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-   -   What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season (https://blackandgold.com/saints/103841-what-im-realistically-looking-season.html)

SmashMouth 05-21-2024 06:56 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 996166)
This ^^^

I don't think many realize how great of an affect a competent offensive design and execution can have on a team's success. Pete Carmichael sucked. He hogtied everyone on the offense with his failures in design and playcalling. Just a single score per game we would have walked away with the division.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinner (Post 996167)
Woulda Coulda Shoulda… Where have we heard that before? This time next year, you’ll be saying it again, and we might be thinking about a new HEAD COACH (imagine that, as if it makes a difference, because it does) as we enter into yet another year of redevelopment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BakoSaint (Post 996168)
I don't think many realize how great of an affect a competent offensive line can have on a team's success. And ours relies on Penning and features zero tackles who have the combination of a previous successful NFL season and cartilage between the bones in their knees and a starting guard named 'TBD scheme will make up for it' playing next to one of those tackles.

Sometimes a competent offensive scheme cannot be executed without a competent offensive line, and attempts to compensate for incompetent offensive linemen wreck the scheme because nobody can focus on anything but extra blocking assignments to cover for ole ferdinand the bull at left tackle.

It's not just Kubiak. It's Benton as OL coach. Didn't really research his track record. The bio the Saints put out suggests an improvement over the previous year. So we'll see. BTW, why did the Saints publish a picture of him in another team's colors?

AsylumGuido 05-21-2024 09:41 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BakoSaint (Post 996168)
I don't think many realize how great of an affect a competent offensive line can have on a team's success. And ours relies on Penning and features zero tackles who have the combination of a previous successful NFL season and cartilage between the bones in their knees and a starting guard named 'TBD scheme will make up for it' playing next to one of those tackles.

Sometimes a competent offensive scheme cannot be executed without a competent offensive line, and attempts to compensate for incompetent offensive linemen wreck the scheme because nobody can focus on anything but extra blocking assignments to cover for ole ferdinand the bull at left tackle.

Tell me, Bako, exactly how many snaps have you seen our current offensive linemen take this season with another year of development and work with what should be a far superior offensive coaching staff, more than one of which have a great reputation of developing offensive linemen? Zero? Yup. That's right. Zero.

:rolleyes:

AsylumGuido 05-21-2024 09:46 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SmashMouth (Post 996171)
It's not just Kubiak. It's Benton as OL coach. Didn't really research his track record. The bio the Saints put out suggests an improvement over the previous year. So we'll see. BTW, why did the Saints publish a picture of him in another team's colors?

Exactly, Smash. Last year was last year and anything offensively speaking was tainted by Carmichael and staff's incompetence. Kubiak is only one piece of the additions made to the coaching staff. To ignore the greatly needed additions to the rest of the staff is extremely shortsighted.

Sinner 05-21-2024 10:20 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 996177)
Exactly, Smash. Last year was last year and anything offensively speaking was tainted by Carmichael and staff's incompetence. Kubiak is only one piece of the additions made to the coaching staff. To ignore the greatly needed additions to the rest of the staff is extremely shortsighted.

The excuses that you are going to make for Kubiak and the mess that we will be making by trying to organize these pieces and fit them together under Dennis Allen as Head Coach (while on his long overdue way out) and Derek Carr (QB in decline in slow motion) are going to be beyond shortsighted, but I am certain that they will be painfully long-winded. There will be prolonged pain.

BakoSaint 05-21-2024 08:23 PM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 996176)
Tell me, Bako, exactly how many snaps have you seen our current offensive linemen take this season with another year of development and work with what should be a far superior offensive coaching staff, more than one of which have a great reputation of developing offensive linemen? Zero? Yup. That's right. Zero.

:rolleyes:

How silly of me to think that the players who actually take the field and how they looked in the most recent games they actually played matters. Obviously the Carolina Panthers will go 20-0 and win the Super Bowl because I have seen exactly 'zero yup thats right zero' snaps of their players 'this season with another year of development and work with what should be a far superior coaches staff, more than one of which have a great reputation.' Clearly if Dave Canales could get a washed up Baker Mayfield to the playoffs, he will be able to instantly fix all the problems with Bryce Young and turn Diontae Johnson and Adam Thielen into Mike Evans and Chris Godwin. Clearly will all the years he spent in Seattle, Canales will instantly turn the Panthers defense into a reincarnation of the Legion of Boom. If we just ignore all the previous performance of every player on their roster and focus on positives in their assistant coaching staffs biographies even if those positives really only amount to a fairly similar playoff outcome than prior years before they joined the team, there is nobody the Panthers can't beat.

Heck, one could argue the Panthers could even beat us, holding the Saints to 17-3 with our only 3 losses coming to the Panthers. Because honestly if you look at 2023 the Bucs did a lot better than expected with Canales as an offensive coach, they were not expected to succeed with Mayfield and were supposed to be last in the division after losing Brady. Meanwhile you cannot say the same for Kubiak. The 49ers played in the NFC Championship in the 2022 season before he arrived, and were only eliminated due to a QB injury in that championship game. Then the next year they did not have a QB injury, did go the Superbowl, and lost. The Bucs performed much better than expectations in 2023, the 49ers were pretty well within expectations as a favorite to be in the NFC Championship game, and achieving the median outcome of winning it but losing the next game.

