5 questions

4saintspirit · 12-01-2005, 04:43 PM

Originally Posted by papz

1. With all the losing and adversity the Saints have been going through this year, unless Bentley is franchised, do you think he will want to resign with us?

2. Was that 8 plus million dollar one year rental of Darren Howard worth it and will he be here next year? If no, who deserves the bulk of the blame if he leaves and we get nothing in compensation?

3. Is this the final year we see Gandy in a Saints uniform or do we try to convert him into a guard?

4. Do we resign Grant to a long term extension after his disappointing season knowing that Howard will not be here next year? Also, do you believe that he will rebound and regain his 2004 form if he does sign an extension?

5. A lot of people in here was pushing for the Mayberry signing this offseason... do you regret it?

1. Resign Bentley --- but if he wants to leave so be it -- lots of top centers in the draft
2 & 4 lumped together === Keep either Howard or Grant and get rid of the other one. Team whomever with Will Smith
3. Gandy has gotten way too much heat -- he is starting material -- and if you look at the lasty 2 games I think you will see the O-line starting to jell.
5. I do not regret mayberry. Lets wait and see until the end of the season. It takes time for an line to jell and play together -- and remember we have 2 new starters.

FrenzyFan · 12-01-2005, 04:51 PM

Originally Posted by papz

1. With all the losing and adversity the Saints have been going through this year, unless Bentley is franchised, do you think he will want to resign with us??

I've been disappointed in Bentley all year. We get an awful lot of rush up the middle. If he'll re-sign for a moderate payday, I would keep him. If he asks for a lot, I would get rid of him. Hasn't impressed me since he was a guard.

Originally Posted by papz

2. Was that 8 plus million dollar one year rental of Darren Howard worth it and will he be here next year? If no, who deserves the bulk of the blame if he leaves and we get nothing in compensation?

I've always liked DH, but I've been extremely disappointed in our pass rush this year. In my heart of hearts, what I want to believe is that Venturi and the D-Line coach (can't remember his name) is limiting our players. I don't know how they go from being so productive to so seemingly worthless, pretty much across the board. Were it a reduction in a single player, I I fault the player. When I see a reduction in a group of players, who all play roughly the same spot - then it's something else. D-line coach, perhaps?

Originally Posted by papz

3. Is this the final year we see Gandy in a Saints uniform or do we try to convert him into a guard?

Though he really is not much of a LT, he is a great locker room leader. Since we have so few, I would like to see him stay on the team - perhaps as a backup or move him inside? He still seems to be strong enough and has decent technique, just is slow.

Originally Posted by papz

4. Do we resign Grant to a long term extension after his disappointing season knowing that Howard will not be here next year? Also, do you believe that he will rebound and regain his 2004 form if he does sign an extension?

Re-sign him. See above for my thoughts on Defensive coaching and it's effect on this D-Line.

Originally Posted by papz

5. A lot of people in here was pushing for the Mayberry signing this offseason... do you regret it?

I was really high on Mayberry... but this kind of thing seems to happen to us often. (i.e. Dale Carter, our famous thieving WR, etc.) Regret, regret, regret....

As an answer to 6. (Do we keep Venturi?) - I would say fire Venturi and the D-Line coach.

TheDeuce · 12-01-2005, 06:15 PM

Why are people so down on Mayberry? I still think he was a good pick-up, and can be a good player for this team in the future. Maybe he's just having a bad year, having a hard time adjusting to the nomadic Saints' ways, or plenty of other reasons. I think it's way too early to give up on him after he was so good in Philadelphia...

WhoDat · 12-01-2005, 07:18 PM

Awesome questions:

1. I hope that the Saints do whatever it takes to sign Bentley. The center is the QB of the line. Success starts up front and in the middle of the line. Bentley is one of the best centers in the league - we've gotta make sure that he gets what he wants and comes back.

2. We weren't spending it on anything else were we? Yes - Howard is still the best DE we've got, but Smith is quickly becoming a freak. I'd like to see the Saints keep Howard and Smith personally - give Howard the money we're going to have to pay Grant.

3. God I hope so. Gandy was poo when we got him, now he's mushy poo.

4. I'd like to keep Howard and Smith, but if Howard chooses to go or is too expensive, then yes, we've gotta resign Grant.

5. Yep. Holland is better now than Mayberry.

ScottyRo · 12-01-2005, 10:55 PM

Originally Posted by papz

1. With all the losing and adversity the Saints have been going through this year, unless Bentley is franchised, do you think he will want to resign with us?

I'm still not sold on Bentley as a center. He was a great guard. If he can't be a great center, move him back and get at least a good center. (I'm not saying he's not a good center, but we can find someone else who is easily enough). I'd like to keep him either way, but finances are starting to get tight.

