thoughts on saints after final cuts?

FWtex · 09-01-2003, 12:40 AM

Final cuts are in and except for a couple moves over the next week we now see what the saints put together for this year. Are you Impressed?

I am not! I hate always sounding like a pessimist this year but I don't see any reason why I should be optimistic about this team. Saints knew in the middle of last season what their weaknesses were and what they needed to improve. I don't see where they made any progress at all in those areas. I think the roster today is worse then the roster the team started with last year.

QB - same as last year --good
rb - no depth, deuce is da stud though!
wr - same as last year ---good
OL - same as last year -- maybe a little worse,
Def. line - a little more improved but nothing great -- yet?
LB - a make shift group, may be faster but none would be a starter on many other teams
CB - dale carter and a group of players who would not start elsewhere, no depth
safety- - T-buck is an improvement but then what?

Head coach - same as last year -- appears weak, In offseason brought in other coaches to help teach him and his staff. ?? What the F___?
Off Coord - same as last year ---half season wonder? can he adjust game plan or will he be just as predictable?
def. Coord - same as last year --- any sign he knows what he is doing? Can he translate the schemes in his head onto the field?
Asst coaches - same as last year

From my view I don't see any improvement from last year. If you asked Haslett if he thought this team is good enough to win the NFC what do you think his honest answer would be?

[Edited on 1/9/2003 by FWtex]

BillyCarpenter1 · 09-01-2003, 01:39 AM

That\'s a good assessment. Now here\'s mine.

With all the problems this team had last year-- that most everyone wants to dwell on -- Don\'t forget this team was 1- game away from the playoffs. Don\'t forget they beat Green Bay, San Francisco, Pittsburg, and Tampa twice. Don\'t forget that Duece and Aaron had significant injuries that played a part in them losing down the stretch last year.

This team didn\'t just automatically get bad over night. As a matter-of-fact, I think if not for the injuries to Aaron, Duece, and Stallworth that the Saints would have easily gotten into the playoffs last year.

People analyze the December collapse and try to figure out what happened. Well, has anyone been able to figure it out? There is no figuring it out!! There were so many things that happend towards the end of last year, that there is no one anwser.

I\'ve heard everyone question the play calling, lack of leadership, and everything else under the sun. Of course everyone leaves out the fact that when all the starters were healthy on offense that we were almost unstopable. Go back and look at the point where the Saints started losing last year. I bet it\'s the same time that Aaron, Duece and Stallworth got hurt. Of course, I guess that\'s minor compared to the other reasons everyone else gives.

We will be just fine.

Record after Aaron and Duece got hurt 2-5

11/17 17-24 L at ATL (Duece McAllister Injuried)
11/24 15-24 L CLE
12/01 23-20 W TB ( Aaron Brooks Injuried)
12/08 37-25 W at BAL
12/15 31-32 L MIN
12/22 13-20 L at CIN
12/29 6-10 L CAR

Record before Duece and Aaron were hurt 7-2

09/08 26-20 W at TB
09/15 35-20 W GB
09/22 29-23 W at CHI
09/29 21-26 L at DET
0/06 32-29 W PIT
10/13 43-27 W at WAS
10/20 35-27 W SF
10/27 35-37 L ATL
11/10 34-24 W at CAR

[Edited on 1/9/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]

rusta · 09-01-2003, 09:13 AM

thank you billy

i have been saying the same thing for months but i never even get a reply, i guess it\'s because no one can argue with what was just said

no team is perfect which seems to be what these guys want, tampa won it all last year and their offense was barely adequete at best

thank god it\'s less than a week till the season, i think i\'m gonna explode

whowatches · 09-01-2003, 10:36 AM

Part of what you show us with last year\'s record, Billy, proves Tex\'s point. The team did go into a tailspin when the big two got hurt. While I feel good about the backup QB situation, the RB depth is horrible. I believe what Tex is trying to say is that the organization knew that RB depth was horrible at the end of last season, yet, here we are a week before the first game with only two running backs on the roster who know the system.

Is it irrational to expect that the coaches/management address this situation differently?

Also, I agree that the same thing applies to the LB situation, although I do admit we brought two guys on (Rodgers and Ruff) who add depth. Rodgers will be a starter all year and may be a steal. Ruff has already lost the competition to start to a thirty-four year old.

As far as the secondary goes, Jones was an outstanding addition, but, once again, we have no depth.

