Changes on the Way (TP must read)

WhoDat · 01-10-2005, 09:45 AM

Guys, I have no problem with people being upset with McCarthy or blaming him for the offense\'s poor play this year. But think about - the offense\'s play in terms of production didn\'t change much from the first game to the last. What made the difference was the defense. Between Haslett, Venturi, Loomis, Mueller, and McCarthy, I ranked McCarthy last in terms of fault for why this team is the way it is. His unit has been top ten up until this year. I\'m not saying he\'s great, but if a coordinator has to go, it damn well better be Venturi.

saintswhodi · 01-10-2005, 10:15 AM

ranked McCarthy last in terms of fault for why this team is the way it is. His unit has been top ten up until this year.

Then why oh why WhoDat did he change the offense???????

Danno · 01-10-2005, 10:22 AM

One primary objective of the plan is to restructure the football operations, in particular the personnel department.

Bye Bye Rick Mueller. Maybe Haz wasn\'t picking his players

Coaching changes also appear to be imminent. Several coaches on the offensive staff, including coordinator Mike McCarthy, quarterbacks coach Mike Sheppard and offensive line coach Jack Henry, could be headed elsewhere. That could require Haslett to make the most important staff hire since selecting Rick Venturi as defensive coordinator in 2002.

Bye Bye Mike, and please take Rick Venturi with you. This probably doesn\'t bode well for Aaron Brooks either. A whole new Offensive staff may warrant pulling the trigger on a Brooks swap/trade.

That possibility, though, appears remote as both Loomis and Benson appear willing to work with Haslett.

Is this a change from previous years? Was Haz screaming and no one was listening? I certainly hope this was the case.

Team officials expect a decision to be made by Benson as early as Monday.

That would be today fellas.

Thanks to Loomis\' prudent accounting, the Saints are in good shape against the salary cap for a second consecutive season. They are projected to enter free agency at about $20 million less than the projected $85 million salary cap. Much of that money will be dedicated to long-term extensions for running back Deuce McAllister and possibly wide receiver Joe Horn

I\'m starting to think signing Horn is more important than signing Deuce, unless we can insert some weight/fitness clauses into his contract.

as well as re-signing priority unrestricted free agents Jay Bellamy, Steve Gleason, Jason Craft and Tony Bryant. Restricted free agents James Allen, Mel Mitchell and exclusive rights free agents Howard Green and Talman Gardner also must be offered contracts.

Bellamy-see ya

Gleason, Craft, Bryant, Allen, Mitchel, Green, Gardner - low cost keepers, but bring in some competition.

Horn is scheduled this year to earn a $1 million roster bonus and $3.8 million base salary, neither of which is exorbitant for a player of Horn\'s production. By extending his contract, the Saints could give him a raise and at the same time lower his salary cap figure.

What the heck was all that talk in the papers/radio about his salary being HUGE next year. Thats not exactly what I\'d consider huge. I like the extension idea to lower cap.

McAllister\'s deal might be more problematic. Blockbuster deals for Clinton Portis and LaDainian Tomlinson last fall complicated negotiations. Portis\' eight-year deal included $17 million in guaranteed money in the first four years of the contract. Tomlinson\'s eight-year deal included $20.5 million in guaranteed money in the first three years. Anything similar for McAllister would assure him the top contract in club history.

If he wants anything close to Portis or Tomlinson I show him the door.

If the Saints need more cap room, space could be made with several simple moves.Releasing veteran wide receiver Jerome Pathon, who is due a $2.5 million base salary and $650,000 roster bonus this spring, would clear $2.3 million.

Bye Jerome.

The Saints could clear more by releasing or restructuring deals with veterans Ashley Ambrose ($1.8 million), Derrick Rodgers ($1.7 million) and Orlando Ruff ($1.2 million).

Don\'t let the door hit ya.

Howard...Another option is to designate Howard as a transition free agent. That would allow Howard to test the market but grant the Saints the right to match any offer he receives from another team.

