A Miscarriage of Justice

WhoDat!656 · 08-31-2012, 09:59 PM

Even under Roger Goodell’s six year watch, the punishments haven’t matched the crime in my opinion. In March 2009, after killing a man while driving over the legal limit, Donte Stallworth was suspended for one full season by Goodell — the exact same punishment doled out to Jon Vilma for applying hits on the football field.

Now look, I’m not trying to say a “bounty” or “pay for performance” scheme should go unpunished. But I will say it is clear the NFL has its priorities out of whack. When a player receives the same (or greater) suspension than those who have literally driven under the influence of alcohol and killed people, then there’s something wrong. I need to make this clear though, the blame doesn’t fall just on Roger Goodell and the NFL. The NFLPA deserves equal blame. I understand that the union’s job is to protect their members at all costs and to the best of their abilities, but that protection shouldn’t come at the cost of innocent lives.

A Miscarriage of Justice | Third Down Conversion

The Dude · 08-31-2012, 10:05 PM

Jeez im shocked.

Utah_Saint · 08-31-2012, 10:05 PM

Last year we all saw a player who literally stomped on a player laying on the turf. He got two games.

Vilma didn't hurt anybody. He got 16 games. 8 times worse. Makes no sense.

Tobias-Reiper · 08-31-2012, 10:30 PM

... yeah, people keep on bringing Donte Stallworth for killing a man, but they should give Stallworth the same benefit they are asking for Vilma: get the facts. There is no question Donte was driving with a blood alcohol level higher than the legal limit, but it is not like he drove onto a busy sidewalk and killed a man. The man who died was attempting to cross a highway in the twilight. Dead dude should share the blame for attempting to cross a highway at a location other that the one marked for crossing, and not even looking to check for on-coming traffic.

Seer1 · 08-31-2012, 10:51 PM

WOW! What a hot breaking story! It's only been, well months since all this came down and now someone finally says this in "print". Not the first time I've heard this, but the first time I've seen it officially written about. The coaches and players were "punished" as examples not for their offenses. Our Supreme Court has ruled against that time and again.

As an aside, Stallworth got off easy. The other guy that should share the blame got the death penalty. Just sayin'

Tobias-Reiper · 09-01-2012, 12:49 AM

Originally Posted by Seer1

As an aside, Stallworth got off easy. The other guy that should share the blame got the death penalty. Just sayin'

That's what happens when you don't follow you mommy's advice to cross at the corners or pedestrian crossings, and no matter what, you always look both ways before you cross. Especially on 4 lane highways with a posted speed limit of 55 MPH.

Seer1 · 09-01-2012, 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper

That's what happens when you don't follow you mommy's advice to cross at the corners or pedestrian crossings, and no matter what, you always look both ways before you cross. Especially on 4 lane highways with a posted speed limit of 55 MPH.

It's also what happens when you drink and drive... I pray you never lose anyone to a drunk driver.

SloMotion · 09-01-2012, 08:29 AM

Originally Posted by Utah_Saint

Last year we all saw a player who literally stomped on a player laying on the turf. He got two games.

Vilma didn't hurt anybody. He got 16 games. 8 times worse. Makes no sense.

I went on record with the opinion he should have been suspended for the remainder of the season for that little stunt & for the immature way he refused to accept responsibility for his actions, but moving on ...

These two quotes from the link sum it up for me:

... some punishments simply don’t make sense. I understand that the NFL has to protect the integrity of the game. But would anyone in the league office or NFLPA have the guts to go on national television and tell America they believe someone getting paid extra for hard hits (or injecting steroids, etc) is truly a worse offense than putting the lives of innocent people at risk by driving drunk? If they can, then the NFL and NFLPA truly have no soul. But that may very well be the case, when you consider past precedent.

The NFL and NFLPA should sit down together and agree to a revision of the collective bargaining agreement that increases the punishments for potentially deadly crimes such as driving under the influence. Until both sides show solidarity and recognize that there are some things more important than the game of football, it will be hard to take punishments such as the suspension of Jon Vilma seriously.

Tobias-Reiper · 09-01-2012, 10:16 AM

Originally Posted by Seer1

It's also what happens when you drink and drive... I pray you never lose anyone to a drunk driver.

Really? When you drink and drive people just run in front of your car on 6 lane highways with posted speed limits of 45-55 MPH? That Stallworth was legally drunk at the time had nothing to do with this Reyes guy running across a 6 lane highway without looking.

