Mocks Updated

LKelley67 · 03-27-2006, 11:35 PM

just scanning and noting the picks and comments. all of these updated in the last 4-5 days:

>Brick- With the signing of Drew Brees it is unlikely the Saints will draft Matt Leinart. Even though Brees is coming off of a major injury it would be too much money tied up in one position if the Saints drafted Leinart. The Saints are now able to look at other positions in the draft. There is a possibility that the Saints trade this pick, but it's not very often that an offensive tackle as dominating as D'Brickashaw Ferguson comes along. Ferguson has started every game in his college career since he was a freshman. Ferguson's footwork and balance are so good that he nearly always keeps his man in front of him. He is excellent at keeping his opponent off balance with his long arms and large hands. Many feel that Ferguson will be a future all-pro in the NFL.
NFL Player Most Comparable to: Walter Jones
>Brick
>Brick
>Bush for BPA (has Brick #1) and Hawk as Best Need Fill- Trade Possibility: MEDIUM The Saints will wait their full fifteen minutes and wait for a call from the Jets or the Broncos. If Leinhart is available, the same rationale for a trade exists as it did with the Texans. However, the Saints would be a bit more receptive.
>Mario- If you ever needed to make a case for how drastically free agency can affect the NFL Draft the Saints signing of Drew Brees would probably be labeled as "Exhibit A". Everyone, including yours truly, had this pick as an absolute lock to be a quarterback, most likely Matt Leinart. That all changed when Brees was signed though and while the ultimate ramifications of the move have yet to be seen it has sent shockwaves through the league and really shaken up the top of the draft order. By all accounts the player New Orleans is targeting is Mario Williams, even though they already have two excellent former first rounders in Charles Grant and Will Smith at the position. The big question now is whether the Saints will pull the trigger on a trade and move down a bit or if they will simply select him at #2 overall. Based on talent Williams is certainly worthy of this high of a pick, even in a strong draft, and he is easily the best defensive end prospect to come along since Julius Peppers with a freakish blend of size, speed and athleticism. Simply put, he could potentially be one of the elite players at his position in the entire league. D'Brickashaw Ferguson would also make some sense for the Saints and give them an outstanding set of bookend tackles while A.J. Hawk would address a major need if they moved down. At this point you still can't completely rule out a signal caller yet but as of this moment the odds seem to favor Williams being their guy, whether it be here or just a little later
>Brick
>Brick- 4. New Orleans...TRADE (from New York Jets) - OT D'Brickashaw Ferguson (Virginia)...The Saints are happy that they found a trading partner to move down and still land one of the Prospects they were targeting.
>Brick- With the addition of Drew Brees this pick is between Ferguson and Mario Williams. Because the Saints have both Smith and Grant at DE I see the Saints taking the best OT prospect in the draft. Ferguson is a sure thing, he is very athletic with long arms and tremendous feet. He will be a Pro Bowl type player that will anchor that Offensive Line for a decade, and immeditately provide protection for their large investment in Drew Brees and his rehabilitated shoulder.
>Mario- I'm not sure I understand this pick, but it appears as though the Saints are leaning towards Mario Williams. This would leave either Charles Grant or Will Smith left out of the picture are defensive end. D'Brickashaw Freguson is another option, but the Saints are set at OT with Wayne Grandy and Jammal Brown.
>Brick- Now that the Saints have landed Drew Brees in free agency there is no pressing need to take a franchise QB. Ferguson is one of the top prospects overall in this draft and the Saints would be wise to build there line around him since they lost LeCharles Bentley to the Browns.
>Mario- What a difference two weeks make. This looked like a lock for the Saints to take Matt Leinart but the recent signing of Drew Brees has allowed the Saints to look at their next biggest need which is on defense. Super Mario will add some teeth to a very weak defense.
>Brick
>Hawk- As I said in my last write-up, Hawk is a player the Saints need badly. His Pro Day workout was better than his Combine workout, and now with his 4.42 forty, I look for the Saints to take him either here, or down a few spots.
>Brick- In this spot it is either Mario Williams or D'Brickashaw Ferguson. I would make Drew Brees happy
>Mario- Williams is drawing a lot of interest from several NFL teams, and it appears that with the signing of Drew Brees, the Saints are now beginning to target the big defensive end out of N.C. State. Williams would provide instant improvement to the Saints defensive line and could very easily see sack totals of over 10 in his rookie campaign.
It is still possible that the saints may trade down with this pick. Another player to consider here is offensive tackle D'Brickashaw Ferguson
>Brick- The Saints may move down a few spots and still be able to land a stud, but if they stay here they'll probably choose between Fergie, Hawk, or Super Mario.
>Brick- Another team with multiple needs, Ferguson would make life alot easier for New QB Drew Brees. The best footwork in this class, and in any recent draft. Ferguson uses great position and hands to substitute for not having superior strength. He can do himself alot of good by adding some weight to his frame and improving his overall strength. He is the safest pick in this draft.
>Mario
>Hawk
>Mario

