Same ol'
 

Lets go back a few years. Roughly 2000 Saints play a last place schedule, a rookie Head Coach and win first ever playoff game, the Head Coach was Coach of the year and the QB was a Probowl alternate. Following year 2001 about a quarter into the season there was a total collapse by the entire team couldn't block anybody couldn't stop anybody, couldn't run are catch the football. Said QB is blamed for everything, every loss 24/7 365 days everyday.


Fast foward to 2006; New Coach, last place schedule win 2nd ever playoff game. Coach is named Coach of the year QB goes to the Probowl. Following year there is a total collapse by the team, can't stop anybody, can't block, can't catch are run. The QB of this team now gets almost no criticism not blamed at all. Same QB has recently thrown to a Offensive lineman during Colts game, was seen laughing it up in Tampa with the tampa players on the field immediately after the Blowout loss. Where is the 24/7 365 days a week call for this guys head as was with the previous QB? THIS GUY HAS ALMOST 1,000.00 TURNOVERS ALREADY THROWING THEM ON OUR SIDE OF THE FIELD AT the wrong times of games!

Re: Same ol'
 

People are finally realizing its not the QB but the O-line. You can blame the coaches though for not addressing the lines more immediately.

There were some who defended Brooks play even and called out the O line back then... hmmm what was one of there names... I think it started with an E or EU something or another.

Re: Same ol'
 

Aaron Brooks! You aught to be ashamed of yourself. We had to let you go, man. Drew is loved more than you ever were. Sorry dude, you can't turn us against Drew.

Why would anyone defend AB? Never mind. This thread will get closed if we start talking about AB.

Re: Same ol'
 

That last I'd heard, Aaron Brooks got interviewed after getting the boot in Oakland - but he fumbled away the microphone before he could make any statements. Not that he knew how to make any statements anyway, other than

"duh... I'm a top five quarterback... duh... what's a wonderlic?... duh."

Trying to compare Brees to Brooks is simply ludicrous.

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Did he? I bet he flunked out.

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Paging Euphoria..... Can we get a "final-final-final" take on this idiotic topic.

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lol Brooks
Well first up I personally liked Brooks on some levels and didn't think he was the worst I had ever seen but he definitely had no zest and I agree with the rest of the guys to compare him and Brees well that's a bit off base

The only thing that was similar between the 2 was that once again the "O" lines are to blame

It comes down to this
If you can't stop a team or at the very least slow them down with your D (and the saints have non)
Then on the other side of the ball you can't block a guy that is trying to kill you QB then you are pretty much…
Pi..ing in the wind

I can say this much I personally feel that you don’t need a top of the line QB although it does help but still not 100% necessary if you have good blocking
hell Jo Blow can make a pass if he is given enough time to do so


the coaches MUST ADDRESS THESE LINE ISSUES

Re: Same ol'
 

I think the frustration is born from most people's willingness to blame Brooks for everything wrong with those Haz teams when it's pretty clear that wasn't accurate. We averaged 29 points a game a few years back with Brooks and still everything wrong with civilization got pinned on him.

Now we have a pro-bowl caliber QB who's probably thrown more crappy passes over a three game span than Brooks ever did and people are defending him. (See the tipped pass argument)

I, for one, have been pointing to the O-Line for several years now. It's as bad now as it was then, but it's no worse.

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Why? Please explain.

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Brees, bless his dink-and-dunk heart, is just one piece of a very ugly puzzle. With this crew, even if we find where everyone fits best, the picture will still be ugly.

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You just have to realize that Smiley made himself an easy target by his general demeanor during the game... especially the precious seconds immediately following one of his bad plays.
Brooks walked off the field smiling... I know, different people deal with adversity differently.
His smiling was probably just his natural reaction to stress.

Brees, the other hand, looks like someone just ran over his puppy right after he throws an INT.

It's all in perception. Most fans looked at Brooks' smiles and wanted to wring his neck, but then they see Brees make a similar throw, and when they see his face, they just want him to do better.

Someone commented about Brees talking and laughing with some of the opponents after a game... that's a sign of a good sport and of a professional. What was he supposed to do, tell them f off? That wouldn't sit well.

Re: Same ol'
 

See how those excuses flow so easily for Brees? that just what they're excuses. You should no matter get pissed if your team leader is seen laughing it up just after getting the teams butt hole ripped are right after a play, it doesn't matter but you will make an excuse for Brees like you always do!

Brees has had more turnovers this season bettering Brooks by leaps and bounds, forget the puppy...This is the same exact thing Mcnabb was talking about the treatment.

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Well, that's what LT did last year, and reviews were mixed as I recall. Believe me, I know it's all perception...been saying that for many years now. ;)

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... this is the problem when other boards start banning the whiners....