These problems are not surprises. We knew about them at the end of last season (which was November for us), and little was done to remedy them.

tweeky · 09-01-2003, 10:53 AM

Man this is getting old and worn out.
But I\'ll give it one last try TEX

QB - same as last year --good
BETTER, DEEPER
rb - no depth, deuce is da stud though!
Keaton was a bust, not our fault, his. We still plan to improve
wr - same as last year ---good
Good? how about GREAT, and now DEEPER.
OL - same as last year -- maybe a little worse,
SAME? We are much better without the POSER on our team now. I saw him get ragdolled every other play. A BUST at LT. Hmmm, I wonder how he\'s doing at left tackle in St Louis?
Def. line - a little more improved but nothing great -- yet?
LITTLE? after the debacle last year I\'d have to say this years line is DRASTICALLY improved.
LB - a make shift group, may be faster but none would be a starter on many other teams
We got rid of a flop who\'s now starting on another team.
CB - dale carter and a group of players who would not start elsewhere, no depth
safety- - T-buck is an improvement but then what?
Depth at Safety was never a concern for anybody until our starter got injured and out for the year. I guess you saw that coming though?

Head coach - same as last year -- appears weak, In offseason brought in other coaches to help teach him and his staff. ?? What the F___?
See Haslett/Venturi thread
Off Coord - same as last year ---half season wonder? can he adjust game plan or will he be just as predictable?
Probably the only thing you said with any originality and insight
def. Coord - same as last year --- any sign he knows what he is doing? Can he translate the schemes in his head onto the field?
OK probably the 2nd thing, but the jury is still out on him, see Haslett/Venturi thread
Asst coaches - same as last year
So What

From my view I don\'t see any improvement from last year.
What view do you have, the nosebleeds?
If you asked Haslett if he thought this team is good enough to win the NFC what do you think his honest answer would be?
Absolutely positively YES!

If you can\'t see the improvements, its because you choose not to.

[Edited on 1/9/2003 by tweeky]

BillyCarpenter1 · 09-01-2003, 10:59 AM

Let\'s put it this way. If you take Kurt Warner, Marshall Faulk, and Tory Holt out of the Rams starting offense. How do you think they would do? I think that question has already been answered.

Or, take Brad Johnson, Warren Sapp, and Simen Rice away from Tampa and how do you think they would do?

As far as us getting a back-up running back -- there are plenty of very good back-ups out there and they will have plenty of time to learn the offense.

Also the Saints signed plenty of players to address the defensive problems. They just didn\'t sign the players most fans coveted.

[Edited on 1/9/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]

nocloning · 09-01-2003, 11:10 AM

We are much better without the POSER on our team now. I saw him get ragdolled every other play. A BUST at LT. Hmmm, I wonder how he\'s doing at left tackle in St Louis?

Pace is back. And Turley is a good RT, he\'ll do fine until his ego takes over.

FWtex · 09-01-2003, 01:01 PM

I do not believe in the theory of looking at back at last years team and playing the \"IF\" game. \"IFs\" are going to happen every year and beleive it or not but good teams prepare for the \"IFs\". The organization did not address the \"IFs\" that surfaced last year.

Here is pPart of Billy\'s post with a few changes.
---------------------------------------------
With all the problems this team had last year-- that most everyone DWELLS on -- Don\'t forget this team LOST TO ATL TWICE, CLEVE, MINN, CINN, AND CAR TO FINISH 1 GAME OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS. Don\'t forget that Duece and Aaron had significant injuries that played a part in them losing down the stretch last year.
---------------------------------------------

And a few remarks on tweeks observations.

rb - no depth, deuce is da stud though!
Keaton was a bust, not our fault, his. We still plan to improve
SO BUSTS ARE NO LONGER THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE EVALUATION STAFF? PLAN??? IT IS WAY PAST TIME TO PLAN THIS YEAR.

wr - same as last year ---good
Good? how about GREAT, and now DEEPER.
THIS IS WAS NOT A PROBLEM AREA, STILL ISN\'T

OL - same as last year -- maybe a little worse,
SAME? We are much better without the POSER on our team now. I saw him get ragdolled every other play. A BUST at LT. Hmmm, I wonder how he\'s doing at left tackle in St Louis?
I AM NOT CONCERNED HOW TURLEY IS PLAYING AT ST. LOU. WATCH AND SEE HOW MANY BIG PLAYS GET CALLED BACK BECAUSE OF HOLDING THIS YEAR.

Def. line - a little more improved but nothing great -- yet?
LITTLE? after the debacle last year I\'d have to say this years line is DRASTICALLY improved.
SAINTS SWAP SULLY FOR HAND AND YOU SAY THAT IS A DRASTIC IMPROVEMENT?

