The Win opinion

Winwin · 01-29-2006, 01:08 PM

for those wanting to draft either vince young/ or lienfart. if the saints were to stand pat at 2nd overall and did that, meaning with all the holes we have to fill ie, linebacker, defensive tackle and left offensive tackle in that order, would go undone yet again.

yes with our 2nd pick which is like a late first rounder, we could have a shot at either a lb are defensive tackle but not both and as far as signing a freeagent well good luck in getting someone that will accept that. so in other words, standing pat at 2nd overall gets the qb to play with the same team minus bentley as our previous qb's. that in case you don't realize ain't good... we do not have a above .500 defense, so that means we go through yet another losing season; meaning no fans in the superdome, and that means no saints the year after. so think very hard about what you are truly asking for. in order to win anytime soon a trade down is the only option.

ScottyRo · 01-29-2006, 01:25 PM

Sure, it might be the only option for doom and gloomers, but I prefer to think that you CANNOT pass on an opportunity to get a franchise QB. Whether that be Leinart or Young. AB has proven to be worthless as a winning QB and we have no one else. It'd be nice to have the luxury of seeing if AMac can make it but we don't.

Also, there's little chance for this year's draftees to make a major impact on this team, including a QB. You don't "win now" with the draft. You win now through FA and you usually end up killing your cap outlook in the process. Whatever, this team may be next year, trading down is not likely to improve the outcome. Certainly a couple years down the road it may or may not depending on how good the picks turn out to be.

Furthermore, you're stating as fact that Bentley wont be here next year and that's just not true. It is still undetermined. Plus, he may be franchised and whether he stays or goes we may come out good. Franchising will work better with Bentley than it did with Howard because Bentley is better and younger.

Winwin · 01-29-2006, 01:38 PM

Furthermore, you're stating as fact that Bentley wont be here next year and that's just not true. It is still undetermined. Plus, he may be franchised and whether he stays or goes we may come out good. Franchising will work better with Bentley than it did with Howard because Bentley is better and younger.

even furthermore, to franchise bentley would require that your center would be paid within the top 5 of all offensive lineman that means the center would get left tackle money. so saying that and actually being realistic about it is not in the same ball-park.

Sure, it might be the only option for doom and gloomers, but I prefer to think that you CANNOT pass on an opportunity to get a franchise QB. Whether that be Leinart or Young. AB has proven to be worthless as a winning QB and we have no one else. It'd be nice to have the luxury of seeing if AMac can make it but we don't.

and i don't wish to get into this debate, about what aaron brooks has proven other than that he can't carry a team by himself. are that he can't change the mystique of a franchise. all my post reflected was, be careful what you ask for cause picking lienfart is the same as saying good bye to the saints from louisiana almost a for sure thing. are you ready to take that along with the pick?

ScottyRo · 01-29-2006, 02:21 PM

If the team is going anywhere, it wont matter who we pick or when. Again, the '06 draft will have very little to do with how the team does in '06.

LivnaLieTimay · 01-29-2006, 03:11 PM

I agree with Scotty, we aren't going to win in '06 because of our draft. If '06 is our last chance to remain in New Orleans we need to fill the stadium and since it's going to be tough to field a playoff team (look at our schedule, it's brutal) we need to draft players who a) are going to fill the seats and b) become future pro bowlers. I think guys like Leinart and Young will not only fill seats but become future studs. If we trade down, no one's going to come to see AJ Hawk if we are going to be losing, but people would come to see Leinart or Young. I say draft Leinart or Young and let them play and learn, while filling the stadium. These are 2 very marketable guys who I believe will have success in the NFL in the future. Then in '07 with experience under their belts and another draft we can start to see some results in the W/L column! I like Leinart over Young but I'd take either

spkb25 · 01-29-2006, 03:41 PM

i like the idea of trading down a lot. that said if leinart can become a rothlesberger or palmer or something close then i would have to agree with scotty you can't pass on that. for me i don't think vince will be anything great so i don't want him. trading down to me seems good because we haev some holes to fill and if we can get extra picks and a real good pick in the first round i am for it. well we know with the current cast of characters we can go 8-8. jim made a living off of it. if we can get some more discipline and some better coaching maybe we can get to the playoffs. problem is we don't have a quarter back. that is a real problem for us right now. we just don't have one and i am not sure who in the world is available. if we do draft a qb in the first round or in the first 3 in the hopes the guy will be the next qb for us i still would like them to sit the first year. let them learn and get use to the speed of the game. we still need to pick up a veteran. i wouldn't mind a guy like kitna. i mean he isn't going to light the world on fire buyt he is steady enough to play for us and be competitive. the one thing about next year and the playoffs is exactly what the posty above me said our schedule is as bad a having your prostate checked. whatever we do i don't thinkwe can afford to botch this. so i am just hoping our new coach gets an idea of what he would like to do and tom lets him.