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First, it's hard for me to give up on Bress this early because we have so much invested in him. But I do totally understand where 12 gauge is coming from. I don't think he's comparing Brees to Brooks, but comparing the fans reactions in forgiving Brees and condemning Brooks. I mean, a lot of people are giving a pass and numerous excuses for a Pro Bowl QB coming off a phenomenal season with his entire arsenal intact. In three games Brees have looked as worst as Rex Grossman with no signs off turning it around, now do I think he's capable of reversing his fortunes? Yes I do. But we can't turn a blind eye to the facts, the facts are we're 0 - 3, he has 1 td and 7 int's, and if I'm not mistaken a couple of fumbles. Now if this was Brooks there would be a call for Congress to remove him from the starting lineup. And as far as dissing Brooks for smiling leaving the field after an interception, and excepting Brees smiling and laughing after a terrible loss against Tampa Bay is definitely not right, if Brooks could be seen as not caring, than Brees should be seen in the same light, just because you look pissed coming off the field doesn't mean things are going to change, because if it did we wouldn't be sitting here at 0 - 3.

Re: Same ol'
 

ok that was funny. AB=DB. what the F###. someone never watched AB play. Do not even come back and say you did. You have proven to be a poor judge of football talent. Find another position to eval. please QB is over your head.

Re: Same ol'
 

Ok so you are saying Brees sucks just as bad as Brooks not then right?

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Are you serious? You're serious, aren't you? Wow. OK, I'll give you two points.

1) Drew has been to the pro bowl - Brooks has not
2) Drew has a job - Brooks does not

Enough said.

Do you want more? You don't really want more, do you? Please don't make me start talking about backwards passes, Wonderlic tests, fumblitis, and "I'm a top five quarterback" quotes. Because it's not worth my time. You either already get it or you don't - and if you don't already get it, then no amount of persuading is going to convince you.

Re: Same ol'
 

I was about to go off but you beat me to it.
I used to back Brooks. Even when I shouldn't have. There's no question that the guy has physical talent but doggone it his brain was just wired differently. I really wanted Brooks to do well after Blake went down. He didn't. Blake may have taken the Saints further but Brooks just wasn't capable.

--saintfan

The o-line has been junk so far this year no question. But should our frustration with it conceive a Brees/Brooks comparison? Surely you jest.

Off topic, where have you been, saintfan? I appreciate your posts and have seen little of them for a while.

Re: Same ol'
 

I think you guys are off track. I don't think it should be a comparison but there are a lot of simularities of what 'some' things that happened to Brooks being behind a sorry line and Brees being behind a very similar line. I don't think you can compare the 2 QB's but you can look at there play and see simularities and I can see Brooks having the same issues.

I'd have to say if we actually had a great line Brooks could have very well lead a team to a SB... hell Grossman did.

Re: Same ol'
 

So you can't compare two QB's if one has been to the pro-bowl and the other has not? That's interesting...and not true.

So you can't compare two QB's if one is currently on a roster and the other isn't? That is also interesting...and also not true, but carry on.

Oh I get it LOE, and your post is exhibit A. Fact is, Brooks played behind a horrible O-Line too, and you never heard about it...no...all you heard was Wonderlic scores (which make next to no matter) and media quotes which had nothing to do with on the field performance.

Yes, Brees is a pro-bowl QB. No one is arguing that. Point is Brees' performance over the first three games of this season compares to some of the worst I've ever seen by any QB. How about you? Now, since you seem to think Brooks is one of the worlds worst QB's lets compare. Find me three consecutive games where Brooks had a 1/7 TD to INT ratio otherwise I guess you're right and we can't compare...I mean that is what you're saying right?

Buh Bye

Re: Same ol'
 

I said comparing Brees to Brooks is ludicrous - and I meant it. And I stand by that - because Brooks is not even in the same ballpark as Brees. Literally. Brooks is unemployed for a reason. He had his chance, multiple chances - and fizzled. It's simply ludicrous to compare them.

I'm not going to argue that Brees has played well. He most certainly has not. And agreed, whether Brees is probowl caliber or not, no one would play well behind this O Line. I don't care if it was Brees, Brooks, Montana, Marino, or God himself.

"Brooks played behind a horrible O-Line too, and you never heard about it" -- tha's because everyone was already busy - busy talking about how STUPID Brooks was. He played like a moron. All the physically attributes in the world, could've been a star - but instead he was hamstrung by a sixth grade mentally-handicapped moron. And I know. I met him. I spoke with him. Not only was he slow - he was a complete mental disaster. A poster child special education. I've encoutered rocks with more intellectual capacity.

And I believe THAT is why you didn't hear about the O Line in his day.

Please.... let this topic die. We'll have to agree to disagree. This is getting old.

Re: Same ol'
 

I see your point 12 guage. It is not a comparison of Brooks and Brees as QB's, it is the contrast of how the fans react to similiar stimuli. It is what it is....

Re: Same ol'
 

No back during that time there were several people here, well not many but there were a few of us screaming it was the Lines and the JERKS only wanted to blame brooks and not look at the big picture. Now that there QB is looking shell-shocked the same way Brooks looked at times they want to put the blame else where. But I am here to tell you back then we have O LINE problems and we still do.