LB - a make shift group, may be faster but none would be a starter on many other teams
We got rid of a flop who\'s now starting on another team.
GOT RID OF A FLOP AND PICKED UP ANOTHER. ??

safety- - T-buck is an improvement but then what?
Depth at Safety was never a concern for anybody until our starter got injured and out for the year. I guess you saw that coming though?
INJURIES ARE A FLUKE OCCURENCE IN THE NFL I GUESS? STILL THE QUESTION IS BETTER OR WORSE?

From my view I don\'t see any improvement from last year.
What view do you have, the nosebleeds?
AND HOW IS YOUR VIEWPOINT ANY BETTER?

If you asked Haslett if he thought this team is good enough to win the NFC what do you think his honest answer would be?
Absolutely positively YES!
I SAID \"HONEST\" ANSWER!

If you can\'t see the improvements, its because you choose not to.
If you see the improvements, its because you choose not to SEE THE FLAWS.

tweeky · 09-01-2003, 01:27 PM

FWtex, using your logic and given about 1 hour, I can make all 32 teams look like a bunch of losers based on their off-season acquisitions. Especially using the \"our back-ups at position X aren\'t up to snuff, what was our GM thinking?\" line.
But its too old, boring, and way too played out.

All 53 players can\'t be pro-bowlers. Its tiring arguing with fans that can\'t understand that.
Here\'s a thought,
Why don\'t we try to get
Donovan McNabb
Terrell Owens,
Marvin Harrison,
Rickey Williams,
O. Pace,
Ray Lewis,
Zack Thomas
Derrick Brooks.
Waren Sapp,
Anthony McFarland,
and Michael Stahan.

We must have incompetant Boobs running this outfit.

BillyCarpenter1 · 09-01-2003, 01:37 PM

Tweeky -- I started to say the same thing. But, my head is hurting from banging it up against the wall.

I think anyone who say\'s the Saints don\'t have a chance at going to the playoffs don\'t know what the hell they\'re talking about.

Some people are just going to complain no matter what. They are going to look very foolish come Sunday and hopefully we won\'t have to hear all that whining anymore.

09-01-2003, 12:40 AM	#1
FWtex 100th Post Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 370	thoughts on saints after final cuts? Final cuts are in and except for a couple moves over the next week we now see what the saints put together for this year. Are you Impressed? I am not! I hate always sounding like a pessimist this year but I don't see any reason why I should be optimistic about this team. Saints knew in the middle of last season what their weaknesses were and what they needed to improve. I don't see where they made any progress at all in those areas. I think the roster today is worse then the roster the team started with last year. QB - same as last year --good rb - no depth, deuce is da stud though! wr - same as last year ---good OL - same as last year -- maybe a little worse, Def. line - a little more improved but nothing great -- yet? LB - a make shift group, may be faster but none would be a starter on many other teams CB - dale carter and a group of players who would not start elsewhere, no depth safety- - T-buck is an improvement but then what? Head coach - same as last year -- appears weak, In offseason brought in other coaches to help teach him and his staff. ?? What the F___? Off Coord - same as last year ---half season wonder? can he adjust game plan or will he be just as predictable? def. Coord - same as last year --- any sign he knows what he is doing? Can he translate the schemes in his head onto the field? Asst coaches - same as last year From my view I don't see any improvement from last year. If you asked Haslett if he thought this team is good enough to win the NFC what do you think his honest answer would be? [Edited on 1/9/2003 by FWtex]
FWtex 100th Post Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 370

09-01-2003, 01:39 AM	#2
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	thoughts on saints after final cuts? That\'s a good assessment. Now here\'s mine. With all the problems this team had last year-- that most everyone wants to dwell on -- Don\'t forget this team was 1- game away from the playoffs. Don\'t forget they beat Green Bay, San Francisco, Pittsburg, and Tampa twice. Don\'t forget that Duece and Aaron had significant injuries that played a part in them losing down the stretch last year. This team didn\'t just automatically get bad over night. As a matter-of-fact, I think if not for the injuries to Aaron, Duece, and Stallworth that the Saints would have easily gotten into the playoffs last year. People analyze the December collapse and try to figure out what happened. Well, has anyone been able to figure it out? There is no figuring it out!! There were so many things that happend towards the end of last year, that there is no one anwser. I\'ve heard everyone question the play calling, lack of leadership, and everything else under the sun. Of course everyone leaves out the fact that when all the starters were healthy on offense that we were almost unstopable. Go back and look at the point where the Saints started losing last year. I bet it\'s the same time that Aaron, Duece and Stallworth got hurt. Of course, I guess that\'s minor compared to the other reasons everyone else gives. We will be just fine. Record after Aaron and Duece got hurt 2-5 11/17 17-24 L at ATL (Duece McAllister Injuried) 11/24 15-24 L CLE 12/01 23-20 W TB ( Aaron Brooks Injuried) 12/08 37-25 W at BAL 12/15 31-32 L MIN 12/22 13-20 L at CIN 12/29 6-10 L CAR Record before Duece and Aaron were hurt 7-2 09/08 26-20 W at TB 09/15 35-20 W GB 09/22 29-23 W at CHI 09/29 21-26 L at DET 0/06 32-29 W PIT 10/13 43-27 W at WAS 10/20 35-27 W SF 10/27 35-37 L ATL 11/10 34-24 W at CAR [Edited on 1/9/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

