"So-called" character talk.

TheDeuce · 05-13-2006, 03:37 AM

The Patriots built a dynasty off of high character guys. Guys who are smart and are students of the game. I don't think that necessarily just because a guy has a run-in with the law that he's a bad guy, but I do think you can notice a trend that the guys who really care about the game and care about their integrity on the field, aren't the ones getting busted for weed or DUIs; the two go hand in hand. I think what Payton is doing is right, he's choosing guys that will give everything they've got every day. Some of them might not be high character guys in the sense of them getting old ladies' kittens out of trees and whatnot, but they are high character guys in the sense of them taking pride in their work.

Cassady37 · 05-13-2006, 10:00 AM

I also think one of the intangibles of having alot of high character players is that they will elevate each other to the next level. Enthusiasm and a high level of effort, good skill and a great attitude from alot of individual players working together towards a common goal will win out over a bunch of great players working out-of-sync because of their me-first attitude. I think some great examples of this are the olympics. We send talent-laden pro teams to compete in various team events and the result is the 'amateur' teams from other countries who might have a few pro players end up taking us down on a consistent basis. Another example was the World Baseball Championship. That was just down-right embarrassing. I'm not saying a very good coached, talent-ladened team won't win most of the time against a mediocre, character-driven team but how many teams actually have the best of both worlds in todays money-driven, me-first football climate? My.02 is that you build the high-character, enthusiastic, team-oriented players around the few high-talented superstar players and hope the balance will pay off in the end. One bad-attitude player on a team like that will not have a conducive atmosphere in which to flourish and multiply into several bad-attitude players because the majority of the team will stifle them as a group. And if the problem continues then the player will be shown the door and you have started a precedent that will hopefully propel your team to the next level. Ok, I'm coming down off my soapbox now. Like I said, just my .02 worth of useless knowledge.

hagan714 · 05-13-2006, 10:21 AM

"Character"
I think it has all been covered well here from every angle possible and beaten to sufficantly to death.
The Issue I find as an underlining factor MAYBE what Sir Charles termed as "Hazs Pet's" in most cases.
The coaching staff now see players that have not been playing as MAYBE those who were unjustly treated. Some of those players in the Haz club are the "Character" or "Cancers" that cause clubhouse disharmeny. Athletes, IN GENERAL, are like children. Once "Labeled" by team mates that is it. So "Character" also includes the " Clubhouse Haromeny" thing attacted to it.
All I want is picks not damaged or subpar players in exchange please. Rather loss draft values than have to take out another teams garbage.

spkb25 · 05-13-2006, 10:27 AM

i don't think a run in with the law makes someone a bad guy either but when it is constant yeah it starts to be a trend and a bad one at that. owens is probably the best wide out in the game, but he is a cancer. he will start his **** in dallas. it may not be this year or it may. it is all a matter of time. who cares about the reward the guy offers or what the POSSIBLE reward could be, because you know for certain he will destroy your team at some point. i am not certain i am right but i think i am san fran hasn't made the playoffs since the dirt bag started his shiit. philly looked terrible last year after he started his shiit. the guy is great but i would never ever want him because he wil destroy your team. you do need guys that can play the game but there are a lot of those types of guys. a lot of those types of guys that won't be an a-hole too. i don't think you have to go after high profile guys with attitude problems to be good. there are plenty of guys in the league that can play and don't bring that mess.

hagan714 · 05-13-2006, 10:40 AM

Agreed. If my record is held against me at that age I would fall into that hole myself. I did alot worse things. But we are not talking about employees that make $100,000 or less here. They are set for life if they can get 5 to 10 years in. I think the NFL does not want the STREET PUNK image that has dogged the NBA. The NBA are having a hard time controlling what they marketed for a few years back. Now the players are having to put back in check. It all blew up in their face.
They are not idols that deserve special treatment. A shame a few bad moves by the teams and society, in the past, has created the problem. So we are on the far "right wing" now after being on the far" left wing".

CHACHING · 05-13-2006, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by Crusader

Just because you are a character doesn't mean you have one.

Winston Wolfe?

