Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense

Danno · 04-27-2014, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by Seer1

Is is, did it benefit Drew? I'm not convinced on that part.

ZBS is a run blocking scheme. Pass blocking is a different animal.

Crusader · 04-27-2014, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by Danno

ZBS is a run blocking scheme. Pass blocking is a different animal.

Well zone-blocking and slide protection can be very much alike, especially the inside zone where often times you take more of a lateral step and then work up the field compared to an outside zone where you open your hips more and kinda run to the playside.

Zone can also be fantastic to use for play action and sprint out passes and bootleg because you can get the whole Defence flowing the wrong way.

dizzle88 · 04-27-2014, 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by Crusader

Zone can also be fantastic to use for play action and sprint out passes and bootleg because you can get the whole Defence flowing the wrong way.

Which is why matt schaub was so effective on play action for the texans, their zone blocking scheme in the run game set up the play action nicely and schaub would get tons of time to survey the field

Euphoria · 04-27-2014, 06:41 PM

I don't care what system you use...

IF YOU DON'T EXECUTE - YOU WON'T SUCCEED.

Seer1 · 04-27-2014, 08:27 PM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

I don't care what system you use...

IF YOU DON'T EXECUTE - YOU WON'T SUCCEED.

If you don't have the players to execute, you still won't succeed.

TheOak · 04-27-2014, 11:39 PM

I didn't buy the line last week and I still don't. The authors reasoning behind the Saints switching to a ZBS because of Ingram doesn't hold water.

The switch happened in a year we got a new line coach..... Not in the year we picked up Ingram.

I don't see Sean Payton changing how we block as a whole for the RB with the second most carries by a long shot.

All the RBs ran better at the end of the season.

A hole between G&T is a hole, a RB doesn't care how it was made.

The articles authors logic is a reach that completely ignores a lot of issues that make his argument invalid.

Danno · 04-28-2014, 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

I didn't buy the line last week and I still don't. The authors reasoning behind the Saints switching to a ZBS because of Ingram doesn't hold water.

The switch happened in a year we got a new line coach..... Not in the year we picked up Ingram.

I don't see Sean Payton changing how we block as a whole for the RB with the second most carries by a long shot.

All the RBs ran better at the end of the season.

A hole between G&T is a hole, a RB doesn't care how it was made.

The articles authors logic is a reach that completely ignores a lot of issues that make his argument invalid.

I thought it was a very good explanation of the ZBS but you're right. Just because its something Ingram has had success running behind before doesn't mean we switched our system just for him.

And like you said, all of our RB's struggled at first, or I should say all of our linemen struggled at first, but the O-line improvement toward the end of the season was obvious.

Good read, weak correlation.

TheOak · 04-28-2014, 09:41 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

I thought it was a very good explanation of the ZBS but you're right. Just because its something Ingram has had success running behind before doesn't mean we switched our system just for him.

And like you said, all of our RB's struggled at first, or I should say all of our linemen struggled at first, but the O-line improvement toward the end of the season was obvious.

Good read, weak correlation.

I loved the breakdown of the ZBS, he did do a great job on that.

At the beginning of the year our RBs were getting tackled 1-2 yards behind the Line of scrimmage, whether that was the lines fault or the RBs fault it was consistent between our running plays.

After the BYE week things started clicking for either the o-line or RBs and we ran better the last 1/2 of the season.

One of the glaring items that shines a light on the lack of correlation is that if a ZBS makes Ingram run better he should have ran better than everyone else early in the season. Which he didn't.

Any RB will tell you, if a 2 foot hole is made for him to run through, whether the T/G both crisscrossed or they both blocked forward down field... A hole is a hole.

I feel like in rambling now lol so I'll stop. I'm on some heavy duty pain killers.

I think the correlations between ZBS, Alabama players, and NFL is somewhat coincidence. Those Bama players are running behind different o-lines and facing different opponents so it's not really an apples to apples comparison.

04-27-2014, 12:34 PM	#11
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,723	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense Originally Posted by Seer1 Is is, did it benefit Drew? I'm not convinced on that part. ZBS is a run blocking scheme. Pass blocking is a different animal.