09-01-2003, 09:13 AM	#3
rusta 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 361	thoughts on saints after final cuts? thank you billy i have been saying the same thing for months but i never even get a reply, i guess it\'s because no one can argue with what was just said no team is perfect which seems to be what these guys want, tampa won it all last year and their offense was barely adequete at best thank god it\'s less than a week till the season, i think i\'m gonna explode
rusta 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 361

09-01-2003, 10:36 AM	#4
whowatches 500th Post Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 575	thoughts on saints after final cuts? Part of what you show us with last year\'s record, Billy, proves Tex\'s point. The team did go into a tailspin when the big two got hurt. While I feel good about the backup QB situation, the RB depth is horrible. I believe what Tex is trying to say is that the organization knew that RB depth was horrible at the end of last season, yet, here we are a week before the first game with only two running backs on the roster who know the system. Is it irrational to expect that the coaches/management address this situation differently? Also, I agree that the same thing applies to the LB situation, although I do admit we brought two guys on (Rodgers and Ruff) who add depth. Rodgers will be a starter all year and may be a steal. Ruff has already lost the competition to start to a thirty-four year old. As far as the secondary goes, Jones was an outstanding addition, but, once again, we have no depth. These problems are not surprises. We knew about them at the end of last season (which was November for us), and little was done to remedy them.
whowatches 500th Post Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 575

09-01-2003, 10:53 AM	#5
tweeky 500th Post Join Date: May 2003 Location: South Alabama Posts: 779	thoughts on saints after final cuts? Man this is getting old and worn out. But I\'ll give it one last try TEX QB - same as last year --good BETTER, DEEPER rb - no depth, deuce is da stud though! Keaton was a bust, not our fault, his. We still plan to improve wr - same as last year ---good Good? how about GREAT, and now DEEPER. OL - same as last year -- maybe a little worse, SAME? We are much better without the POSER on our team now. I saw him get ragdolled every other play. A BUST at LT. Hmmm, I wonder how he\'s doing at left tackle in St Louis? Def. line - a little more improved but nothing great -- yet? LITTLE? after the debacle last year I\'d have to say this years line is DRASTICALLY improved. LB - a make shift group, may be faster but none would be a starter on many other teams We got rid of a flop who\'s now starting on another team. CB - dale carter and a group of players who would not start elsewhere, no depth safety- - T-buck is an improvement but then what? Depth at Safety was never a concern for anybody until our starter got injured and out for the year. I guess you saw that coming though? Head coach - same as last year -- appears weak, In offseason brought in other coaches to help teach him and his staff. ?? What the F___? See Haslett/Venturi thread Off Coord - same as last year ---half season wonder? can he adjust game plan or will he be just as predictable? Probably the only thing you said with any originality and insight def. Coord - same as last year --- any sign he knows what he is doing? Can he translate the schemes in his head onto the field? OK probably the 2nd thing, but the jury is still out on him, see Haslett/Venturi thread Asst coaches - same as last year So What From my view I don\'t see any improvement from last year. What view do you have, the nosebleeds? If you asked Haslett if he thought this team is good enough to win the NFC what do you think his honest answer would be? Absolutely positively YES! If you can\'t see the improvements, its because you choose not to. [Edited on 1/9/2003 by tweeky]
	Whether we agree or disagree; its all for Him.

