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Perceptions aside, nothing soft about Saints

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; NEW ORLEANS -- Can somebody explain something to me? Why does the mention of the word finesse incite so much anger inside an NFL locker room? Last time I checked, this was the definition of the word: Refinement and delicacy ...

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Old 10-18-2009, 10:02 PM   #1
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NEW ORLEANS -- Can somebody explain something to me? Why does the mention of the word finesse incite so much anger inside an NFL locker room?

Last time I checked, this was the definition of the word: Refinement and delicacy of performance, execution, or artisanship.

Does it say soft there? Or sissy? Or that other word players hate that we can't print here?

I just watched a team finesse the heck out of a supposedly physical team here Sunday. Final score: Finesse 48, New York Giants 27.

That's right, the New Orleans Saints finessed their way to 48 points, which is also the reason they are 5-0 and can stake a real claim as the best team in the NFL.

There is nothing wrong with it, either.

After watching the Saints offense carve up the Giants' top-ranked defense at the Superdome to the tune of 493 yards, and watching Drew Brees and that precision passing game rack up 369 passing yards and four touchdown passes, who cares if they are a finesse team?

"It doesn't matter if we finesse-ively kick their asses," Saints defensive end Bobby McCray said, making up a word in the process.

Yet there is a general perception that it does matter. A story in the New Orleans Times-Picayune on Sunday had this message: "Let's Get Physical," explaining, "The New Orleans Saints would like to dispel notion they are a finesse team. They won't have a better opportunity than today against the rugged New York Giants".

Saints coach Sean Payton took exception to it, and fired off a jab after his team's impressive performance against the Giants.

"I've read some of that stuff," he said. "We play a lot of physical teams here. We try not to pay attention to some of that. I don't know if it's really accurate."

Two weeks ago, the Saints beat up one of those supposed tough-guy teams, the New York Jets.

That was a far different style than what they used against the Giants. This time, it was more of the Payton-led Saints we've come to expect, which is an aggressive passing game triggered by Brees.

From the opening kickoff, Brees sat back and picked on a Giants secondary that has been hit by injuries. If they were hurting going in, they left a bloodied mess.


Brees sat in the pocket and played pitch-and-catch with his receivers, who were seemingly wide open all day. Aside from a pinpoint pass or two, Brees had no difficulty finding open targets. Marques Colston had eight catches for 166 yards and a touchdown. Lance Moore, Jeremy Shockey and Robert Meachem also caught touchdown passes from Brees, who finished with a nearly perfect passer rating of 156.8.

The Saints came into this game with the idea they could attack the Giants safeties. To do so takes time. Against a fierce Giants front, that's risky.

The Saints offensive line was more than up to the task. The Giants didn't get a sack -- and they probably didn't get close enough to know if Brees was even sweating. By the looks of it, he wasn't. There were many times it seemed like Brees could spell the word finesse twice before anybody came close to him.

"We did a great job, a great job, in protection," Payton said.

At one point, Brees hit 15 consecutive passes, with the incomplete pass that snapped the streak actually getting batted back into his face. If not for that, it would have been another touchdown since the receiver was breaking clear.

"If you give [Brees] and that offense enough time, that's not good," Giants defensive end Osi Umenyiora said.

The Saints also ran the ball for 133 yards, while limiting the Giants to 84 rushing yards. Those aren't soft numbers.

So why, then, is this considered a finesse team? It's because it is a pass-first team. Hate to tell you, but if that's the case, finesse -- thanks to all the rules changes -- is the way to go.

Just because you throw it doesn't mean you're soft. The Saints showed that with the way they played up front against the two teams from New Jersey the past two games.

Yet when I went around the locker room asking Saints players why hearing the word finesse next to their team name upset them, it only seemed to ignite them.

"What's wrong with being called a finesse team?" Saints offensive tackle Jon Stinchcomb said, repeating my question. "We're men out here. No man wants to be called finesse."

Next to him, offensive lineman Zach Strief could only concur.

"It's not what you want to hear," he said.

There have been a lot of good teams that have been considered finesse teams. The San Francisco 49ers dynasty was considered a finesse team for the most part, even if it did feature Ronnie Lott and some other good players on defense.

The Indianapolis Colts, in the Peyton Manning era, have been considered a finesse team. Didn't the New England Patriots finesse their way to a 16-0 regular season in 2007?

Precision passing teams often translate into being considered finesse teams. So if you pound it into the middle of the line for 100 yards, that's better than throwing it to score? It makes no sense.

Payton once told me he would take the two-play drive to a touchdown rather than a 12-play drive to a field goal any day. Who wouldn't? But we have this perception that tough-guy football is all about 12-play, smash-it-at you drives, even if it doesn't lead to a touchdown.

It's about scoring points and winning.

Being a finesse team does not mean you're a sissy team, or that other word that will challenge anybody's manhood.

I get it. The NFL is about macho. Who wants to be called finesse, especially when it's viewed as being such a negative thing inside NFL locker rooms?

"You can't get me to say that's a good thing being called that," Stinchcomb said.

Trust me, it isn't a bad thing.

What that word means for the Saints is that they are a precision passing team that is led by one of the game's best passers, who has his plays called by the NFL's best play-caller.

If that makes them a finesse team, so be it. Will it matter if they finesse-ively get to their asses to the Super Bowl?

Perceptions aside, nothing soft about Saints - NFL - CBSSports.com Football

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Old 10-18-2009, 10:33 PM   #2
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Re: Perceptions aside, nothing soft about Saints

I love this quote
"It doesn't matter if we finesse-ively kick their asses," Saints defensive end Bobby McCray said, making up a word in the process.
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Old 10-19-2009, 04:45 PM   #3
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Re: Perceptions aside, nothing soft about Saints

[QUOTE=QBREES9;170997]NEW ORLEANS -- Can somebody explain something to me? Why does the mention of the word finesse incite so much anger inside an NFL locker room?

Last time I checked, this was the definition of the word: Refinement and delicacy of performance, execution, or artisanship.

The words finesse and delicacy might not be seen as very intimidating or tough. JMO.
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