Understanding the impact of Penalties

TheOak · 12-20-2010, 09:24 AM

Penalties are bad period. But understanding which ones have the greatest effect on a game is important to a fan as it can help calm some frustration.

Offensive penalties can be recovered from in a single play. Loose 5 yards and you can get it back with one run or a pass. Even 3rd and 25 can be deleted with a completed pass generally.

Defensive penalties are another animal... Defensive penalties directly help our opponent in most situations. However some Defensive penalties hurt our opponent. While a pass interference in "some" cases prevents a TD. I would rather a pass interference that moves the opponent to the 15 yard line than no penalty that gives them a TD. Our Red Zone D is great, and often holds them to 3 points. 3 is better than 7 any day.

The killers are the Defensive penalties like late hits, out of bounds hits, unsportsmanlike conduct, off sides/encroachment..... These typically give our opponents free first downs. Often moving them 15-20 yards... putting them in FG range.

Week 13: If CIN does not fall for the oldest play in the book. We loose.

Week 15:
Against BAL:
1 QTR
Ed Reed: 15-yard roughing the passer penalty. Saints TD
Sharper: 15-yard unnecessary roughness penalty. Gives BAL great field position. Raven TD

4th QTR
Harper: 15-yard unnecessary roughness penalty. Gives BAL great field position. Results TD

Saints Penalties for this season to Date:

Defensive Penalties: 20th in League for Penalties, 23rd for Penalty Yards
80 for 637 yards.

Offensive Penalties: 23rd in League on penalties, and 15th for penalty yards.
77 for 747 yards

xan · 12-20-2010, 09:38 AM

can you give a relative on the magnitude of the penalites, like who's the best, and what our upcoming opponents are like? Numbers without context aren't helpful...

foreverfan · 12-20-2010, 09:43 AM

Penalties and Turnovers.

You're right about the defensive turnovers but offensive turnovers lead to missed opportunities to score, but they never happen.

darstep · 12-20-2010, 10:59 AM

Smart football can put you in position to win games. Dumb football can take you out of position and cause games to be lost. Close games are where the +'s and -'s really come into play. Play drives can turn on an untimely penalty - on both sides of the ball.

TheOak · 12-20-2010, 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by xan

can you give a relative on the magnitude of the penalites, like who's the best, and what our upcoming opponents are like? Numbers without context aren't helpful...

I'll do opponents in relation to what I have Posted about the Saints.

I looked for those deeper stats. Some stats are difficult to find... Dropped passes by Receiver is not easy to find, Penalties by Player is not easy to find, Teams ave starting Yard Line after a kick off is not easy to find, yards gained due to Pass Interference is not easy to find... Just to name a few I have looked for.

Clarification: Because as soon as I say they are not easy to find someone will post them LOL.. Not easy for ME to find.

Saints Number Corrected. The sort messed me up.

Lower ranking equals better ranking.
Saints: Decent on both sides of the ball
Defensive Penalties: 12th in League for Penalties, 10 th for Penalty Yards
80 for 637 yards.

Offensive Penalties: 10 th in League on penalties, and 18th for penalty yards.
77 for 747 yards

Upcoming Opponents Penalty's:

Atlanta: Best in League on offense. Terrible on Defense (We need to exploit)
Defensive Penalties: 26th in League for Penalties, 25rd for Penalty Yards
98 for 814 yards.
Offensive Penalties: 1st in League on penalties, and 3rd for penalty yards.
53 for 568 yards

Tampa Bay: Good on Defense, Bad on Offense.
Defensive Penalties: 3 rd in League for Penalties, 8th for Penalty Yards
73 for 621 yards.
Offensive Penalties: 20 th in League on penalties, and 20th for penalty yards.
90 for 761 yards

Who Knows... for a few weeks.

Patriots: SB Pretty good numbers on both sides of the ball. They have a pretty high penalty yardage on Offense compared to the number of penalties.
Defensive Penalties: 3 rd in League for Penalties, 5th for Penalty Yards
73 for 607 yards.

Offensive Penalties:6th in League on penalties, and 16th for penalty yards.
72 for 654 yards

TheOak · 12-20-2010, 01:07 PM

I left Turnovers out... because... if you are not the one getting the ball. it sucks for you.

Rugby Saint II · 12-21-2010, 02:31 PM

To me the most important aspect of this thread is that defensive penalties change and impact the game more than offensive penalties. Penalties can be negated through good play, however a flag by the offense brings the opponent closer to scoring position. This usually results in a field goal or a touch down. It seems like when we begin shooting ourselves in the foot that our opponents get into rhythm and the defense gives up fairly easy points.

Beastmode · 12-21-2010, 03:58 PM

Speaking of dropped stats, Colston has 5 from the stat I found and White has 5. Thing is, White has 24 more catches. Gonzales however is way up there, believe it's 7. Marcus has dropped some very easy ones but all in all, the team is fine in that catergory, just need to tighen up some.

If we make the playoffs a lot of those penalties will go away but the roughing stuff has got to stop immediately. No excuse for 99% of it other than adreneline.