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Yeah, but at least we don't have to look at his stupid assed grin when he screwed up. Good ridance to AB. He doing well now, he's flipping burgers with Elvis.

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I don't know I recall in another thread someone pointing out after the tampa game Brees and a grin and talking it up with the bucs.

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After the game is one thing, during what is supposed to be the heat of battle is another.

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... why am I getting into this .... why am I getting into this...

...oh well...

What really started the criticism of Brooks -leadership- was what he said after Turley came to his aid in the Jets game. Heavy criticism on his play didn't really start until the 2002 season, and it started mainly because he had all the physical skills you could ask for in a QB, but didn't know how to use them to effectively be a QB in the NFL. Just imagine if Brees was 6'4" and could launch it 70 yards off his back foot...

... and as usual, at one point it turned into a racial thing, because some black people cannot stand hearing any white people criticizing a brotha, because that's racist, ya know? White people should not even look funny at black people , because that's racist. If you are white, you are supposed to say only good things about back pleople, and forgive black people of any wrongdoing, because they are black.

... myself, I am going to see how this season turns out, before I start making any comments about Drew Brees. After all, he's played 21 games as a Saint, and Brooks had 5 years.
"Yeah, but Brooks is black, TR"..
Oh, my bad. In that case... The ***** set him up!!!!!

Re: Same ol'
 

ROFL

I wouldn't want that burger. I'm sure it's been fumbled to the floor multiple times.

Re: Same ol'
 

You said it, and you meant it. Yippie for you! I wonder if by 'fizzled' you mean, oh, I don't know, something like the way Brees is playing at the moment?

Now, would you compare Brees to Marino? Careful, cause the 'ol wonderlic argument will bite you square on the 'ol buttocks, you know?

You say Brooks was 'STUPID' based on your opinion of him when you met him. Wonder what he thought of you...or did you have the Brass One's at that moment to tell him how you feel...or did you shake his hand? Why might I think of you pending your answer? Makes me wonder...but I bet I know.

Still waiting on you to answer a simple question: Did Brooks ever have three games as bad as Brees' last three...or maybe even 4 counting the Chicago game last year? Never you mind, because we all know the answer.

You do know Brooks led the team to an AVERAGE of 29 points a game in his second to last year here don't you? Not too shabby for a, um...'MORON'. Stupid is as Stupid does eh? Our defense cost us that season, plain and simple, and yet you guys...and yes you were one of them...consistently redirected the issue to the QB.

Keep in mind, I'm not calling out Brees. I'm a fan of the man. See, I recognize there are many factors that reflect the play of a given player. Some don't. No problem. And that, my friend, is what's really ludicrous. :)

Re: Same ol'
 

Thanks for the shout ice. I've been around. Got banned for taking it to a few moderators here and there, but I've been lurking everywhere. I've been extremely busy the last year and a half since the company I work for got bought out. Just been watching some of these arguments since we've been playing so poorly and can't...hold...it...back...no...mo!

Re: Same ol'
 

"... and as usual, at one point it turned into a racial thing, because some black people cannot stand hearing any white people criticizing a brotha, because that's racist, ya know? White people should not even look funny at black people , because that's racist. If you are white, you are supposed to say only good things about back pleople, and forgive black people of any wrongdoing, because they are black."

WTF are we coming to here?

Apparently, there are folks here that have 'issues' that go FAR beyond disagreeing on parity of treatment of QB's. This, and some of the other things I've read on this thread is nothing but venom. Pure and simple. Perhaps the moderator needs to kill this thread before it really gets stuck on stupid.

Sadly, I come to these boards to commiserate with fellow B&G followers and discuss the game we all love. I don't expect everyone to hold hands and sing 'We Are the World', but thinly veiled bigotry on either side really has NO place here.

Excuse me while I try to figure out where this all went wrong...

Re: Same ol'
 

..and apparently, these folks are Mexican, and see the race issue on a different light.

Re: Same ol'
 

What's going on? This is what's called an 0-3 start. You know where everyone turns into a head coach. Same as it was before and during the draft. I don't mind the differing opinions, after all opinions are like a_sholes, everybody's got one and they all usually stink. When the debate turns nasty or gets out of hand, i'll just lock the thread. So you guys play nice.

Re: Same ol'
 

Please check your history SF. I was one of the supporters of Brooks. You don't remember that, do you? I once posted he was sufficient to get us to the SB, if the rest of the team played well. And I was most definitely %100 wrong, humiliated I am that I ever said that. It was only later that I learned what a complete failure that man was.

So please, before you bash me in the future, make sure what you're saying is actually correct.

Re: Same ol'
 

It's everyone's fault but most importantly the coaching staff. After game one Payton had an idea his game plans from last year would not work, we all did and he should really know that last year leftovers are not going to work this year after getting raped by the Bucs and Titans on Monday night in September no less.

Coach change the game plan dramatically or the season is lost.