Milians · 01-29-2006, 09:41 PM

You want to get a player that gives us a true impact and puts people in the dome, then the best move is to draft Bush. Our offense was the weak link on the team this past year. The defense wasn't great, but we were in every game this year with a chance to win except for the packers fiasco. Bush gives you one of the greatest playmakers coming out of college in years. Combine that with Stallworth and Horn, the continued development of Hilton and Henderson, the return from injury of Deuce and Boo Williams, and the outlook brightens considerably. The Saints are not a 3-13 team. In a normal year, this Saints team would have finished somewhere between 7-9 and 9-7. Priority number one has to be to re-sign LeCharles Bentley. After that, the Saints should make a move for a young QB. I would like to see them go after Rivers, Ramsey, Carr or McCown. They all have starting experience and upside at the same timel. Hopefully, Mcpherson can develop under Payton's teachings and make some noise in the future. The Saints need to pick up a LT in free agency to replace Gandy. Next, we need to trade Brooks for whatever we can get for him. Take a seventh round pick if we have to. With their first round pick, the Saints have to take Bush or one of the QB's. You simply can't pass up a player of Bush's caliber if he is available. If he is gone, take one of the QB's. In the second round, take a LB. Since this is such a deep draft at LB, there should be a few good ones available with our second round pick. As for the rest of the draft, go with the best player available approach.

01-29-2006, 01:08 PM	#1
Winwin 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 332	The Win opinion for those wanting to draft either vince young/ or lienfart. if the saints were to stand pat at 2nd overall and did that, meaning with all the holes we have to fill ie, linebacker, defensive tackle and left offensive tackle in that order, would go undone yet again. yes with our 2nd pick which is like a late first rounder, we could have a shot at either a lb are defensive tackle but not both and as far as signing a freeagent well good luck in getting someone that will accept that. so in other words, standing pat at 2nd overall gets the qb to play with the same team minus bentley as our previous qb's. that in case you don't realize ain't good... we do not have a above .500 defense, so that means we go through yet another losing season; meaning no fans in the superdome, and that means no saints the year after. so think very hard about what you are truly asking for. in order to win anytime soon a trade down is the only option.
Winwin 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 332	IN THE END THE THIRST ALWAYS WINS-DRACULA

01-29-2006, 01:25 PM	#2
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	RE: The Win opinion Sure, it might be the only option for doom and gloomers, but I prefer to think that you CANNOT pass on an opportunity to get a franchise QB. Whether that be Leinart or Young. AB has proven to be worthless as a winning QB and we have no one else. It'd be nice to have the luxury of seeing if AMac can make it but we don't. Also, there's little chance for this year's draftees to make a major impact on this team, including a QB. You don't "win now" with the draft. You win now through FA and you usually end up killing your cap outlook in the process. Whatever, this team may be next year, trading down is not likely to improve the outcome. Certainly a couple years down the road it may or may not depending on how good the picks turn out to be. Furthermore, you're stating as fact that Bentley wont be here next year and that's just not true. It is still undetermined. Plus, he may be franchised and whether he stays or goes we may come out good. Franchising will work better with Bentley than it did with Howard because Bentley is better and younger.