Could it be that Stallworth could've done something (brake hard/faster/earlier, steer around, etc) if his blood alcohol was under the limit? Would Reyes still be alive? Maybe. We don't know that. But, surely, had Reyes walked to where the stoplight is, and crossed the highway on the pedestrian crossing, I am 99.99% sure we would have survived that morning.

I am not absolving Stallworth for drinking and driving. That's obviously wrong. And I know all I need to know about drunk drivers. I have experienced drunk drivers in person, twice. Once my mother and I almost got killed by one in an accident that looked like one of those old Harold Loyd movies. The other time I somehow was able to steer away enough from a drunk driver who jumped into my highway lane in front of me going the wrong way; still got clipped and spun around a few times, but no flip and didn't hit anything else, other than the drunk driver's face, multiple times.

But, at the same time, I can't absolve someone from blame for doing something that was pretty much ingrained in my head not to do since I was a kid. Paraphrasing my grandmother: "when you cross the street, always cross at the corner and make sure you look both ways even if you have the right of way. If the car doesn't stop, you can get killed".

And by the way, there are laws against jaywalking. Reyes himself was breaking a law designed to protect him. As per the Florida Pedestrian Law Enforcement Guide:

JAYWALKING: This commonly used term does not appear in traffic codes. It is generally understood to mean crossing a roadway in a manner that violates traffic law, especially (1) crossing mid-block between two adjacent signalized intersections and (2) entering an unsignalized crosswalk when an approaching driver is so close as to make it difficult for him to take evasive action.

Notice it doesn't say "...when an approaching drunk driver"

So, what did we learn today?
1. Drunk driving, bad.
2. Crossing a 6 lane highway with a posted speed limit of (I believe) 50 MPH without looking both ways at upcoming traffic, not on a signalized intersection, bad.

Rugby Saint II · 09-01-2012, 12:32 PM

Crossing lanes of traffic and crossing Godhell is bad.

08-31-2012, 09:59 PM	#1
WhoDat!656 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Shreveport,Louisiana Posts: 16,062	A Miscarriage of Justice Even under Roger Goodell’s six year watch, the punishments haven’t matched the crime in my opinion. In March 2009, after killing a man while driving over the legal limit, Donte Stallworth was suspended for one full season by Goodell — the exact same punishment doled out to Jon Vilma for applying hits on the football field. Now look, I’m not trying to say a “bounty” or “pay for performance” scheme should go unpunished. But I will say it is clear the NFL has its priorities out of whack. When a player receives the same (or greater) suspension than those who have literally driven under the influence of alcohol and killed people, then there’s something wrong. I need to make this clear though, the blame doesn’t fall just on Roger Goodell and the NFL. The NFLPA deserves equal blame. I understand that the union’s job is to protect their members at all costs and to the best of their abilities, but that protection shouldn’t come at the cost of innocent lives. A Miscarriage of Justice \| Third Down Conversion
	"A Veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a blank check made payable to "The United States of America" for an amount of "up to and including my life."

08-31-2012, 10:05 PM	#2
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,050	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice Jeez im shocked.
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,050

08-31-2012, 10:05 PM	#3
Utah_Saint Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 3,521	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice Last year we all saw a player who literally stomped on a player laying on the turf. He got two games. Vilma didn't hurt anybody. He got 16 games. 8 times worse. Makes no sense. Halo, UK_WhoDat, QBREES9 and 1 others like this.

08-31-2012, 10:30 PM	#4
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice ... yeah, people keep on bringing Donte Stallworth for killing a man, but they should give Stallworth the same benefit they are asking for Vilma: get the facts. There is no question Donte was driving with a blood alcohol level higher than the legal limit, but it is not like he drove onto a busy sidewalk and killed a man. The man who died was attempting to cross a highway in the twilight. Dead dude should share the blame for attempting to cross a highway at a location other that the one marked for crossing, and not even looking to check for on-coming traffic.
	'Cause the simple man pays the thrills, the bills and the pills that kill

08-31-2012, 10:51 PM	#5
Seer1 Site Donor Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Bayou Bayfield CO Posts: 4,722	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice WOW! What a hot breaking story! It's only been, well months since all this came down and now someone finally says this in "print". Not the first time I've heard this, but the first time I've seen it officially written about. The coaches and players were "punished" as examples not for their offenses. Our Supreme Court has ruled against that time and again. As an aside, Stallworth got off easy. The other guy that should share the blame got the death penalty. Just sayin' Halo and Rugby Saint II like this.

