We won't stand for it anymore!
 

Pacman thinks he's going to get out of the suspension. I mean come on, going to a strip club before your meeting with the commish and getting a speeding ticket just 5 days before your scheduled meeting. I guess he didn't get the memo about staying out of trouble or can he even read? Is he another player who was passed through college just because he can play sports? He must have thought the speeding ticket was just an autograph signing session along the interstate that he was late for because the fool was SPEEDING!

Pacman is the new "Pacwoman" (biatch). He, as well as Ricky, Vick (we all know he knew about the dogfights), Henry and the like need to be bannished from the league and I'm sure if I searched enough I could come up with about 50 other names. You know for everything Terrell Owens has done these guy's make him look like Mother Teresa.

It's time to clean up professional sports and if the NFL is on the cutting edge of that movement they will certainly pick up alot more rabid fans in the process. This is not just an NFL problem, I mean look at the NBA, it's even worse. Baseball has it's own problems, steroids and yes, we all know that most who say they didn't, DID! Hockey is the only sport that really doesn't have this image problem, except during the games when the fight, but hell that's why everyone goes to the damn games in the first place, so let's have more of that and they should pick up fans too.

Your average fan is getting very tired of hearing about all of the arrest, tickets and sightings of football players during a shooting at any strip club in the country, you pick the strip club or players getting shot or killed for that matter. I guess we all want to know what the arrest rate is for the NFL as a profession or better yet the rate that an NFL player is named during an incident? I bet you it is far higher than any other profession, well maybe not prostitute, pimp, thief, hitman or drug dealer.

Your average fan makes what 30 to 40K a year and these dumb idiots make in some cases 100 times that much. Your average fan spends his hard earned money to watch these fools and support their freakin bad habits.

Enough is enough and we won't stand for it anymore.

Signed,

An Average Fan

The prob in professional sports as a whole, IMO, is the fact that most of these people suddenly come into an exorborant amount of money so fast and dont quite know how to handle that kind of freedom...

In any other profession financial success comes at a much slower pace and therefore comes the learned responsibilty of how to handle alot of money

Not to mention that the media has its magnifying glass on every lil detail of your life as a pro....Steve McNair's consentual DUI was total bullsh*t for example...Mike Vick's dog thing is borderline BS too (not cuz im for dog figthing rings or anything...but its just an indirect link to Vick)

Im not trying to make excuses as Pacman and others in similar situations need action to be taken against....repeat offenders especailly....

But after all is said and done, suffering from the scrutiny of the media and public eye is a small price to pay for the type of money these guys make

punks getting millions is always a problem.
Nice letter Cher. Long time no see.

Nothing excuses breaking the law, NOTHING! and if you happen to be in a place where something illegal is happening you should take whatever is coming to you.

The players I mentioned have no respect for what they have, neither the talent or the money. Their parents are partly to blame for the upbringing but at what point in a man's life should he become responsible for his own actions irregardless of his upbringing. I think everyone I named has past that age.

Maybe the NFL should send them all to a morale values school and let them learn the finer points in life, like freakin tea and crumpits!

Ok ill take back that Vick statement as ive read more up on it....he deserves what he gets...especially the way he is handling it....

Well, if you are tired of hearing about arrests, tickets, etc, the simple solution is don't watch sports shows on TV or listen to them on the radio.

The NFL is an entertainment corporation, nothing more, nothing less. And certainly it is not the judiciary branch of the U.S. gov't. There are thousands of people who get speeding tickets every day. The difference is that ESPN or Fox Sports is not there to report it. When it comes to shootings at strip clubs that are reported on ESPN, surely there are much more non-football players than football players involved. If no athlete is involved, you don't get to hear about them on ESPN or Fox Sports.