Essentially your argument is that Kubiak is a miracle worker. We can go into the season minus three starting oline, replace one with an unproven rookie and the other two with minimum salary camp bodies, and we are going to dramatically improve. The problem is that argument could be used for any team with any coaching change. And I don't see the miracles on Kubiak's resume. Were the 2023 49ers way better then expected? They had a very similar season to 2022. Were the 2022 Broncos great? No, they were worse than expected. Did the Vikings ever win their division during Kubiak's 3 years there? No. They finished 2nd or 3rd and manages one wildcard win in 3 years with an expensive QB, similar to their track record before and after Kubiak.

I am not saying Klint Kubiak will not be a good coach. He may or may not be. But he is not god. He has not engineered a massive improvement anywhere he has been. He is not so amazingly unrivaled in his talent that we could line up a bunch of camp bodies on oline and break records with offense. He is human. Its reasonable to expect that our offensive line will be a considerable weakness based on the past performance of our players and the lack of any experienced healthy Tackle on the roster and the lack of a mobile QB.

Sinner 05-22-2024 10:53 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BakoSaint (Post 996203)
How silly of me to think that the players who actually take the field and how they looked in the most recent games they actually played matters. Obviously the Carolina Panthers will go 20-0 and win the Super Bowl because I have seen exactly 'zero yup thats right zero' snaps of their players 'this season with another year of development and work with what should be a far superior coaches staff, more than one of which have a great reputation.' Clearly if Dave Canales could get a washed up Baker Mayfield to the playoffs, he will be able to instantly fix all the problems with Bryce Young and turn Diontae Johnson and Adam Thielen into Mike Evans and Chris Godwin. Clearly will all the years he spent in Seattle, Canales will instantly turn the Panthers defense into a reincarnation of the Legion of Boom. If we just ignore all the previous performance of every player on their roster and focus on positives in their assistant coaching staffs biographies even if those positives really only amount to a fairly similar playoff outcome than prior years before they joined the team, there is nobody the Panthers can't beat.

Heck, one could argue the Panthers could even beat us, holding the Saints to 17-3 with our only 3 losses coming to the Panthers. Because honestly if you look at 2023 the Bucs did a lot better than expected with Canales as an offensive coach, they were not expected to succeed with Mayfield and were supposed to be last in the division after losing Brady. Meanwhile you cannot say the same for Kubiak. The 49ers played in the NFC Championship in the 2022 season before he arrived, and were only eliminated due to a QB injury in that championship game. Then the next year they did not have a QB injury, did go the Superbowl, and lost. The Bucs performed much better than expectations in 2023, the 49ers were pretty well within expectations as a favorite to be in the NFC Championship game, and achieving the median outcome of winning it but losing the next game.

Essentially your argument is that Kubiak is a miracle worker. We can go into the season minus three starting oline, replace one with an unproven rookie and the other two with minimum salary camp bodies, and we are going to dramatically improve. The problem is that argument could be used for any team with any coaching change. And I don't see the miracles on Kubiak's resume. Were the 2023 49ers way better then expected? They had a very similar season to 2022. Were the 2022 Broncos great? No, they were worse than expected. Did the Vikings ever win their division during Kubiak's 3 years there? No. They finished 2nd or 3rd and manages one wildcard win in 3 years with an expensive QB, similar to their track record before and after Kubiak.

I am not saying Klint Kubiak will not be a good coach. He may or may not be. But he is not god. He has not engineered a massive improvement anywhere he has been. He is not so amazingly unrivaled in his talent that we could line up a bunch of camp bodies on oline and break records with offense. He is human. Its reasonable to expect that our offensive line will be a considerable weakness based on the past performance of our players and the lack of any experienced healthy Tackle on the roster and the lack of a mobile QB.


There’s just something about ^^^ REALISM… It hurts almost as much as idealism when the morphine wears off.

saintsfan1976 05-22-2024 11:18 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Just saw the interview with Benton.

I'm a believer in their approach. I like his take on "starting fresh" with Penning, how each of the lineman have the tools to execute their vision and the philosophy of "getting to a spot" or "beating their man to a spot".

It feels like things are simplified, play to their strengths and keep the defensive line on their heels.

More optimism baby!!

AsylumGuido 05-22-2024 11:24 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 (Post 996218)
Just saw the interview with Benton.

I'm a believer in their approach. I like his take on "starting fresh" with Penning, how each of the lineman have the tools to execute their vision and the philosophy of "getting to a spot" or "beating their man to a spot".

It feels like things are simplified, play to their strengths and keep the defensive line on their heels.

More optimism baby!!