SaintFanInATLHELL · 03-28-2006, 08:02 AM

I'm really trying to make sense of this:

First there is the logical:

Originally Posted by LKelley67

...but it's not very often that an offensive tackle as dominating as D'Brickashaw Ferguson comes along. Ferguson has started every game in his college career since he was a freshman. Ferguson's footwork and balance are so good that he nearly always keeps his man in front of him. He is excellent at keeping his opponent off balance with his long arms and large hands. Many feel that Ferguson will be a future all-pro in the NFL.
NFL Player Most Comparable to: Walter Jones

...

D'Brickashaw Ferguson would also make some sense for the Saints and give them an outstanding set of bookend tackles.

Because the Saints have both Smith and Grant at DE I see the Saints taking the best OT prospect in the draft. Ferguson is a sure thing, he is very athletic with long arms and tremendous feet. He will be a Pro Bowl type player that will anchor that Offensive Line for a decade, and immeditately provide protection for their large investment in Drew Brees and his rehabilitated shoulder.

Ferguson is one of the top prospects overall in this draft and the Saints would be wise to build there line around him since they lost LeCharles Bentley to the Browns.

>Brick- Another team with multiple needs, Ferguson would make life alot easier for New QB Drew Brees. The best footwork in this class, and in any recent draft. Ferguson uses great position and hands to substitute for not having superior strength. He can do himself alot of good by adding some weight to his frame and improving his overall strength. He is the safest pick in this draft.

That makes sense. A lot of sense. Jones is absolutely the best in the game. If Ferguson can even come close then he's an absolute lock at tackle.

But then...

...By all accounts the player New Orleans is targeting is Mario Williams, even though they already have two excellent former first rounders in Charles Grant and Will Smith at the position. The big question now is whether the Saints will pull the trigger on a trade and move down a bit or if they will simply select him at #2 overall. Based on talent Williams is certainly worthy of this high of a pick, even in a strong draft, and he is easily the best defensive end prospect to come along since Julius Peppers with a freakish blend of size, speed and athleticism. Simply put, he could potentially be one of the elite players at his position in the entire league.

... as of this moment the odds seem to favor Williams being their guy, whether it be here or just a little later

...

>Mario- I'm not sure I understand this pick, but it appears as though the Saints are leaning towards Mario Williams. This would leave either Charles Grant or Will Smith left out of the picture are defensive end.

...the recent signing of Drew Brees has allowed the Saints to look at their next biggest need which is on defense. Super Mario will add some teeth to a very weak defense.

>Mario- Williams is drawing a lot of interest from several NFL teams, and it appears that with the signing of Drew Brees, the Saints are now beginning to target the big defensive end out of N.C. State. Williams would provide instant improvement to the Saints defensive line and could very easily see sack totals of over 10 in his rookie campaign.

OK. I can only find one context where this pick makes sense. Mario would have to be a position changer. Consider a couple of scenarios:

1. Basketball: You have a really good shooting guard. You need a center (a la the Portland Trailblazers). Do you pick the best big man (Sam Bouie) or do you pick Michael Jordan? Jordan doesn't fill an immediate need, but is player that changes the position.

2. You have a good linebacking core but you get the opportunity to draft Lawrence Taylor. If you have holes in your D-Line or in the secondary, do you pass on LT?

So my question is Mario Williams a position changer? If he is, then can we afford to pass on him with other needs to fill?