Originally Posted by papz

2. Was that 8 plus million dollar one year rental of Darren Howard worth it and will he be here next year? If no, who deserves the bulk of the blame if he leaves and we get nothing in compensation?

No. Not worth it by about 5 mil, but we had no choice. Trading him would be the best thing that could happen at this point considering the contract. I'll take a second rounder.

Originally Posted by papz

3. Is this the final year we see Gandy in a Saints uniform or do we try to convert him into a guard?

Gandy was a disappointment in his first year with the Saints. His reputation kept him from getting called for holding as often as he was actually holding. That's probably still true now, but he's actually holding a lot more now and he's getting called for it more often as well. Don't bother moving him. Just cut him. As far as him being our best option...that's only because the FO didn't get us a better option -which there were plenty of in 2005 FA.

Originally Posted by papz

4. Do we resign Grant to a long term extension after his disappointing season knowing that Howard will not be here next year? Also, do you believe that he will rebound and regain his 2004 form if he does sign an extension?

He's solid even if underacieving. Really depends on the $$$. I'd prefer Grant and Smith over Howard and Smith.

Originally Posted by papz

5. A lot of people in here was pushing for the Mayberry signing this offseason... do you regret it?

I'm starting to. I think the FO signed him to be out RT and got a break in the draft. They then acted like that was the plan all along. When will we quit signing over-the-hill FA lineman (see Gandy) from teams that really don't fight to keep them? Holland and Jacox were a couple of decent G's last year and were a lot less expensive. Benson might as well save the dough if we can get the same level of play for less.

My own question: 6. Why cut Horn?
Pretty much the same reason as 5. Is Horn's production this year really worth the big $$$ he's getting. I just believe that Stallworth and Henderson and a decent FA pickup for a 3rd WR (not Hakim, in other words) could have been just as productive and much less costly.

BlackandBlue · 12-01-2005, 11:14 PM

Thanks for the four straight pro-bowls, Joe, here's your pinkslip.

Scotty, I'm suprised at you. Stallworth is not there yet, bro.

papz · 12-01-2005, 11:18 PM

Cutting Horn... hmm I was considering putting that in my set of questions tomorrow. Since you brought it up, we might as well do it here.

I would have do disagree with it. Although Stallworth has improved, he isn't ready to take over the lead role. If we can remember, I debated all offseason long that he's ready to breakout and take that position from Horn. I'm wrong. Maybe it's the system or maybe it's just him... he needs to be more consistent in order to fill that role of go to guy on this team. Horn isn't over the hill and his salary is justified because he is considered one of the top recievers in the game. Devery is certainly getting better but he's not even a consistent or reliable 3rd option as of right now. But with the strides he's making, I wouldn't count against that he'll be even better next year and proving me wrong.

saintswhodi · 12-02-2005, 12:31 AM

Did Joe make the last 4 straight pro bowls? I thought there was a gap in there somewhere. Yeah, he didn't go in 2003. Ha BNB!! :P

Anyway, I was all for trading Horn to Detroit last year and drafting Mike Williams or something. Can't really say how that would have turned out as Mike has been healthy all year, but has had a terrible QB. Sound familiar? Even when Joe was healthy, like in the Minny game, he only had one catch. And remember how we used to talk about him playing through injuries? I had a feeling that would change when he got his money. Joe was always banged up, but he didn't have that new contract cushion. Now he does. It kinda sucks we weren't able to do more in his great years. I think personally it's all downhill from here, and I have no problem going with Stall, Devery, and Az full time. With some Chase Lyman hey papz? lol I also keep seeing Roydell perform for Tennessee, and get even more pissed. But anyway, we gave Joe the new deal, so he ain't going nowhere. So he will be what he is, an aging vet on a sub-par team. I don't know that we can cut him. So he'll be here. I just am not expecting much any more.

papz · 12-02-2005, 12:41 AM

Does anyone know what kind of cap hit we'll take if we cut Joe? Isn't Joe WhoDat's boy? I'm pretty sure he'll have something good to say on this if he reads it.

I believed in Chase when we drafted him and I still do. If, a big if, he's healthy, he'll make an impact on this team in some way, shape, or form... whether it's catching passes, returning kicks, or passing out gatorade bottles dammit. :P Remember I admitted that we drafted him too early, but I don't regret not drafting him at all. He's a talent and so is Roydell whom I agree we should have tried to get. You would think him being from New Orleans, we would have had the best chance at evaluating his talent. Oh well that's the Saints for ya.

Tobias-Reiper · 12-02-2005, 08:01 AM

Originally Posted by BlackandBlue

I'd rather give it to Howard and let him wipe his ass with it.

.. What generosity

.. "Giver", is what comes to mind...