04-27-2014, 12:52 PM	#12
Crusader Resident Swede Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Märsta, Sweden Posts: 8,025	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense Originally Posted by Danno ZBS is a run blocking scheme. Pass blocking is a different animal. Well zone-blocking and slide protection can be very much alike, especially the inside zone where often times you take more of a lateral step and then work up the field compared to an outside zone where you open your hips more and kinda run to the playside. Zone can also be fantastic to use for play action and sprint out passes and bootleg because you can get the whole Defence flowing the wrong way. hagan714 likes this.

04-27-2014, 06:20 PM	#13
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,359	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense Originally Posted by Crusader Zone can also be fantastic to use for play action and sprint out passes and bootleg because you can get the whole Defence flowing the wrong way. Which is why matt schaub was so effective on play action for the texans, their zone blocking scheme in the run game set up the play action nicely and schaub would get tons of time to survey the field hagan714 likes this.

04-27-2014, 06:41 PM	#14
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense I don't care what system you use... IF YOU DON'T EXECUTE - YOU WON'T SUCCEED. Seer1 likes this.

04-27-2014, 08:27 PM	#15
Seer1 Site Donor Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Bayou Bayfield CO Posts: 4,722	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense Originally Posted by Euphoria I don't care what system you use... IF YOU DON'T EXECUTE - YOU WON'T SUCCEED. If you don't have the players to execute, you still won't succeed.

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04-27-2014, 11:39 PM	#16
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense I didn't buy the line last week and I still don't. The authors reasoning behind the Saints switching to a ZBS because of Ingram doesn't hold water. The switch happened in a year we got a new line coach..... Not in the year we picked up Ingram. I don't see Sean Payton changing how we block as a whole for the RB with the second most carries by a long shot. All the RBs ran better at the end of the season. A hole between G&T is a hole, a RB doesn't care how it was made. The articles authors logic is a reach that completely ignores a lot of issues that make his argument invalid.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

04-28-2014, 08:59 AM	#17
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,723	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense Originally Posted by TheOak I didn't buy the line last week and I still don't. The authors reasoning behind the Saints switching to a ZBS because of Ingram doesn't hold water. The switch happened in a year we got a new line coach..... Not in the year we picked up Ingram. I don't see Sean Payton changing how we block as a whole for the RB with the second most carries by a long shot. All the RBs ran better at the end of the season. A hole between G&T is a hole, a RB doesn't care how it was made. The articles authors logic is a reach that completely ignores a lot of issues that make his argument invalid. I thought it was a very good explanation of the ZBS but you're right. Just because its something Ingram has had success running behind before doesn't mean we switched our system just for him. And like you said, all of our RB's struggled at first, or I should say all of our linemen struggled at first, but the O-line improvement toward the end of the season was obvious. Good read, weak correlation. TheOak likes this.

04-28-2014, 09:41 AM	#18
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Conversion From Man to Zone Blocking Benefits Mark Ingram, Saints Offense Originally Posted by Danno I thought it was a very good explanation of the ZBS but you're right. Just because its something Ingram has had success running behind before doesn't mean we switched our system just for him. And like you said, all of our RB's struggled at first, or I should say all of our linemen struggled at first, but the O-line improvement toward the end of the season was obvious. Good read, weak correlation. I loved the breakdown of the ZBS, he did do a great job on that. At the beginning of the year our RBs were getting tackled 1-2 yards behind the Line of scrimmage, whether that was the lines fault or the RBs fault it was consistent between our running plays. After the BYE week things started clicking for either the o-line or RBs and we ran better the last 1/2 of the season. One of the glaring items that shines a light on the lack of correlation is that if a ZBS makes Ingram run better he should have ran better than everyone else early in the season. Which he didn't. Any RB will tell you, if a 2 foot hole is made for him to run through, whether the T/G both crisscrossed or they both blocked forward down field... A hole is a hole. I feel like in rambling now lol so I'll stop. I'm on some heavy duty pain killers. I think the correlations between ZBS, Alabama players, and NFL is somewhat coincidence. Those Bama players are running behind different o-lines and facing different opponents so it's not really an apples to apples comparison.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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