But then there's a second issue. I think we can agree that DaBrick isn't going to bomb out like Bouie. Remember that in that 1984 NBA draft that Hakeem Olajuwon was drafted #1. He filled a need and was a All-Star and champion at his position. DaBrick could certainly be the same.

BTW I disagree with this...

D'Brickashaw Freguson is another option, but the Saints are set at OT with Wayne Grandy and Jammal Brown.

I simply don't believe that the Saints are set with Gandy...

The worst part of all of this is that our real need is still at Linebacker and maybe Hawk should be the pick.

But unless WIlliams is the next LT or Reggie White at DE, we need to pick DaBrick.

SFIAH

LKelley67 · 03-28-2006, 09:53 AM

agreed, my take is you only select Mario if you rate him far beyond Brick. I don't see that. Anywhere near in relative value and you have to go with Brick. I love Hawk but do think he rates more like a 4 to 7 pick. I wouldn't whine about him at #2 but would ideally like to see the trade and get him at 4 or 5.

jergensl · 03-28-2006, 01:33 PM

from everything i hear brick is too lanky and may have problems with bull rushing DEs in the NFL. he will be great for speed rushers, but will have some issues with strong dominant DEs.

LKelley67 · 03-28-2006, 01:45 PM

where didja hear that? any links?

jergensl · 03-28-2006, 10:36 PM

just listening to espn radio. they said that he came into college just over 200lbs and is more of a finess blocker. said he was really lanky and might have difficulties with more physical rushers.

LKelley67 · 03-28-2006, 10:43 PM

Sounds like the way back machine. He has started every game for 4 years except for a couple with injury. Bad to the bone now. Many rate him as the surest thing of this draft. Not just a good tackle but a potential All Pro like Jones or Ogden.

CheramieIII · 03-28-2006, 11:04 PM

Trade down for Hawk, I kinda like that scenario and if we can get a couple of extra 2nd rounders for trading down twice we should be able to fill most of our holes with capable rookies in the first 2 rounds.

03-28-2006, 08:02 AM	#2
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,776	Re: Mocks Updated I'm really trying to make sense of this: First there is the logical: Originally Posted by LKelley67 ...but it's not very often that an offensive tackle as dominating as D'Brickashaw Ferguson comes along. Ferguson has started every game in his college career since he was a freshman. Ferguson's footwork and balance are so good that he nearly always keeps his man in front of him. He is excellent at keeping his opponent off balance with his long arms and large hands. Many feel that Ferguson will be a future all-pro in the NFL. NFL Player Most Comparable to: Walter Jones ... D'Brickashaw Ferguson would also make some sense for the Saints and give them an outstanding set of bookend tackles. Because the Saints have both Smith and Grant at DE I see the Saints taking the best OT prospect in the draft. Ferguson is a sure thing, he is very athletic with long arms and tremendous feet. He will be a Pro Bowl type player that will anchor that Offensive Line for a decade, and immeditately provide protection for their large investment in Drew Brees and his rehabilitated shoulder. Ferguson is one of the top prospects overall in this draft and the Saints would be wise to build there line around him since they lost LeCharles Bentley to the Browns. >Brick- Another team with multiple needs, Ferguson would make life alot easier for New QB Drew Brees. The best footwork in this class, and in any recent draft. Ferguson uses great position and hands to substitute for not having superior strength. He can do himself alot of good by adding some weight to his frame and improving his overall strength. He is the safest pick in this draft. That makes sense. A lot of sense. Jones is absolutely the best in the game. If Ferguson can even come close then he's an absolute lock at tackle. But then... ...By all accounts the player New Orleans is targeting is Mario Williams, even though they already have two excellent former first rounders in Charles Grant and Will Smith at the position. The big question now is whether the Saints will pull the trigger on a trade and move down a bit or if they will simply select him at #2 overall. Based on talent Williams is certainly worthy of this high of a pick, even in a strong draft, and he is easily the best defensive end prospect to come along since Julius Peppers with a freakish blend of size, speed and athleticism. Simply put, he could potentially be one of the elite players at his position in the entire league. ... as of this moment the odds seem to favor Williams being their guy, whether it be here or just a little later ... >Mario- I'm not sure I understand this pick, but it appears as though the Saints are leaning towards Mario Williams. This would leave either Charles Grant or Will Smith left out of the picture are defensive end. ...the recent signing of Drew Brees has allowed the Saints to look at their next biggest need which is on defense. Super Mario will add some teeth to a very weak defense. >Mario- Williams is drawing a lot of interest from several NFL teams, and it appears that with the signing of Drew Brees, the Saints are now beginning to target the big defensive end out of N.C. State. Williams would provide instant improvement to the Saints defensive line and could very easily see sack totals of over 10 in his rookie campaign. OK. I can only find one context where this pick makes sense. Mario would have to be a position changer. Consider a couple of scenarios: 1. Basketball: You have a really good shooting guard. You need a center (a la the Portland Trailblazers). Do you pick the best big man (Sam Bouie) or do you pick Michael Jordan? Jordan doesn't fill an immediate need, but is player that changes the position. 2. You have a good linebacking core but you get the opportunity to draft Lawrence Taylor. If you have holes in your D-Line or in the secondary, do you pass on LT? So my question is Mario Williams a position changer? If he is, then can we afford to pass on him with other needs to fill? But then there's a second issue. I think we can agree that DaBrick isn't going to bomb out like Bouie. Remember that in that 1984 NBA draft that Hakeem Olajuwon was drafted #1. He filled a need and was a All-Star and champion at his position. DaBrick could certainly be the same. BTW I disagree with this... D'Brickashaw Freguson is another option, but the Saints are set at OT with Wayne Grandy and Jammal Brown. I simply don't believe that the Saints are set with Gandy... The worst part of all of this is that our real need is still at Linebacker and maybe Hawk should be the pick. But unless WIlliams is the next LT or Reggie White at DE, we need to pick DaBrick. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