01-29-2006, 01:38 PM	#3
Winwin 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 332	RE: The Win opinion Furthermore, you're stating as fact that Bentley wont be here next year and that's just not true. It is still undetermined. Plus, he may be franchised and whether he stays or goes we may come out good. Franchising will work better with Bentley than it did with Howard because Bentley is better and younger. even furthermore, to franchise bentley would require that your center would be paid within the top 5 of all offensive lineman that means the center would get left tackle money. so saying that and actually being realistic about it is not in the same ball-park. Sure, it might be the only option for doom and gloomers, but I prefer to think that you CANNOT pass on an opportunity to get a franchise QB. Whether that be Leinart or Young. AB has proven to be worthless as a winning QB and we have no one else. It'd be nice to have the luxury of seeing if AMac can make it but we don't. and i don't wish to get into this debate, about what aaron brooks has proven other than that he can't carry a team by himself. are that he can't change the mystique of a franchise. all my post reflected was, be careful what you ask for cause picking lienfart is the same as saying good bye to the saints from louisiana almost a for sure thing. are you ready to take that along with the pick?
Winwin 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 332	IN THE END THE THIRST ALWAYS WINS-DRACULA

01-29-2006, 02:21 PM	#4
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	RE: The Win opinion If the team is going anywhere, it wont matter who we pick or when. Again, the '06 draft will have very little to do with how the team does in '06.

01-29-2006, 03:11 PM	#5
LivnaLieTimay 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New York Posts: 1,498	RE: The Win opinion I agree with Scotty, we aren't going to win in '06 because of our draft. If '06 is our last chance to remain in New Orleans we need to fill the stadium and since it's going to be tough to field a playoff team (look at our schedule, it's brutal) we need to draft players who a) are going to fill the seats and b) become future pro bowlers. I think guys like Leinart and Young will not only fill seats but become future studs. If we trade down, no one's going to come to see AJ Hawk if we are going to be losing, but people would come to see Leinart or Young. I say draft Leinart or Young and let them play and learn, while filling the stadium. These are 2 very marketable guys who I believe will have success in the NFL in the future. Then in '07 with experience under their belts and another draft we can start to see some results in the W/L column! I like Leinart over Young but I'd take either

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01-29-2006, 03:41 PM	#6
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,093	RE: The Win opinion i like the idea of trading down a lot. that said if leinart can become a rothlesberger or palmer or something close then i would have to agree with scotty you can't pass on that. for me i don't think vince will be anything great so i don't want him. trading down to me seems good because we haev some holes to fill and if we can get extra picks and a real good pick in the first round i am for it. well we know with the current cast of characters we can go 8-8. jim made a living off of it. if we can get some more discipline and some better coaching maybe we can get to the playoffs. problem is we don't have a quarter back. that is a real problem for us right now. we just don't have one and i am not sure who in the world is available. if we do draft a qb in the first round or in the first 3 in the hopes the guy will be the next qb for us i still would like them to sit the first year. let them learn and get use to the speed of the game. we still need to pick up a veteran. i wouldn't mind a guy like kitna. i mean he isn't going to light the world on fire buyt he is steady enough to play for us and be competitive. the one thing about next year and the playoffs is exactly what the posty above me said our schedule is as bad a having your prostate checked. whatever we do i don't thinkwe can afford to botch this. so i am just hoping our new coach gets an idea of what he would like to do and tom lets him.
	Your team stinks

01-29-2006, 09:41 PM	#7
Milians Registered Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 81	You want to get a player that gives us a true impact and puts people in the dome, then the best move is to draft Bush. Our offense was the weak link on the team this past year. The defense wasn't great, but we were in every game this year with a chance to win except for the packers fiasco. Bush gives you one of the greatest playmakers coming out of college in years. Combine that with Stallworth and Horn, the continued development of Hilton and Henderson, the return from injury of Deuce and Boo Williams, and the outlook brightens considerably. The Saints are not a 3-13 team. In a normal year, this Saints team would have finished somewhere between 7-9 and 9-7. Priority number one has to be to re-sign LeCharles Bentley. After that, the Saints should make a move for a young QB. I would like to see them go after Rivers, Ramsey, Carr or McCown. They all have starting experience and upside at the same timel. Hopefully, Mcpherson can develop under Payton's teachings and make some noise in the future. The Saints need to pick up a LT in free agency to replace Gandy. Next, we need to trade Brooks for whatever we can get for him. Take a seventh round pick if we have to. With their first round pick, the Saints have to take Bush or one of the QB's. You simply can't pass up a player of Bush's caliber if he is available. If he is gone, take one of the QB's. In the second round, take a LB. Since this is such a deep draft at LB, there should be a few good ones available with our second round pick. As for the rest of the draft, go with the best player available approach.
Milians Registered Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 81