So because Matt Leinart has talent, he should be punished? Is that what you're saying?

um hey win elway ran for over 300 yards once in his career. um that wouldn't be a running qb would it?

sorry it didn't post

no, you never saw me say that. his numbers have to be questioned though. simply because he won't be in the same situation of having the best talent around him like in college. how is he gonna look going from the 1980 49'ers to the 1990 bengals? passer rating goes to chit, td's etc.

Both were pass first QBs, unlike say Vick or VY. Nice try.

win what is your answer to that on elway

Win, I don't know if you know this, but the best talent at the college level goes to the NFL. So any NFL team right now, including the Texans, Saints, or Titans, has more talent than USC ever did. Leinart will have more talent.

dude, by you saying that makes me question anything you ever posted are will. anybody who watched those guys play, listen to them talk even today knows differently.

Passing | Rushing |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| Year TM | G | Comp Att PCT YD Y/A TD INT | Att Yards TD |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| 1983 den | 11 | 123 259 47.5 1663 6.4 7 14 | 28 146 1 |
| 1984 den | 15 | 214 380 56.3 2598 6.8 18 15 | 56 237 1 |
| 1985 den | 16 | 327 605 54.0 3891 6.4 22 23 | 51 253 0 |
| 1986 den | 16 | 280 504 55.6 3485 6.9 19 13 | 52 257 1 |
| 1987 den | 12 | 224 410 54.6 3198 7.8 19 12 | 66 304 4 |
| 1988 den | 15 | 274 496 55.2 3309 6.7 17 19 | 54 234 1 |
| 1989 den | 15 | 223 416 53.6 3051 7.3 18 18 | 48 244 3 |
| 1990 den | 16 | 294 502 58.6 3526 7.0 15 14 | 50 258 3 |
| 1991 den | 16 | 242 451 53.7 3253 7.2 13 12 | 55 255 6 |
| 1992 den | 12 | 174 316 55.1 2242 7.1 10 17 | 34 94 2 |
| 1993 den | 16 | 348 551 63.2 4030 7.3 25 10 | 44 153 0 |
| 1994 den | 14 | 307 494 62.1 3490 7.1 16 10 | 58 235 4 |
| 1995 den | 16 | 316 542 58.3 3970 7.3 26 14 | 41 176 1 |
| 1996 den | 15 | 287 466 61.6 3328 7.1 26 14 | 50 249 4 |
| 1997 den | 16 | 280 502 55.8 3635 7.2 27 11 | 50 218 1 |
| 1998 den | 13 | 210 356 59.0 2806 7.9 22 10 | 37 94 1 |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| TOTAL | 234 | 4123 7250 56.9 51475 7.1 300 226 | 774 3407 33 |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+---------------

elways stats. once over 300 yards. 304 to be exact

the most rushes he had in a season was 66 that is barely over 4 per game. running, what?

i'm guessing you didn't understand me. how many people have said that usc, could beat several pro teams? so you think houston, tenn, saints has more talent than usc? ok... usc has 3 possible offensive lineman that are first round picks, 2 rb's i don't know how many wr's and a qb that's just on offense. how many first round picks does the texans, titans, saints have that matches that? i means players that are playing worthy of a first round pick?

um win you are yet to defend your elway argument that was obviously wrong. so please at least admit my greatness

ok, i was busy pointing out something else. i don't care to argue 2 arguments at once, great great u are.

Actually I did....

You think we can't even consider Leinart's numbers because he had good players around him. Sounds like punishing a guy for having talent around him.

.

Once again, we can't look at his #s because he played with TOO GOOD of a team. Listen to that, it just sounds ridiculous.

If that's the argument, then we could say, that nobody on the 2001 Miami team could be judged coming out of college because their team was too good. Absurd

your arguing the only argument you could possibly win. you lost the elway argument already. just admit it.

vick rushed in 02 and 04 133 and 120 times that dwarfs both elway and young as far as running qb's. i don't want a guy that runs over 100 times a season.

113 not 133 sorry

dude, i already said you were great. what else do you want from me?

i need the love for being right. i need the love

A good place to rejoin the discussion.

The last defense that was not in the top 10 in scoring defense to win the SuperBowl was...

the 1983 Oakland Raiders.

SFIAH

good post saint fan

Ahhhh... it's Brooks-Delhomme II...

This time, it's personal.. :broccoli:

why does everyone think the saints defense was so horrible? they finished with the 14th best defense in the nfl and that was with an offense that had the worst turnover ratio (-21) in the nfl that kept giving offenses the ball with a short field. i would say with a few small improvements, less turnovers from the offense and better coaching they could easily be a top 10 defense. i have posted this many times, but for some reason no one has been catching on.

so we have a defense that is atleast better than the nfl average and an offense with a lot of playmakers. what we need now is a qb to not lose the game for us and another outside lb and better coaching. we should be getting better coaching in the next week or so, a new qb with our 1st round pick and an outside linebacker with our 2nd round pick. we will not win the super bowl next year, but atleast we can make a run at the playoffs and finish better than 8-8.

I don't think anyone said our defense was horrible but I think some of the members see that # 14 defense being a # 2 or 3 defense which will dramatically improve the offense all by itself. We do not need another superstar. Hell if I could trade Deuce straight for another quality RB I would. We don't need superstars we need a team and that starts with defense, period.

a top 3 defense is the whole reason i first became a saints fan back in 1990 and 1991. i am sure you would agree that an offense can also make a defense look much better if they don't turn the ball over all the time. i think we already have that defensive base. if we don't have a qb that can manage the game the best defense in the world won't get you anywhere.

well jerg yes that is true but christ noone is looking to get todd blackledge.

When we had that great defense, Bobby was our QB. Then we got stomped in the playoffs everytime. Now that was due to bad coaching and nothing more.

mora was always conservative to me

Our defense was pretty good, ranked 14th, last season. Yet we led the league in turnovers and we were in the bottom 3 in scoring offense. This team needs offensive help. It won't matter how good our defense is if we can't score points and the other teams score defensive touchdowns every game. Most people on this board were crying that our defense would have one games for us this year if our offense wasn't so bad. We need offensive help, specifically at QB. Our defense needs help too, but it's not as important as getting a QB.