03-27-2006, 11:35 PM	#1
LKelley67 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: baton rouge Posts: 2,540	Mocks Updated just scanning and noting the picks and comments. all of these updated in the last 4-5 days: >Brick- With the signing of Drew Brees it is unlikely the Saints will draft Matt Leinart. Even though Brees is coming off of a major injury it would be too much money tied up in one position if the Saints drafted Leinart. The Saints are now able to look at other positions in the draft. There is a possibility that the Saints trade this pick, but it's not very often that an offensive tackle as dominating as D'Brickashaw Ferguson comes along. Ferguson has started every game in his college career since he was a freshman. Ferguson's footwork and balance are so good that he nearly always keeps his man in front of him. He is excellent at keeping his opponent off balance with his long arms and large hands. Many feel that Ferguson will be a future all-pro in the NFL. NFL Player Most Comparable to: Walter Jones >Brick >Brick >Bush for BPA (has Brick #1) and Hawk as Best Need Fill- Trade Possibility: MEDIUM The Saints will wait their full fifteen minutes and wait for a call from the Jets or the Broncos. If Leinhart is available, the same rationale for a trade exists as it did with the Texans. However, the Saints would be a bit more receptive. >Mario- If you ever needed to make a case for how drastically free agency can affect the NFL Draft the Saints signing of Drew Brees would probably be labeled as "Exhibit A". Everyone, including yours truly, had this pick as an absolute lock to be a quarterback, most likely Matt Leinart. That all changed when Brees was signed though and while the ultimate ramifications of the move have yet to be seen it has sent shockwaves through the league and really shaken up the top of the draft order. By all accounts the player New Orleans is targeting is Mario Williams, even though they already have two excellent former first rounders in Charles Grant and Will Smith at the position. The big question now is whether the Saints will pull the trigger on a trade and move down a bit or if they will simply select him at #2 overall. Based on talent Williams is certainly worthy of this high of a pick, even in a strong draft, and he is easily the best defensive end prospect to come along since Julius Peppers with a freakish blend of size, speed and athleticism. Simply put, he could potentially be one of the elite players at his position in the entire league. D'Brickashaw Ferguson would also make some sense for the Saints and give them an outstanding set of bookend tackles while A.J. Hawk would address a major need if they moved down. At this point you still can't completely rule out a signal caller yet but as of this moment the odds seem to favor Williams being their guy, whether it be here or just a little later >Brick >Brick- 4. New Orleans...TRADE (from New York Jets) - OT D'Brickashaw Ferguson (Virginia)...The Saints are happy that they found a trading partner to move down and still land one of the Prospects they were targeting. >Brick- With the addition of Drew Brees this pick is between Ferguson and Mario Williams. Because the Saints have both Smith and Grant at DE I see the Saints taking the best OT prospect in the draft. Ferguson is a sure thing, he is very athletic with long arms and tremendous feet. He will be a Pro Bowl type player that will anchor that Offensive Line for a decade, and immeditately provide protection for their large investment in Drew Brees and his rehabilitated shoulder. >Mario- I'm not sure I understand this pick, but it appears as though the Saints are leaning towards Mario Williams. This would leave either Charles Grant or Will Smith left out of the picture are defensive end. D'Brickashaw Freguson is another option, but the Saints are set at OT with Wayne Grandy and Jammal Brown. >Brick- Now that the Saints have landed Drew Brees in free agency there is no pressing need to take a franchise QB. Ferguson is one of the top prospects overall in this draft and the Saints would be wise to build there line around him since they lost LeCharles Bentley to the Browns. >Mario- What a difference two weeks make. This looked like a lock for the Saints to take Matt Leinart but the recent signing of Drew Brees has allowed the Saints to look at their next biggest need which is on defense. Super Mario will add some teeth to a very weak defense. >Brick >Hawk- As I said in my last write-up, Hawk is a player the Saints need badly. His Pro Day workout was better than his Combine workout, and now with his 4.42 forty, I look for the Saints to take him either here, or down a few spots. >Brick- In this spot it is either Mario Williams or D'Brickashaw Ferguson. I would make Drew Brees happy >Mario- Williams is drawing a lot of interest from several NFL teams, and it appears that with the signing of Drew Brees, the Saints are now beginning to target the big defensive end out of N.C. State. Williams would provide instant improvement to the Saints defensive line and could very easily see sack totals of over 10 in his rookie campaign. It is still possible that the saints may trade down with this pick. Another player to consider here is offensive tackle D'Brickashaw Ferguson >Brick- The Saints may move down a few spots and still be able to land a stud, but if they stay here they'll probably choose between Fergie, Hawk, or Super Mario. >Brick- Another team with multiple needs, Ferguson would make life alot easier for New QB Drew Brees. The best footwork in this class, and in any recent draft. Ferguson uses great position and hands to substitute for not having superior strength. He can do himself alot of good by adding some weight to his frame and improving his overall strength. He is the safest pick in this draft. >Mario >Hawk >Mario