So, I assume from your statement that the NFL allows this stuff to go on because it's just entertainment, shock value, more people will watch a train wreck theory? It has nothing to do with an 8 year old boy in Toledo who watches Vick play football and idolizes the stupid SOB and wants to be just like him?

and yes I will have to agree with you that thousands of people get speeding tickets everyday, but I am very sure that not many of them are in the same situation as Pacwoman.

and yes Reiper you have to admit there have been alot of shootings at strip clubs invloving professional athletes in recent months. I don't think I've seen any other stories on the news involving your average fan shooting something at a strip club in Atlanta other than a load in his pants.

Have you read up on the Steve McNair thing though? He wasnt even driving the car! Its called consentual DUI or whatever and basically since he owns the car he's responsible for his DD or whatever....I just think its a lil excessive...

Yeah J, I read about the McNair incident and think that is totally stupid, but the law is the law in Tennessee and if you own a snowmobile in the state of Tennessee you need to know that if it runs out of gas you are responsible by law to fill it up again!

First off, drop the holier than thou attitude.

Second, I have never seen a football player drive drunk at a football game, nor seen a football player fire a weapon at a football game, nor get arrested at a football game. So no one watches NFL games to see a "train wreck".

Third, I don't care about the 8 year old in Toledo. He's got parents. If not , life's though.
In any case, the kid could watch Vick play football and aspire to play like him. However, he would have to watch ESPN/surf and/or BDSS to learn about Vick's other issues.

Again, you simply don't hear stories about other shootings at strip clubs if they don't involve someone in the limelight, as simple as that. I live in NC. Merely hours after the Jones incident in Las Vegas, I heard about it on the radio. Around the same date, a cop was shot and killed at a very popular night club ( no strip club) where I live. Did you hear about it? Chances are you didn't, because it involved nobodies.

For the thousands of people who get speeding tickets every day, there has to be millions who don't get caught when speeding. Have you ever gone faster than the speed limit? How would you like to get a speeding ticket, then go to work the next day abd get "suspended without pay"? Oh, yeah, they make millions for playing football, and you would get paid millions too, if you did something millions of people would want to watch, and hundreds of corporations would want to advertise on it, and people would by the same hat and shirt you were... but alas, you don't.

Whoaaaaaaaaaaa there big fella. Chill, it's only an opinion.....just like anyone elses.

horrible comparisons
 

ok...news organizations are in the business of spreading news...a "nobody" being shot or arrested is only news in that local area, because that person's realm of influence is in that area...if a famous person is shot or arrested that is national news, because that person is known throughout the nation.

is the nfl was suspending players for simple speeding tickets you would have an argument, but they are not. dui, assault, and drug charges are much bigger than silly speeding tickets. in good quality jobs you will get suspended or even fired if you have a dui, assault, or drug charges. any employer who wouldn't has a serious lack of morals.

I don't get the point of your reply ... guess you didn't read the whole thread.

Speaking of '"quality jobs", I don't know what you consider a "quality job", but there are such things are wrongful termination suits. It just depends on how your contract is written. But that's a discussion for another thread.

Damn Reiper, I ain't no preacher and if I gave you or anyone that impression I sincerely apologize.

On another note, I do think that what Pacwoman or any other sports figure does that's illegal or continually skirts the law should have consequences.

In my profession I would have been fired a long time ago and I don't make the money they make, but it's good money and I give an honest days work.

It is their choice to be where they are, in the limelight and all and if it was their only choice then it's their own damn fault too.

explanation
 

tobias,
i was commenting on your comparisons and how i thought they were misguided.

yo seriously one thing about T.O. the guy is never in legal trouble. i dont care so much for pacmans speeding but with what has happened in the past you would figure he would be out of trouble. like a saint just about. no pun. this cat never learns. yo man everyone is different and so is the environment you grow up in. i know that these guys are young and i am not sure that at 22 i would have been able to be as mature as needed to play in the nfl or stay in the nfl. see though that is what it comes down to. if you can't at some point mature you will be lawerence phillips. wasted talent. the end of a bad joke 10 years later. it is how it goes. these guys are given the opportunity to never ever have to work a job outside of playing in the nfl. something they are all very skilled at. it does a take a lot of work to be there. if they can't see the blessing in front of them well then they need to go. i have no pity for muarice clarett, lawerence phillips, and what will be in a year or two pacman jones. it isn't like they are being thrown out of the league after one or two issues. these cats are given a lot of chances. some actually get it and get their life in order. you know like ray lewis. the others, well they end up in jail or just silly poor because they can not get a job in the sport anymore and return to what they are. crooks and pieces of dirt. sorry i don't feel bad and i don't think anyone besides them them self are the issue that needs to be addressed.

also bringing unwanted attention to the place you work at will result in you being fired. unfortunately your actions outside of work can lead to you being fired or suspended.

