Offensive Playcall Concerns

Cruize · 10-05-2009, 08:26 AM

When Bell gets healthy, they should pound teams with the run and pass off that. And get Bush to call Tiki Barber. He was on the way out of the NFL before he learned how to carry and protect the ball.

skymike · 10-05-2009, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by Saint_LB

If Carney can't make 'em from 47, then we need to get Hartley back.

Carney can make 53. Saw him do it a couple of times yesterday easily, and I think he's stable enough to do the same thing in a game that he does in warmups.

Wasnt Hartley missing extra points in preseason?

gumbeau · 10-05-2009, 08:28 AM

Um.....the Saints kicker is a little old and doesn't have the range to kick from past about the 30 yard line so some of that "take the points" is really "punt" or worse miss the field goal and spot the other side with good field position.

If the Saints had a big leg kicker I guarantee Payton takes a shot at a couple field goals but with the NFL Methuselah field goals need to be close in.

Special Teams is the weakness on this Saints team and Payton seems to realize that.

FrenzyFan · 10-05-2009, 08:29 AM

I gotta say that you have to give credit to the Jets D, they are awesome. That being said, the Bills also made our offense disappear. Two weeks now without any offense to speak of, it's enough to make one worry. Something is wrong. Is it our LT missing that's leading to this far more conservative style? Is it the strategy used by the two defenses who have shut us down (neither seemed to worry much about pressure and instead played a lot of bump and run with a lot of people dropping into coverage)? Whatever it is, a good coach adjusts and I'll be keenly watching to see if we can adjust and turn our offense back on. The defense won't play rookies and backups all year.

Saint_LB · 10-05-2009, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by gumbeau

Um.....the Saints kicker is a little old and doesn't have the range to kick from past about the 30 yard line so some of that "take the points" is really "punt" or worse miss the field goal and spot the other side with good field position.

If the Saints had a big leg kicker I guarantee Payton takes a shot at a couple field goals but with the NFL Methuselah field goals need to be close in.

Special Teams is the weakness on this Saints team and Payton seems to realize that.

I think he makes it from the 1 for sure, though.

CantonLegend · 10-05-2009, 08:34 AM

Originally Posted by skymike

Carney can make 53. Saw him do it a couple of times yesterday easily, and I think he's stable enough to do the same thing in a game that he does in warmups.

Wasnt Hartley missing extra points in preseason?

hartley went 2 for 4 on FG attempts before his suspension this preseason

carney went 1 for 2 on FG attempts in the preseason

now carney has already missed a field goal in the regular season

im not saying payton doesnt trust carney.....but coaches know when to take the points and when we were only a TD up it was smarter to take the points....we didnt kick it and i think thats because of paytons lack of trust in carney

Crusader · 10-05-2009, 08:34 AM

Not getting it on 4th down is a matter of the Jets having a damn good D-line and our O-line not generating enough push, nothing wrong with the playcall. Our OL is getting there thou and soon we will convert more of those than we fail.

saintsfan1976 · 10-05-2009, 08:39 AM

Originally Posted by FrenzyFan

I gotta say that you have to give credit to the Jets D, they are awesome. That being said, the Bills also made our offense disappear. Two weeks now without any offense to speak of, it's enough to make one worry. Something is wrong. Is it our LT missing that's leading to this far more conservative style? Is it the strategy used by the two defenses who have shut us down (neither seemed to worry much about pressure and instead played a lot of bump and run with a lot of people dropping into coverage)? Whatever it is, a good coach adjusts and I'll be keenly watching to see if we can adjust and turn our offense back on. The defense won't play rookies and backups all year.

I disagree that our offense has disappeared. The rushing game has been stronger than ever and our pass plays are calculated and they get positive yards. I think Payton is finally confident in the defense and doesn't have to take as many risks as before. The motto now is "control" vs "air it out"

skymike · 10-05-2009, 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by gumbeau

Um.....the Saints kicker is a little old and doesn't have the range to kick from past about the 30 yard line ....

negative.

Like I said in another thread, Carney's range, as he demonstrates in warmups is 53. Solid. It wasnt longshot kicking, or taking a crack at it. It was solid. The snap for 53 is from the 35 yard line, which is only a few yards less than average. The Jets kicker, whoever he was, attempted a long FG in warmups from 55 only--- and he was missing.

In kicking, age is much less a factor than psyche. I'll take an old guy that's been there, dealt with the pressure, and missed an extra point in Jacksonville, over a whippersnapper w/ a bigger leg.

Morten kicked well into his 40s-- effectively. George Blanda kicked at 50.
And dammit, 40 is not old, ok? This is getting personal now.

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976

The motto now is "control" vs "air it out"

Yeah, but "air it out" is so fun. ... and scary...

fhotard · 10-05-2009, 10:10 AM

I loved the fact that they went for it on 4th and 1 at the goal line!

Were we up 10 nothing at that point? I can't remember for sure...
If you take 3 there, Jets need only two TD's to take the lead.

The fact that they didn't make the TD on 4th down resulted in the Jets being pinned at their own goal line, with a rookie QB, on the road, in a dome, against an aggressive D. It was a recipe for success in my opinion.

10-05-2009, 08:26 AM	#21
Cruize 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,457	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns When Bell gets healthy, they should pound teams with the run and pass off that. And get Bush to call Tiki Barber. He was on the way out of the NFL before he learned how to carry and protect the ball.
Cruize 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,457

10-05-2009, 08:26 AM	#22
skymike E. Side Cholo Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: The Barrio, H-town Posts: 6,089	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns Originally Posted by Saint_LB If Carney can't make 'em from 47, then we need to get Hartley back. Carney can make 53. Saw him do it a couple of times yesterday easily, and I think he's stable enough to do the same thing in a game that he does in warmups. Wasnt Hartley missing extra points in preseason?