Novel approach around here. :D

AsylumGuido 05-22-2024 11:26 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BakoSaint (Post 996203)
How silly of me to think that the players who actually take the field and how they looked in the most recent games they actually played matters. Obviously the Carolina Panthers will go 20-0 and win the Super Bowl because I have seen exactly 'zero yup thats right zero' snaps of their players 'this season with another year of development and work with what should be a far superior coaches staff, more than one of which have a great reputation.' Clearly if Dave Canales could get a washed up Baker Mayfield to the playoffs, he will be able to instantly fix all the problems with Bryce Young and turn Diontae Johnson and Adam Thielen into Mike Evans and Chris Godwin. Clearly will all the years he spent in Seattle, Canales will instantly turn the Panthers defense into a reincarnation of the Legion of Boom. If we just ignore all the previous performance of every player on their roster and focus on positives in their assistant coaching staffs biographies even if those positives really only amount to a fairly similar playoff outcome than prior years before they joined the team, there is nobody the Panthers can't beat.

Heck, one could argue the Panthers could even beat us, holding the Saints to 17-3 with our only 3 losses coming to the Panthers. Because honestly if you look at 2023 the Bucs did a lot better than expected with Canales as an offensive coach, they were not expected to succeed with Mayfield and were supposed to be last in the division after losing Brady. Meanwhile you cannot say the same for Kubiak. The 49ers played in the NFC Championship in the 2022 season before he arrived, and were only eliminated due to a QB injury in that championship game. Then the next year they did not have a QB injury, did go the Superbowl, and lost. The Bucs performed much better than expectations in 2023, the 49ers were pretty well within expectations as a favorite to be in the NFC Championship game, and achieving the median outcome of winning it but losing the next game.

Essentially your argument is that Kubiak is a miracle worker. We can go into the season minus three starting oline, replace one with an unproven rookie and the other two with minimum salary camp bodies, and we are going to dramatically improve. The problem is that argument could be used for any team with any coaching change. And I don't see the miracles on Kubiak's resume. Were the 2023 49ers way better then expected? They had a very similar season to 2022. Were the 2022 Broncos great? No, they were worse than expected. Did the Vikings ever win their division during Kubiak's 3 years there? No. They finished 2nd or 3rd and manages one wildcard win in 3 years with an expensive QB, similar to their track record before and after Kubiak.

I am not saying Klint Kubiak will not be a good coach. He may or may not be. But he is not god. He has not engineered a massive improvement anywhere he has been. He is not so amazingly unrivaled in his talent that we could line up a bunch of camp bodies on oline and break records with offense. He is human. Its reasonable to expect that our offensive line will be a considerable weakness based on the past performance of our players and the lack of any experienced healthy Tackle on the roster and the lack of a mobile QB.

https://www.shermanparty.com/v/vspfi...s/WP1309-2.jpg

;)

mapcow 05-22-2024 11:33 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by iceshack149 (Post 996142)
I wish you wouldn't attack posters like that. I miss having spkb25 and other people around here. That's likely due to these petty attacks.

once an ass.... always an ass_whole. Queerdo is just like dat.:beatnik:

mapcow 05-22-2024 11:34 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 996143)
spkb25, if you haven't noticed over the years, has made it a point to attack me and the Saints as a team. I miss many others that have left for various reasons, but not this troll. Not one bit. He crossed the line when he boasted here about making fun of his Special Ed students and excused it because he said they thought it was fun. I'll never forget that. It was sick. It still turns my stomach.

All he's done since is tell us how much he thinks OUR team sucks. Check his signature. He disowned the Saints, if he was ever a fan to begin with, which I have never seen any indication of being the case.

wah wah...... child

mapcow 05-22-2024 11:35 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 996146)
Honestly, ice, it's my fault for not having blocked the jerk like a couple of others that have nothing to contribute to the site.

My bad. Sorry!

*****...cat:beatnik:

saintsfan1976 05-22-2024 12:14 PM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 996219)
Novel approach around here. :D

Not really.

AsylumGuido 05-23-2024 11:34 AM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 


Sinner 05-23-2024 03:45 PM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
“Derek Carr is a good QB and ISN’T GOING ANYWHERE…”
and that right there, in addition to Dennis Allen, is why WE AINT GOING ANYWHERE either.

Sinner 05-23-2024 04:12 PM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 996220)

The glasses AINT necessary when the product speaks for itself.

Rugby Saint II 06-03-2024 12:17 PM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
I'm expecting a slow start with the change in offensive strategy and the usual slow start to the season we see every year. Maybe we can get a fire lit under these boys and they'll come out of the gate leading the pack. If we steal a couple of wins early on we could surprise a lot of nay sayers.

Sinner 06-03-2024 02:12 PM

Re: What I'm Realistically Looking For This Season
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II (Post 996687)
I'm expecting a slow start with the change in offensive strategy and the usual slow start to the season we see every year. Maybe we can get a fire lit under these boys and they'll come out of the gate leading the pack. If we steal a couple of wins early on we could surprise a lot of nay sayers.

I wouldn’t be surprised if we end up doing all the typical impossible improbable mathematical calculations about what all the other teams will have to do or not do, in order for us to woulda shoulda coulda make the playoffs. And then we can talk about the prolonged pain and progress of our indefinite “rebuilding” process leading up to 2030…


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