Both points are valid, the players get alot of the news due to who they are which is unfair. Common sense also has to be used by the players also. Adam Jones is a poor kid who got a huge pay day, but couldnt leave the "hood life" at the door of his new manson.

If I had a history of drug use, your not going to find/hear about me at a crack house the night before I see my parole officer.

On the other hand this notion that the NFL's players need to be upstanding rolemodels is silly. They play a game/sport that gladiatoresic, the weapons are gone, the tigers have been replaced cheer leaders, but the crowd still cheers for blood and pain. This is football, where legs are broken and lifes can change in a second.

The fact is that kids look up to football players and other atheletes. That makes them role models - either good or bad - whether they like it or not. Thus, I think if the NFL is going to be a socially responsible company, then it will demand that the players act in a professional way on the field and in an honorable and respectable way off the field.

If a player doesn't want to be a role model, then he shouldn't try out for the NFL. The same applies to many areas of entertainment. If you don't want your personal life hampered by the negative side of celebrity, then don't do everything you can to become a celebrity.

SoulStar, I agree with the comment that lifes can change in a second and that's why it bugs me so much that some of the players don't have any respect for what they have. It seem's to me that you would protect what you have at all costs, but hey I don't play football in the NFL.

Well. I didn't mean it as stern as it sounded. I should've put a dancing broccoli smily or something...

... I understand what you are saying, I do... it's just the nature of this beast called profesional football. As fans, there is only one thing we can do to display or displeasure to the league, and we are not going to do it: stop patronizing the game. See? You are not going to do that :) Regardless of the Pacmans (or Pacwomans :) ), the Mexicos, the Romos, etc, we'll still watch it, and buy the jersey, and the hat, and the tickets, etc, etc etc.

But also, you need to remember, that for every Mexico, there's a Brees, a Manning, a Pennington, A Brady... and that for every Henry, there's a Colston, and Harrison, and Smith... there are plenty of high character guys playing the game. Look how many we have in Brees, Deuce, Reggie, Karney, Colston...

The PBA allows ShePac to plead his case. Hey, let him. After all, this is America...and if he gets some games back, you just know he's going to screw it up down the line, and hurt not only his pocket, but his team.

Now, let me ask you a question :)

Did you feel the same way when Rickey Jackson crashed his Corvette going 120 MPH and traces of cocaine were found in his car?:mrgreen:

Excellent emoticon usage, Tobias.

I just hope that you all realize that we fuel the beast here. Our $30-40K a year that we use to buy tickets and beer, tvs and cable are the dollars that end up in these guys' pockets.

The players are role models*, but no one ever said that those were good things. They are also employees subject to the rules of their employers...us. (The collective) We support their behavior every Sunday, Monday and sometimes Thursday for 20 weeks a year. We start idolizing them when they're in High School (or earlier) keep it up through their formative college years and then we crucify them when they keep acting like they're the greatest thing ever. We keep giving them chances.

*American Heritage Dictionary:
role model - A person who serves as an example of the values, attitudes, and behaviors associated with a role. For example, a father is a role model for his sons. Role models can also be persons who distinguish themselves in such a way that others admire and want to emulate them. For example, a woman who becomes a successful brain surgeon or airline pilot can be described as a role model for other women.

And what does "chida" mean?

Chida= Tarzans monkey!