12-20-2010, 09:24 AM	#1
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,026	Understanding the impact of Penalties Penalties are bad period. But understanding which ones have the greatest effect on a game is important to a fan as it can help calm some frustration. Offensive penalties can be recovered from in a single play. Loose 5 yards and you can get it back with one run or a pass. Even 3rd and 25 can be deleted with a completed pass generally. Defensive penalties are another animal... Defensive penalties directly help our opponent in most situations. However some Defensive penalties hurt our opponent. While a pass interference in "some" cases prevents a TD. I would rather a pass interference that moves the opponent to the 15 yard line than no penalty that gives them a TD. Our Red Zone D is great, and often holds them to 3 points. 3 is better than 7 any day. The killers are the Defensive penalties like late hits, out of bounds hits, unsportsmanlike conduct, off sides/encroachment..... These typically give our opponents free first downs. Often moving them 15-20 yards... putting them in FG range. Week 13: If CIN does not fall for the oldest play in the book. We loose. Week 15: Against BAL: 1 QTR Ed Reed: 15-yard roughing the passer penalty. Saints TD Sharper: 15-yard unnecessary roughness penalty. Gives BAL great field position. Raven TD 4th QTR Harper: 15-yard unnecessary roughness penalty. Gives BAL great field position. Results TD Saints Penalties for this season to Date: Defensive Penalties: 20th in League for Penalties, 23rd for Penalty Yards 80 for 637 yards. Offensive Penalties: 23rd in League on penalties, and 15th for penalty yards. 77 for 747 yards
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

12-20-2010, 01:06 PM	#5
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,026	Originally Posted by xan can you give a relative on the magnitude of the penalites, like who's the best, and what our upcoming opponents are like? Numbers without context aren't helpful... I'll do opponents in relation to what I have Posted about the Saints. I looked for those deeper stats. Some stats are difficult to find... Dropped passes by Receiver is not easy to find, Penalties by Player is not easy to find, Teams ave starting Yard Line after a kick off is not easy to find, yards gained due to Pass Interference is not easy to find... Just to name a few I have looked for. Clarification: Because as soon as I say they are not easy to find someone will post them LOL.. Not easy for ME to find. Saints Number Corrected. The sort messed me up. Lower ranking equals better ranking. Saints: Decent on both sides of the ball Defensive Penalties: 12th in League for Penalties, 10 th for Penalty Yards 80 for 637 yards. Offensive Penalties: 10 th in League on penalties, and 18th for penalty yards. 77 for 747 yards Upcoming Opponents Penalty's: Atlanta: Best in League on offense. Terrible on Defense (We need to exploit) Defensive Penalties: 26th in League for Penalties, 25rd for Penalty Yards 98 for 814 yards. Offensive Penalties: 1st in League on penalties, and 3rd for penalty yards. 53 for 568 yards Tampa Bay: Good on Defense, Bad on Offense. Defensive Penalties: 3 rd in League for Penalties, 8th for Penalty Yards 73 for 621 yards. Offensive Penalties: 20 th in League on penalties, and 20th for penalty yards. 90 for 761 yards Who Knows... for a few weeks. Patriots: SB Pretty good numbers on both sides of the ball. They have a pretty high penalty yardage on Offense compared to the number of penalties. Defensive Penalties: 3 rd in League for Penalties, 5th for Penalty Yards 73 for 607 yards. Offensive Penalties:6th in League on penalties, and 16th for penalty yards. 72 for 654 yards
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

12-21-2010, 03:58 PM	#8
Beastmode 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 9,126	Speaking of dropped stats, Colston has 5 from the stat I found and White has 5. Thing is, White has 24 more catches. Gonzales however is way up there, believe it's 7. Marcus has dropped some very easy ones but all in all, the team is fine in that catergory, just need to tighen up some. If we make the playoffs a lot of those penalties will go away but the roughing stuff has got to stop immediately. No excuse for 99% of it other than adreneline.
Beastmode 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 9,126

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12-20-2010, 09:38 AM	#2
xan Professor Crab and Site Donor 2014 Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Princeton Posts: 3,369 Blog Entries: 34	can you give a relative on the magnitude of the penalites, like who's the best, and what our upcoming opponents are like? Numbers without context aren't helpful...

12-20-2010, 09:43 AM	#3
foreverfan 12,000 BS Posts Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Metairie, LA Posts: 13,457 Blog Entries: 5	Penalties and Turnovers. You're right about the defensive turnovers but offensive turnovers lead to missed opportunities to score, but they never happen.

12-20-2010, 10:59 AM	#4
darstep SaintSince67 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: PortCity Posts: 2,044	Smart football can put you in position to win games. Dumb football can take you out of position and cause games to be lost. Close games are where the +'s and -'s really come into play. Play drives can turn on an untimely penalty - on both sides of the ball.

12-20-2010, 01:07 PM	#6
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,026	I left Turnovers out... because... if you are not the one getting the ball. it sucks for you.

12-21-2010, 02:31 PM	#7
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,052	To me the most important aspect of this thread is that defensive penalties change and impact the game more than offensive penalties. Penalties can be negated through good play, however a flag by the offense brings the opponent closer to scoring position. This usually results in a field goal or a touch down. It seems like when we begin shooting ourselves in the foot that our opponents get into rhythm and the defense gives up fairly easy points.