They also could elect to sign Howard to a cap-friendly, long-term deal, then trade him to another club. That would clear his cap room as well as the logjam the team has at defensive end. Team officials are eager to find playing time for Will Smith, who earned All-Rookie honors with 7.5 sacks.

I like both of these options. I just hope we get something for him. A perfect trade would be to swap Howard for a true 2-gap DT.

On offense, ... Don\'t expect Riley back.

He\'s the Grady Jackson of O-linemen. He\'ll leave and have success elsewhere but his old inconsistency habits will resurface eventually. KC knew it, now we know it.

It\'s a decent year for two of their primary areas of need: linebacker and offensive line. Tackles Jonas Jennings, Floyd Womack, Kareem McKenzie and Floyd Womack are on the market. Linebackers Kendrell Bell of Pittsburgh and Edgerton Harwell of Baltimore will be top prospects.

Edgar and Pork chop!

SIGN BOTH! Watson can probably play WLB as well as MLB.

The draft grows deeper by the day...... That could push a top cornerback, linebacker or offensive linemen to them at No. 16.

Linebacker! LINEBACKER!!!!

Free agent acquisitions Brian Young, Aaron Stecker and Jamar Nesbit played key roles and were solid additions to the locker room. Ditto for Jason Craft, who was acquired in a trade with Jacksonville.

Now go get a 2-gap DT, and a stud LB.

mutineer10 · 01-10-2005, 10:43 AM

Believe me. Coaching isn\'t going to make our offensive line good.

Maybe not, but what in the heck will keep them from leading the league in false starts (often on first down, for chrissake!) and holding penalties? These are mental mistakes. Are the O-linemen poorly coached or are they just morons?

For that matter, who\'s finally gonna teach Leon how to read a defense? Who had started calling the plays when our defense improved?

In fact, if coaches don\'t do anything, why do we need them at all? We should just clear the sideline and let Leon draw the play on the ground with a stick. He IS great, after all...

WhoDat · 01-10-2005, 10:53 AM

Then why oh why WhoDat did he change the offense???????

It was a mistake, no question. And he\'s not perfect either - far from it. Here\'s my point: Look at the main players (personnel wise) involved and consider:

Venturi - inherited a defense that lead the league in sacks two years in a row, that was nasty and attacking. Went big, then went fast. Changed to a read and react scheme. Defenses finshed 18th, 23rd, 27th, and 32nd - or something like that. When it was rumored that Jim or someone else took over more of the play calling, the defense turned around. Clearly this guy needs to go.

Haslett - took Ditka\'s team to the playoffs in his first year. Since then he has revamped the players twice to get \"his\" team with the same results every year. Inconsistent, undisciplined, underachieving. At some point, the guy has to be held responsible for not turning this thng around.

Mueller - got in on his brother\'s shirt tails. It certainly seems by the decisions that have been made and the information coming out now the guy isn\'t worth his salt. I think everyone agrees that we need better talent evaluation.

Loomis - This guy can name two NFL formations - the nickel and dime. He\'s done a fantastic job with contracts to keep this team in great cap shape for 3 years. That\'s about it. He doesn\'t seem to know football and he is better served on the business operations side, and dealing with contracts.

McCarthy - took a traditionally terrible offense and made it dangerous. I don\'t remember how the offense finished in 2000, but the last 4 years, if memroy serves, he\'s got two top ten finishes, once at 11th, and this year, the worst yet, 15th. We\'d all s--t our pants if the defense finished 15th. His playcalling can be questionable, and this year was bad. I just don\'t think you flush him b/c of that. I mean - the knocks on that side of the ball are inconsistent play from the line and QB (I don\'t know how HE fixes that. I guess you have to hold him responsible, but it\'s not like he\'s getting the draft picks or FAs that the defense is), and an oft injured RB over the last few seasons. I just think that if the Saints keep anyone, it should probably be him.

saintswhodi · 01-10-2005, 11:57 AM

Seems to me this year McCarthy\'s brain went the way of Venturi\'s. If it ain\'t broke, let\'s fix it and screw it all to hell. That offensive change was a HUGE mistake and cost us some games, I feel. Defense didn\'t help, but 7 points against Seattle and the Cards is just ridiculous.