12-01-2005, 04:43 PM	#11
4saintspirit 500th Post Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 690	Re: 5 questions Originally Posted by papz 1. With all the losing and adversity the Saints have been going through this year, unless Bentley is franchised, do you think he will want to resign with us? 2. Was that 8 plus million dollar one year rental of Darren Howard worth it and will he be here next year? If no, who deserves the bulk of the blame if he leaves and we get nothing in compensation? 3. Is this the final year we see Gandy in a Saints uniform or do we try to convert him into a guard? 4. Do we resign Grant to a long term extension after his disappointing season knowing that Howard will not be here next year? Also, do you believe that he will rebound and regain his 2004 form if he does sign an extension? 5. A lot of people in here was pushing for the Mayberry signing this offseason... do you regret it? 1. Resign Bentley --- but if he wants to leave so be it -- lots of top centers in the draft 2 & 4 lumped together === Keep either Howard or Grant and get rid of the other one. Team whomever with Will Smith 3. Gandy has gotten way too much heat -- he is starting material -- and if you look at the lasty 2 games I think you will see the O-line starting to jell. 5. I do not regret mayberry. Lets wait and see until the end of the season. It takes time for an line to jell and play together -- and remember we have 2 new starters.
4saintspirit 500th Post Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 690

12-01-2005, 04:51 PM	#12
FrenzyFan 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 406	Re: 5 questions Originally Posted by papz 1. With all the losing and adversity the Saints have been going through this year, unless Bentley is franchised, do you think he will want to resign with us?? I've been disappointed in Bentley all year. We get an awful lot of rush up the middle. If he'll re-sign for a moderate payday, I would keep him. If he asks for a lot, I would get rid of him. Hasn't impressed me since he was a guard. Originally Posted by papz 2. Was that 8 plus million dollar one year rental of Darren Howard worth it and will he be here next year? If no, who deserves the bulk of the blame if he leaves and we get nothing in compensation? I've always liked DH, but I've been extremely disappointed in our pass rush this year. In my heart of hearts, what I want to believe is that Venturi and the D-Line coach (can't remember his name) is limiting our players. I don't know how they go from being so productive to so seemingly worthless, pretty much across the board. Were it a reduction in a single player, I I fault the player. When I see a reduction in a group of players, who all play roughly the same spot - then it's something else. D-line coach, perhaps? Originally Posted by papz 3. Is this the final year we see Gandy in a Saints uniform or do we try to convert him into a guard? Though he really is not much of a LT, he is a great locker room leader. Since we have so few, I would like to see him stay on the team - perhaps as a backup or move him inside? He still seems to be strong enough and has decent technique, just is slow. Originally Posted by papz 4. Do we resign Grant to a long term extension after his disappointing season knowing that Howard will not be here next year? Also, do you believe that he will rebound and regain his 2004 form if he does sign an extension? Re-sign him. See above for my thoughts on Defensive coaching and it's effect on this D-Line. Originally Posted by papz 5. A lot of people in here was pushing for the Mayberry signing this offseason... do you regret it? I was really high on Mayberry... but this kind of thing seems to happen to us often. (i.e. Dale Carter, our famous thieving WR, etc.) Regret, regret, regret.... As an answer to 6. (Do we keep Venturi?) - I would say fire Venturi and the D-Line coach.
FrenzyFan 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 406	\"The AB brand of TP will hurt your O-ring.\" - BlackandBlue http://www.darrylbercegeay.com/wsmith1.jpg

12-01-2005, 06:15 PM	#13
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928	RE: Re: 5 questions Why are people so down on Mayberry? I still think he was a good pick-up, and can be a good player for this team in the future. Maybe he's just having a bad year, having a hard time adjusting to the nomadic Saints' ways, or plenty of other reasons. I think it's way too early to give up on him after he was so good in Philadelphia...
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928

12-01-2005, 07:18 PM	#14
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	RE: Re: 5 questions Awesome questions: 1. I hope that the Saints do whatever it takes to sign Bentley. The center is the QB of the line. Success starts up front and in the middle of the line. Bentley is one of the best centers in the league - we've gotta make sure that he gets what he wants and comes back. 2. We weren't spending it on anything else were we? Yes - Howard is still the best DE we've got, but Smith is quickly becoming a freak. I'd like to see the Saints keep Howard and Smith personally - give Howard the money we're going to have to pay Grant. 3. God I hope so. Gandy was poo when we got him, now he's mushy poo. 4. I'd like to keep Howard and Smith, but if Howard chooses to go or is too expensive, then yes, we've gotta resign Grant. 5. Yep. Holland is better now than Mayberry.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

