top draft picks at RB even though it would only effect the first few games. We didnt move on from older and more injury prone players unlikely to last all year, because we only needed them to last 4 games. We didnt worry about adding young depth or keeping a player like Ellis, because we were not playing the long game, and he would not have been on the field much until someone got hurt or slowed down.

The plan went perfect when we started 2-0 and were up on the Packers. Had we beat the Packers and gone to 3-0 with Carr healthy I think DA and Loomis’ new record contracts would have been announced on that Tuesday. But then the wheels fell off the oline, Carr went down with an injury that looked serious, and we lost the next two. But DA and Loomis were so close to their desired $100 million plus contracts that would allow them to really relax all week.
truth hurts
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Old 12-28-2023, 07:04 PM   #17
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Re: What Went Wrong

The gross roster mismanagement is the most concerning thing to me. Some of this falling on Allen but most of it on Loomis:

- "Resting" Jimmy Graham instead of practicing him or involving him into the greater game plan.
- Keeping Penning on the roster when it's clear he's a bust and we need to swallow our pride and cut him.
- Not putting Lattimore or Michael Thomas on IR despite the writing on the wall indicating they were done for their year.
- Whatever the f*** that fling with JPP was.
- Not giving a hobbled Cam Jordan a week off to get right.
- Playing an injured Shaheed and having him hurt himself worse.
- Putting Taysom in the doghouse for seemingly no good reason, other than some possible air-quotes "injury" that isn't showing up on the report. But we all know why. This dysfunctional front office sees him as the reason Carr is getting booed and Taysom getting cheered is getting under their skin.
- Rushing Carr back in to start when he's less than 50%.
- Not working out other kickers or punters unless it's 100% reactive to injury situation.
- Putting Carr up on a pedestal from the get-go and making him a Captain.
- Not letting Baun rush the passer, up until a little bit lately.

This is the crap that kills us before we even get on the field.
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Old 12-28-2023, 07:20 PM   #18
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by neugey View Post
The gross roster mismanagement is the most concerning thing to me. Some of this falling on Allen but most of it on Loomis:

- "Resting" Jimmy Graham instead of practicing him or involving him into the greater game plan.
- Keeping Penning on the roster when it's clear he's a bust and we need to swallow our pride and cut him.
- Not putting Lattimore or Michael Thomas on IR despite the writing on the wall indicating they were done for their year.
- Whatever the f*** that fling with JPP was.
- Not giving a hobbled Cam Jordan a week off to get right.
- Playing an injured Shaheed and having him hurt himself worse.
- Putting Taysom in the doghouse for seemingly no good reason, other than some possible air-quotes "injury" that isn't showing up on the report. But we all know why. This dysfunctional front office sees him as the reason Carr is getting booed and Taysom getting cheered is getting under their skin.
- Rushing Carr back in to start when he's less than 50%.
- Not working out other kickers or punters unless it's 100% reactive to injury situation.
- Putting Carr up on a pedestal from the get-go and making him a Captain.
- Not letting Baun rush the passer, up until a little bit lately.

This is the crap that kills us before we even get on the field.
Salient points, well articulated.
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Old 12-28-2023, 07:22 PM   #19
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by neugey View Post
The gross roster mismanagement is the most concerning thing to me. Some of this falling on Allen but most of it on Loomis:

- "Resting" Jimmy Graham instead of practicing him or involving him into the greater game plan.
- Keeping Penning on the roster when it's clear he's a bust and we need to swallow our pride and cut him.
- Not putting Lattimore or Michael Thomas on IR despite the writing on the wall indicating they were done for their year.
- Whatever the f*** that fling with JPP was.
- Not giving a hobbled Cam Jordan a week off to get right.
- Playing an injured Shaheed and having him hurt himself worse.
- Putting Taysom in the doghouse for seemingly no good reason, other than some possible air-quotes "injury" that isn't showing up on the report. But we all know why. This dysfunctional front office sees him as the reason Carr is getting booed and Taysom getting cheered is getting under their skin.
- Rushing Carr back in to start when he's less than 50%.
- Not working out other kickers or punters unless it's 100% reactive to injury situation.
- Putting Carr up on a pedestal from the get-go and making him a Captain.
- Not letting Baun rush the passer, up until a little bit lately.

This is the crap that kills us before we even get on the field.
Briefly,

We carried four TE's on the roster. With Juwan (how do you sit him), Moreau (our best blocker at the position), and Taysom (another must active). Graham had been the odd man out. Got in with injuries to the others.

Penning is basically in the same position as Ruiz in his development.

The JPP "fling" was a cheap temp practice squad backup. He hasn't played a meaningful snap elsewhere since.

I could address others, but those were the most glaring and I have supper on the stove.

I agree with some of the others, for sure.
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Old 12-28-2023, 07:26 PM   #20
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Re: What Went Wrong

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido View Post
Briefly,

We carried four TE's on the roster. With Juwan (how do you sit him), Moreau (our best blocker at the position), and Taysom (another must active). Graham had been the odd man out. Got in with injuries to the others.

Penning is basically in the same position as Ruiz in his development.

The JPP "fling" was a cheap temp practice squad backup. He hasn't played a meaningful snap elsewhere since.

I could address others, but those were the most glaring and I have supper on the stove.

I agree with some of the others, for sure.

Translation: we still suck.
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