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09-01-2003, 10:59 AM	#6
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	thoughts on saints after final cuts? Let\'s put it this way. If you take Kurt Warner, Marshall Faulk, and Tory Holt out of the Rams starting offense. How do you think they would do? I think that question has already been answered. Or, take Brad Johnson, Warren Sapp, and Simen Rice away from Tampa and how do you think they would do? As far as us getting a back-up running back -- there are plenty of very good back-ups out there and they will have plenty of time to learn the offense. Also the Saints signed plenty of players to address the defensive problems. They just didn\'t sign the players most fans coveted. [Edited on 1/9/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

09-01-2003, 11:10 AM	#7
nocloning 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 302	thoughts on saints after final cuts? We are much better without the POSER on our team now. I saw him get ragdolled every other play. A BUST at LT. Hmmm, I wonder how he\'s doing at left tackle in St Louis? Pace is back. And Turley is a good RT, he\'ll do fine until his ego takes over.
nocloning 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 302

09-01-2003, 01:01 PM	#8
FWtex 100th Post Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 370	thoughts on saints after final cuts? I do not believe in the theory of looking at back at last years team and playing the \"IF\" game. \"IFs\" are going to happen every year and beleive it or not but good teams prepare for the \"IFs\". The organization did not address the \"IFs\" that surfaced last year. Here is pPart of Billy\'s post with a few changes. --------------------------------------------- With all the problems this team had last year-- that most everyone DWELLS on -- Don\'t forget this team LOST TO ATL TWICE, CLEVE, MINN, CINN, AND CAR TO FINISH 1 GAME OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS. Don\'t forget that Duece and Aaron had significant injuries that played a part in them losing down the stretch last year. --------------------------------------------- And a few remarks on tweeks observations. rb - no depth, deuce is da stud though! Keaton was a bust, not our fault, his. We still plan to improve SO BUSTS ARE NO LONGER THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE EVALUATION STAFF? PLAN??? IT IS WAY PAST TIME TO PLAN THIS YEAR. wr - same as last year ---good Good? how about GREAT, and now DEEPER. THIS IS WAS NOT A PROBLEM AREA, STILL ISN\'T OL - same as last year -- maybe a little worse, SAME? We are much better without the POSER on our team now. I saw him get ragdolled every other play. A BUST at LT. Hmmm, I wonder how he\'s doing at left tackle in St Louis? I AM NOT CONCERNED HOW TURLEY IS PLAYING AT ST. LOU. WATCH AND SEE HOW MANY BIG PLAYS GET CALLED BACK BECAUSE OF HOLDING THIS YEAR. Def. line - a little more improved but nothing great -- yet? LITTLE? after the debacle last year I\'d have to say this years line is DRASTICALLY improved. SAINTS SWAP SULLY FOR HAND AND YOU SAY THAT IS A DRASTIC IMPROVEMENT? LB - a make shift group, may be faster but none would be a starter on many other teams We got rid of a flop who\'s now starting on another team. GOT RID OF A FLOP AND PICKED UP ANOTHER. ?? safety- - T-buck is an improvement but then what? Depth at Safety was never a concern for anybody until our starter got injured and out for the year. I guess you saw that coming though? INJURIES ARE A FLUKE OCCURENCE IN THE NFL I GUESS? STILL THE QUESTION IS BETTER OR WORSE? From my view I don\'t see any improvement from last year. What view do you have, the nosebleeds? AND HOW IS YOUR VIEWPOINT ANY BETTER? If you asked Haslett if he thought this team is good enough to win the NFC what do you think his honest answer would be? Absolutely positively YES! I SAID \"HONEST\" ANSWER! If you can\'t see the improvements, its because you choose not to. If you see the improvements, its because you choose not to SEE THE FLAWS.
FWtex 100th Post Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 370

09-01-2003, 01:27 PM	#9
tweeky 500th Post Join Date: May 2003 Location: South Alabama Posts: 779	thoughts on saints after final cuts? FWtex, using your logic and given about 1 hour, I can make all 32 teams look like a bunch of losers based on their off-season acquisitions. Especially using the \"our back-ups at position X aren\'t up to snuff, what was our GM thinking?\" line. But its too old, boring, and way too played out. All 53 players can\'t be pro-bowlers. Its tiring arguing with fans that can\'t understand that. Here\'s a thought, Why don\'t we try to get Donovan McNabb Terrell Owens, Marvin Harrison, Rickey Williams, O. Pace, Ray Lewis, Zack Thomas Derrick Brooks. Waren Sapp, Anthony McFarland, and Michael Stahan. We must have incompetant Boobs running this outfit.
	Whether we agree or disagree; its all for Him.

09-01-2003, 01:37 PM	#10
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	thoughts on saints after final cuts? Tweeky -- I started to say the same thing. But, my head is hurting from banging it up against the wall. I think anyone who say\'s the Saints don\'t have a chance at going to the playoffs don\'t know what the hell they\'re talking about. Some people are just going to complain no matter what. They are going to look very foolish come Sunday and hopefully we won\'t have to hear all that whining anymore.
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209