Oh, I see, "the net is Tarzan's Monkey, but unattainable." Thanks for clearing that up.

we got 2 threads dealing with this topic
http://www.blackandgold.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=16087
Cher i agree with you when it comes to punks but I also think you have to be careful. read my reply in the other thread

Very funny you two... :broccoli:

Ok, here's your Very Mexican Slang lesson of the day:

"La neta" stands for "the truth", "what's at the core". It comes from the difference between gross and net weight, net being what you actually get, what's real, what you can use. The actual word for truth is "verdad".

"Chida" or "Chido" could be something that is fun, good, great, or the best, or even all that there is. It all depends on context and pronunciation. I have no idea where it comes from, though.

So, the line means:
"The truth is everything, but unattainable"

It is a line from a movie called "Y tu mama tambien". A surprisingly good Mexican movie about the coming of age of two life-long friends.

I like the monkey thing better, at least it's easier.

I think that this entire issue, is a reflection, of where the world is headed, and has been, for some time now. This "What about me" generation, is selfish, self centered, and only out to take care of one person, and that's themselves.

Sure, these guys are in the spotlight, and there are drugs, fast cars, women, and guns, but this is NOT new gentlemen. It's just more rampant, and in the spotlight more now, because as a whole, even in sports, people in this country live off drama.

Lawrence Taylor, Michael Irvin, Brett Favre, Kerry Collins, just to name a few, have all admitted that they had drug addictions, and I'm not going to sit here and judge them for those mistakes, because I'm an ex alcoholic/drug addict myself. Many people, who still drink now, are under the belief, that they are not addicted, and that they are just social drinkers. The reallity of it, will hit them soon, and probably when they are at their most vulnerable. I don't think we should take drug addicts out in the street and stone them. They don't make the drugs, and they certainly arent the ones profiting the most from them. Athletes, are human beings, just like you and me, no matter what their tax bracket.

There is a quote from the Bible, that many so called practicing christians always seem to conveniently forget, "Judge not, lest ye be judged."

EVERYONE has skeletons in their closets, that they probably don't want anyone in the world to know about. It is easy to speculate, how you would act in a certain situation, if you know there is no chance in the universe that you ever will actually be in it. I could tell you all kinds of things I would do, if I was married to Jessica Alba, but the reallity is, I would probably do the same things I did in my last marriage, which was beg for sex, and take out the garbage on Thursday.

I am not advocating anything that these young men have done, but at the same time, as individuals, we all have to go our own way, and make our own mistakes. That's what makes us who we are, as human beings. Thinking that everyone on the planet needs to live up to "my idea" of what is morally acceptable in society, makes me a very pompous, and dillusional person. Drugs, guns, women, and money, are all a part of life, that's not going anywhere anytime soon. In fact, they have been around alot longer, than any of us, if you want to get technical.

Kids will look up to their own role models, no matter what mom and dad say anyway. When I was 17 I wanted to be Slash from Guns and Roses. Why? Not because he was a full blown alcoholic, but because he was the baddest guitar player I had ever seen, and no one, anywhere could have talked me out of it. That's just a part of being a kid.

I understand what everyone is saying about this topic but I think when you are in the limelight like Athletes, Movie stars etc. You have to realize that you are going to be the hot topic and no matter what you do it will be all over TV and the internet. Meny people look at them as role modles and they are held to a higher standard then avg people. They need to take responsibility for thier actions and surround them selfs with better company if need be.

a bible qoute from Siant paul ?

Here is my take on the subject.

I saw a book(that was aimed towards children) in my church this past Sunday that was titled "HEROS". On the cover was, a baseball player, a basketball player, a hockey player and a football player. Some of you maybe old enough to relate to this, but when my dad was a kid his hero was Babe Ruth. Why? Mine was Dalton. Every team I ever played for as a kid, my number was 21. Why? Because these people are (at times) larger than life to kids. What better thing to grow up to be, than to play your favorite game for the rest of your life.

Why did I not see a police officer, a fireman, a nurse, a Soldier, or any of the jobs that any of you do on the front of that cover? Because people, those jobs are not games. They are not fun to do. You don't get to PLAY.