05-13-2006, 03:37 AM	#11
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928	The Patriots built a dynasty off of high character guys. Guys who are smart and are students of the game. I don't think that necessarily just because a guy has a run-in with the law that he's a bad guy, but I do think you can notice a trend that the guys who really care about the game and care about their integrity on the field, aren't the ones getting busted for weed or DUIs; the two go hand in hand. I think what Payton is doing is right, he's choosing guys that will give everything they've got every day. Some of them might not be high character guys in the sense of them getting old ladies' kittens out of trees and whatnot, but they are high character guys in the sense of them taking pride in their work.
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928

05-13-2006, 10:21 AM	#13
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	"Character" I think it has all been covered well here from every angle possible and beaten to sufficantly to death. The Issue I find as an underlining factor MAYBE what Sir Charles termed as "Hazs Pet's" in most cases. The coaching staff now see players that have not been playing as MAYBE those who were unjustly treated. Some of those players in the Haz club are the "Character" or "Cancers" that cause clubhouse disharmeny. Athletes, IN GENERAL, are like children. Once "Labeled" by team mates that is it. So "Character" also includes the " Clubhouse Haromeny" thing attacted to it. All I want is picks not damaged or subpar players in exchange please. Rather loss draft values than have to take out another teams garbage.
	"We may have lost the game, but you'll be hurting tomorrow." Doug Atkins

05-13-2006, 10:27 AM	#14
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,097	i don't think a run in with the law makes someone a bad guy either but when it is constant yeah it starts to be a trend and a bad one at that. owens is probably the best wide out in the game, but he is a cancer. he will start his **** in dallas. it may not be this year or it may. it is all a matter of time. who cares about the reward the guy offers or what the POSSIBLE reward could be, because you know for certain he will destroy your team at some point. i am not certain i am right but i think i am san fran hasn't made the playoffs since the dirt bag started his shiit. philly looked terrible last year after he started his shiit. the guy is great but i would never ever want him because he wil destroy your team. you do need guys that can play the game but there are a lot of those types of guys. a lot of those types of guys that won't be an a-hole too. i don't think you have to go after high profile guys with attitude problems to be good. there are plenty of guys in the league that can play and don't bring that mess.
	Your team stinks

05-13-2006, 10:40 AM	#15
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Agreed. If my record is held against me at that age I would fall into that hole myself. I did alot worse things. But we are not talking about employees that make $100,000 or less here. They are set for life if they can get 5 to 10 years in. I think the NFL does not want the STREET PUNK image that has dogged the NBA. The NBA are having a hard time controlling what they marketed for a few years back. Now the players are having to put back in check. It all blew up in their face. They are not idols that deserve special treatment. A shame a few bad moves by the teams and society, in the past, has created the problem. So we are on the far "right wing" now after being on the far" left wing".
	"We may have lost the game, but you'll be hurting tomorrow." Doug Atkins

05-13-2006, 01:57 PM	#16
CHACHING 500th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Golden State Posts: 830	Re: RE: "So-called" character talk. Originally Posted by Crusader Just because you are a character doesn't mean you have one. Winston Wolfe?

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05-13-2006, 10:00 AM	#12
Cassady37 100th Post Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Kilgore, Texas Posts: 337	I also think one of the intangibles of having alot of high character players is that they will elevate each other to the next level. Enthusiasm and a high level of effort, good skill and a great attitude from alot of individual players working together towards a common goal will win out over a bunch of great players working out-of-sync because of their me-first attitude. I think some great examples of this are the olympics. We send talent-laden pro teams to compete in various team events and the result is the 'amateur' teams from other countries who might have a few pro players end up taking us down on a consistent basis. Another example was the World Baseball Championship. That was just down-right embarrassing. I'm not saying a very good coached, talent-ladened team won't win most of the time against a mediocre, character-driven team but how many teams actually have the best of both worlds in todays money-driven, me-first football climate? My.02 is that you build the high-character, enthusiastic, team-oriented players around the few high-talented superstar players and hope the balance will pay off in the end. One bad-attitude player on a team like that will not have a conducive atmosphere in which to flourish and multiply into several bad-attitude players because the majority of the team will stifle them as a group. And if the problem continues then the player will be shown the door and you have started a precedent that will hopefully propel your team to the next level. Ok, I'm coming down off my soapbox now. Like I said, just my .02 worth of useless knowledge.