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03-28-2006, 09:53 AM	#3
LKelley67 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: baton rouge Posts: 2,540	agreed, my take is you only select Mario if you rate him far beyond Brick. I don't see that. Anywhere near in relative value and you have to go with Brick. I love Hawk but do think he rates more like a 4 to 7 pick. I wouldn't whine about him at #2 but would ideally like to see the trade and get him at 4 or 5.

03-28-2006, 01:33 PM	#4
jergensl 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Belleview, FL Posts: 526	from everything i hear brick is too lanky and may have problems with bull rushing DEs in the NFL. he will be great for speed rushers, but will have some issues with strong dominant DEs.

03-28-2006, 01:45 PM	#5
LKelley67 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: baton rouge Posts: 2,540	where didja hear that? any links?

03-28-2006, 10:36 PM	#6
jergensl 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Belleview, FL Posts: 526	just listening to espn radio. they said that he came into college just over 200lbs and is more of a finess blocker. said he was really lanky and might have difficulties with more physical rushers.

03-28-2006, 10:43 PM	#7
LKelley67 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: baton rouge Posts: 2,540	Sounds like the way back machine. He has started every game for 4 years except for a couple with injury. Bad to the bone now. Many rate him as the surest thing of this draft. Not just a good tackle but a potential All Pro like Jones or Ogden.

03-28-2006, 11:04 PM	#8
CheramieIII Fan Since 1967 Join Date: May 2004 Location: Nomad Posts: 7,487 Blog Entries: 3	Trade down for Hawk, I kinda like that scenario and if we can get a couple of extra 2nd rounders for trading down twice we should be able to fill most of our holes with capable rookies in the first 2 rounds.