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09-01-2012, 12:49 AM	#6
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice Originally Posted by Seer1 As an aside, Stallworth got off easy. The other guy that should share the blame got the death penalty. Just sayin' That's what happens when you don't follow you mommy's advice to cross at the corners or pedestrian crossings, and no matter what, you always look both ways before you cross. Especially on 4 lane highways with a posted speed limit of 55 MPH.

09-01-2012, 08:12 AM	#7
Seer1 Site Donor Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Bayou Bayfield CO Posts: 4,722	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper That's what happens when you don't follow you mommy's advice to cross at the corners or pedestrian crossings, and no matter what, you always look both ways before you cross. Especially on 4 lane highways with a posted speed limit of 55 MPH. It's also what happens when you drink and drive... I pray you never lose anyone to a drunk driver.

09-01-2012, 08:29 AM	#8
SloMotion 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 6,776 Blog Entries: 15	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice Originally Posted by Utah_Saint Last year we all saw a player who literally stomped on a player laying on the turf. He got two games. Vilma didn't hurt anybody. He got 16 games. 8 times worse. Makes no sense. I went on record with the opinion he should have been suspended for the remainder of the season for that little stunt & for the immature way he refused to accept responsibility for his actions, but moving on ... These two quotes from the link sum it up for me: ... some punishments simply don’t make sense. I understand that the NFL has to protect the integrity of the game. But would anyone in the league office or NFLPA have the guts to go on national television and tell America they believe someone getting paid extra for hard hits (or injecting steroids, etc) is truly a worse offense than putting the lives of innocent people at risk by driving drunk? If they can, then the NFL and NFLPA truly have no soul. But that may very well be the case, when you consider past precedent. The NFL and NFLPA should sit down together and agree to a revision of the collective bargaining agreement that increases the punishments for potentially deadly crimes such as driving under the influence. Until both sides show solidarity and recognize that there are some things more important than the game of football, it will be hard to take punishments such as the suspension of Jon Vilma seriously.

09-01-2012, 10:16 AM	#9
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice Originally Posted by Seer1 It's also what happens when you drink and drive... I pray you never lose anyone to a drunk driver. Really? When you drink and drive people just run in front of your car on 6 lane highways with posted speed limits of 45-55 MPH? That Stallworth was legally drunk at the time had nothing to do with this Reyes guy running across a 6 lane highway without looking. Could it be that Stallworth could've done something (brake hard/faster/earlier, steer around, etc) if his blood alcohol was under the limit? Would Reyes still be alive? Maybe. We don't know that. But, surely, had Reyes walked to where the stoplight is, and crossed the highway on the pedestrian crossing, I am 99.99% sure we would have survived that morning. I am not absolving Stallworth for drinking and driving. That's obviously wrong. And I know all I need to know about drunk drivers. I have experienced drunk drivers in person, twice. Once my mother and I almost got killed by one in an accident that looked like one of those old Harold Loyd movies. The other time I somehow was able to steer away enough from a drunk driver who jumped into my highway lane in front of me going the wrong way; still got clipped and spun around a few times, but no flip and didn't hit anything else, other than the drunk driver's face, multiple times. But, at the same time, I can't absolve someone from blame for doing something that was pretty much ingrained in my head not to do since I was a kid. Paraphrasing my grandmother: "when you cross the street, always cross at the corner and make sure you look both ways even if you have the right of way. If the car doesn't stop, you can get killed". And by the way, there are laws against jaywalking. Reyes himself was breaking a law designed to protect him. As per the Florida Pedestrian Law Enforcement Guide: JAYWALKING: This commonly used term does not appear in traffic codes. It is generally understood to mean crossing a roadway in a manner that violates traffic law, especially (1) crossing mid-block between two adjacent signalized intersections and (2) entering an unsignalized crosswalk when an approaching driver is so close as to make it difficult for him to take evasive action. Notice it doesn't say "...when an approaching drunk driver" So, what did we learn today? 1. Drunk driving, bad. 2. Crossing a 6 lane highway with a posted speed limit of (I believe) 50 MPH without looking both ways at upcoming traffic, not on a signalized intersection, bad.
	'Cause the simple man pays the thrills, the bills and the pills that kill

09-01-2012, 12:32 PM	#10
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,073	Re: A Miscarriage of Justice Crossing lanes of traffic and crossing Godhell is bad.

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