12-01-2005, 10:55 PM	#15
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	Re: 5 questions Originally Posted by papz 1. With all the losing and adversity the Saints have been going through this year, unless Bentley is franchised, do you think he will want to resign with us? I'm still not sold on Bentley as a center. He was a great guard. If he can't be a great center, move him back and get at least a good center. (I'm not saying he's not a good center, but we can find someone else who is easily enough). I'd like to keep him either way, but finances are starting to get tight. Originally Posted by papz 2. Was that 8 plus million dollar one year rental of Darren Howard worth it and will he be here next year? If no, who deserves the bulk of the blame if he leaves and we get nothing in compensation? No. Not worth it by about 5 mil, but we had no choice. Trading him would be the best thing that could happen at this point considering the contract. I'll take a second rounder. Originally Posted by papz 3. Is this the final year we see Gandy in a Saints uniform or do we try to convert him into a guard? Gandy was a disappointment in his first year with the Saints. His reputation kept him from getting called for holding as often as he was actually holding. That's probably still true now, but he's actually holding a lot more now and he's getting called for it more often as well. Don't bother moving him. Just cut him. As far as him being our best option...that's only because the FO didn't get us a better option -which there were plenty of in 2005 FA. Originally Posted by papz 4. Do we resign Grant to a long term extension after his disappointing season knowing that Howard will not be here next year? Also, do you believe that he will rebound and regain his 2004 form if he does sign an extension? He's solid even if underacieving. Really depends on the $$$. I'd prefer Grant and Smith over Howard and Smith. Originally Posted by papz 5. A lot of people in here was pushing for the Mayberry signing this offseason... do you regret it? I'm starting to. I think the FO signed him to be out RT and got a break in the draft. They then acted like that was the plan all along. When will we quit signing over-the-hill FA lineman (see Gandy) from teams that really don't fight to keep them? Holland and Jacox were a couple of decent G's last year and were a lot less expensive. Benson might as well save the dough if we can get the same level of play for less. My own question: 6. Why cut Horn? Pretty much the same reason as 5. Is Horn's production this year really worth the big $$$ he's getting. I just believe that Stallworth and Henderson and a decent FA pickup for a 3rd WR (not Hakim, in other words) could have been just as productive and much less costly.

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12-01-2005, 11:14 PM	#16
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	RE: Re: 5 questions Thanks for the four straight pro-bowls, Joe, here's your pinkslip. Scotty, I'm suprised at you. Stallworth is not there yet, bro.

12-01-2005, 11:18 PM	#17
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,744	RE: Re: 5 questions Cutting Horn... hmm I was considering putting that in my set of questions tomorrow. Since you brought it up, we might as well do it here. I would have do disagree with it. Although Stallworth has improved, he isn't ready to take over the lead role. If we can remember, I debated all offseason long that he's ready to breakout and take that position from Horn. I'm wrong. Maybe it's the system or maybe it's just him... he needs to be more consistent in order to fill that role of go to guy on this team. Horn isn't over the hill and his salary is justified because he is considered one of the top recievers in the game. Devery is certainly getting better but he's not even a consistent or reliable 3rd option as of right now. But with the strides he's making, I wouldn't count against that he'll be even better next year and proving me wrong.

12-02-2005, 12:31 AM	#18
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Did Joe make the last 4 straight pro bowls? I thought there was a gap in there somewhere. Yeah, he didn't go in 2003. Ha BNB!! :P Anyway, I was all for trading Horn to Detroit last year and drafting Mike Williams or something. Can't really say how that would have turned out as Mike has been healthy all year, but has had a terrible QB. Sound familiar? Even when Joe was healthy, like in the Minny game, he only had one catch. And remember how we used to talk about him playing through injuries? I had a feeling that would change when he got his money. Joe was always banged up, but he didn't have that new contract cushion. Now he does. It kinda sucks we weren't able to do more in his great years. I think personally it's all downhill from here, and I have no problem going with Stall, Devery, and Az full time. With some Chase Lyman hey papz? lol I also keep seeing Roydell perform for Tennessee, and get even more pissed. But anyway, we gave Joe the new deal, so he ain't going nowhere. So he will be what he is, an aging vet on a sub-par team. I don't know that we can cut him. So he'll be here. I just am not expecting much any more.

12-02-2005, 12:41 AM	#19
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,744	Does anyone know what kind of cap hit we'll take if we cut Joe? Isn't Joe WhoDat's boy? I'm pretty sure he'll have something good to say on this if he reads it. I believed in Chase when we drafted him and I still do. If, a big if, he's healthy, he'll make an impact on this team in some way, shape, or form... whether it's catching passes, returning kicks, or passing out gatorade bottles dammit. :P Remember I admitted that we drafted him too early, but I don't regret not drafting him at all. He's a talent and so is Roydell whom I agree we should have tried to get. You would think him being from New Orleans, we would have had the best chance at evaluating his talent. Oh well that's the Saints for ya.

12-02-2005, 08:01 AM	#20
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Originally Posted by BlackandBlue I'd rather give it to Howard and let him wipe his ass with it. .. What generosity .. "Giver", is what comes to mind...