10-05-2009, 08:28 AM	#23
gumbeau Where Y'at? Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Republic of Texas Posts: 519	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns Um.....the Saints kicker is a little old and doesn't have the range to kick from past about the 30 yard line so some of that "take the points" is really "punt" or worse miss the field goal and spot the other side with good field position. If the Saints had a big leg kicker I guarantee Payton takes a shot at a couple field goals but with the NFL Methuselah field goals need to be close in. Special Teams is the weakness on this Saints team and Payton seems to realize that.

10-05-2009, 08:29 AM	#24
FrenzyFan 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 406	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns I gotta say that you have to give credit to the Jets D, they are awesome. That being said, the Bills also made our offense disappear. Two weeks now without any offense to speak of, it's enough to make one worry. Something is wrong. Is it our LT missing that's leading to this far more conservative style? Is it the strategy used by the two defenses who have shut us down (neither seemed to worry much about pressure and instead played a lot of bump and run with a lot of people dropping into coverage)? Whatever it is, a good coach adjusts and I'll be keenly watching to see if we can adjust and turn our offense back on. The defense won't play rookies and backups all year.
FrenzyFan 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 406	\"The AB brand of TP will hurt your O-ring.\" - BlackandBlue http://www.darrylbercegeay.com/wsmith1.jpg

10-05-2009, 08:30 AM	#25
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns Originally Posted by gumbeau Um.....the Saints kicker is a little old and doesn't have the range to kick from past about the 30 yard line so some of that "take the points" is really "punt" or worse miss the field goal and spot the other side with good field position. If the Saints had a big leg kicker I guarantee Payton takes a shot at a couple field goals but with the NFL Methuselah field goals need to be close in. Special Teams is the weakness on this Saints team and Payton seems to realize that. I think he makes it from the 1 for sure, though.
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894

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10-05-2009, 08:34 AM	#26
CantonLegend 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Canton, Ohio Posts: 2,685 Blog Entries: 2	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns Originally Posted by skymike Carney can make 53. Saw him do it a couple of times yesterday easily, and I think he's stable enough to do the same thing in a game that he does in warmups. Wasnt Hartley missing extra points in preseason? hartley went 2 for 4 on FG attempts before his suspension this preseason carney went 1 for 2 on FG attempts in the preseason now carney has already missed a field goal in the regular season im not saying payton doesnt trust carney.....but coaches know when to take the points and when we were only a TD up it was smarter to take the points....we didnt kick it and i think thats because of paytons lack of trust in carney

10-05-2009, 08:34 AM	#27
Crusader Resident Swede Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Märsta, Sweden Posts: 8,025	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns Not getting it on 4th down is a matter of the Jets having a damn good D-line and our O-line not generating enough push, nothing wrong with the playcall. Our OL is getting there thou and soon we will convert more of those than we fail.

10-05-2009, 08:39 AM	#28
saintsfan1976 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 10,832 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns Originally Posted by FrenzyFan I gotta say that you have to give credit to the Jets D, they are awesome. That being said, the Bills also made our offense disappear. Two weeks now without any offense to speak of, it's enough to make one worry. Something is wrong. Is it our LT missing that's leading to this far more conservative style? Is it the strategy used by the two defenses who have shut us down (neither seemed to worry much about pressure and instead played a lot of bump and run with a lot of people dropping into coverage)? Whatever it is, a good coach adjusts and I'll be keenly watching to see if we can adjust and turn our offense back on. The defense won't play rookies and backups all year. I disagree that our offense has disappeared. The rushing game has been stronger than ever and our pass plays are calculated and they get positive yards. I think Payton is finally confident in the defense and doesn't have to take as many risks as before. The motto now is "control" vs "air it out"

10-05-2009, 08:49 AM	#29
skymike E. Side Cholo Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: The Barrio, H-town Posts: 6,089	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns Originally Posted by gumbeau Um.....the Saints kicker is a little old and doesn't have the range to kick from past about the 30 yard line .... negative. Like I said in another thread, Carney's range, as he demonstrates in warmups is 53. Solid. It wasnt longshot kicking, or taking a crack at it. It was solid. The snap for 53 is from the 35 yard line, which is only a few yards less than average. The Jets kicker, whoever he was, attempted a long FG in warmups from 55 only--- and he was missing. In kicking, age is much less a factor than psyche. I'll take an old guy that's been there, dealt with the pressure, and missed an extra point in Jacksonville, over a whippersnapper w/ a bigger leg. Morten kicked well into his 40s-- effectively. George Blanda kicked at 50. And dammit, 40 is not old, ok? This is getting personal now. Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 The motto now is "control" vs "air it out" Yeah, but "air it out" is so fun. ... and scary...

10-05-2009, 10:10 AM	#30
fhotard 100th Post Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Pensacola, FL Posts: 263	Re: Offensive Playcall Concerns I loved the fact that they went for it on 4th and 1 at the goal line! Were we up 10 nothing at that point? I can't remember for sure... If you take 3 there, Jets need only two TD's to take the lead. The fact that they didn't make the TD on 4th down resulted in the Jets being pinned at their own goal line, with a rookie QB, on the road, in a dome, against an aggressive D. It was a recipe for success in my opinion.