Cher, I'm with you on this 100%.

These pros (pick a sport), are looked up to, and imitated by our children. How do our kids get this way???? because of US! Because we talk with PRIDE, and SCREAM with joy when we watch Deuce carry 5 defenders into the endzone. Parents or no parents is not even an issue. I know you have heard "It take a village to raise a child". The NFL needs to be a big part of the village. When kids see all of these players breaking the law with no action taken against them (or very little), what does that tell them? No one cares.

When you become a STAR, you have just allowed yourself to lose your total privacy. If you want privacy....don't become a STAR.

But hey, what do I know. I just a dumb old Soldier.

Bump time!

Turley should have had a head to go with that helmet he threw down field.

Ok now you know were I stand.

The media has found the new holy cow of football. They are going to milk this cow till it is all dried up and the only thing it is good for is cleats and footballs.

This is a contact sport. Not only that but a sport that requires a mind set that not all have. Right there you have to expect some aggressive behavior. It has been coached into them since pee wee. For you parents out there you know that we can be worse than any coach. So why is it so surprising that these kids are aggressive off the field. I was till an injury my Jr year took the game away from me. You do not back down. that is what you are taught.

What is college all about? Not only do you learn how to take a test but you learned how to be an adult. Education and to be socially acceptable. I have to laugh at the education part a bit. I can remeber sitting in the principles office in high school and being told not to worry about the grades. As long as I play, I will pass. Later in life I went back to college and was math tutor for players in college. (That explains my writting skills.) Funny thing was that the the same mind set is in place. Some I still chuckle with when they are in town playing because they are playing pro sports today. They made it. If the the front offices only knew the the deep dark secerts. Wonder what would have happened.

The social interaction part is the hardest for alot of them. These hollier than thu judgemental people have no real clue. They have not walked in there shoes. Not all the players have had an easy life and many have had there personal lives cleaned up much the same way as their grades. The cover ups are numerous. So who is really to blame here. Administarion, alumni, and the judical system is the place I would start. But that would mean the quality of pro sports will drop. Is society as whole willing to do that? Heck no. Many people who are sitting in seats of power are low lifes them selves and the only difference is, they know how to play the game. A turd is a turd no matter how pretty the wrapping is it comes in. Just most people can not see past the wrapping. Because they are masters at playing the game they will never be the one held accountable. The players or some lesser person will always be the skate goats. Given these facts and they are facts, why is this so surprising. You have to accept the fact that socially there will be a stepper learning curve, when the player has been completly babied all the way to the pros. They will be just that, socially stunted.

Granted some are just turds and always will be. Nothing can be done about them because they have choicen to be that kind of person.

When I was doing the 2oo7 player review I got really sick of what they were reporting. DUI, fights and such all the way back to high school. It was getting a bit much. What do these reporter think? All these kids came from a solid family and had the core values put into them at an early age. That the system itself did not aid them in becoming what they are. Getting convicted for ones action is one thing but guilty by association is another. Sorry gang that is illegal. We all make mistakes and that is what life is all about. Learning from your mistakes. I still make mistakes and always will.

If we step out of bar and you get into a fight. You can be sure I will cover your back. If we get arrested so be it. I will be there and not turn my back on you. I am old school that way. If some one holds that value system against me I do not have the time or the respect in the person to give a sh*t what they think (sorry for the * crap Sam). They are a person not to be trusted. Blue collar or white I do not care. So if I was to go into the draft this year, I would have been one of those questionable kids. I do not start fights but I will not run from one either. I was brought up to differently I guess. Maybe that why I never could become a sensative new age man.

Let kids be kids and hope they learn from it. A punk is a punk but he must be convicted before you hang him. That is a constutional right. The NFL is in a grey erea here and I hope they do not push it to far. I hope they do get burned if they over step it. This could effect all of us if the NFL is allowed to overstep it legal rights. You can add this to list of rights you have lost. Something has to be done but keep it legal.