And I just can\'t get by the not scoring in the first quarter bit for the vast majority of the year. What is he doing all week? That kills me. It was an albatross around the whole team\'s neck until the special teams got us some first quarter points late in the season. Why can they score in the second half and not the first if they gameplan all week? Surely some of this is McCarthy. Certainly he doesn\'t deserve as much of the blame, but if you see a pile of turds on your porch, do you try to distinguish one turd from the others or hose off the whole stinking pile?

WhoDat · 01-10-2005, 02:39 PM

I agree Whoodi - the whole pile of deserves to get sprayed the hell out of here. But that won\'t happen. Thus, if forced to distinguish between the, I\'ll take the beagle-sized well formed (McCarthy) over the Rottweiler-sized mushy (Haslett) or the giant liquidy mess of Great Dane (Venturi).

Why was that?

[Edited on 10/1/2005 by JOESAM2002]

saintswhodi · 01-10-2005, 03:09 PM

I lost my lunch on your colorful analogy WhoDat

, but I see what you are saying.

01-10-2005, 09:45 AM	#11
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Changes on the Way (TP must read) Guys, I have no problem with people being upset with McCarthy or blaming him for the offense\'s poor play this year. But think about - the offense\'s play in terms of production didn\'t change much from the first game to the last. What made the difference was the defense. Between Haslett, Venturi, Loomis, Mueller, and McCarthy, I ranked McCarthy last in terms of fault for why this team is the way it is. His unit has been top ten up until this year. I\'m not saying he\'s great, but if a coordinator has to go, it damn well better be Venturi.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

01-10-2005, 10:15 AM	#12
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Changes on the Way (TP must read) ranked McCarthy last in terms of fault for why this team is the way it is. His unit has been top ten up until this year. Then why oh why WhoDat did he change the offense???????

01-10-2005, 10:22 AM	#13
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,718	Changes on the Way (TP must read) One primary objective of the plan is to restructure the football operations, in particular the personnel department. Bye Bye Rick Mueller. Maybe Haz wasn\'t picking his players Coaching changes also appear to be imminent. Several coaches on the offensive staff, including coordinator Mike McCarthy, quarterbacks coach Mike Sheppard and offensive line coach Jack Henry, could be headed elsewhere. That could require Haslett to make the most important staff hire since selecting Rick Venturi as defensive coordinator in 2002. Bye Bye Mike, and please take Rick Venturi with you. This probably doesn\'t bode well for Aaron Brooks either. A whole new Offensive staff may warrant pulling the trigger on a Brooks swap/trade. That possibility, though, appears remote as both Loomis and Benson appear willing to work with Haslett. Is this a change from previous years? Was Haz screaming and no one was listening? I certainly hope this was the case. Team officials expect a decision to be made by Benson as early as Monday. That would be today fellas. Thanks to Loomis\' prudent accounting, the Saints are in good shape against the salary cap for a second consecutive season. They are projected to enter free agency at about $20 million less than the projected $85 million salary cap. Much of that money will be dedicated to long-term extensions for running back Deuce McAllister and possibly wide receiver Joe Horn I\'m starting to think signing Horn is more important than signing Deuce, unless we can insert some weight/fitness clauses into his contract. as well as re-signing priority unrestricted free agents Jay Bellamy, Steve Gleason, Jason Craft and Tony Bryant. Restricted free agents James Allen, Mel Mitchell and exclusive rights free agents Howard Green and Talman Gardner also must be offered contracts. Bellamy-see ya Gleason, Craft, Bryant, Allen, Mitchel, Green, Gardner - low cost keepers, but bring in some competition. Horn is scheduled this year to earn a $1 million roster bonus and $3.8 million base salary, neither of which is exorbitant for a player of Horn\'s production. By extending his contract, the Saints could give him a raise and at the same time lower his salary cap figure. What the heck was all that talk in the papers/radio about his salary being HUGE next year. Thats not exactly what I\'d consider huge. I like the extension idea to lower cap. McAllister\'s deal might be more problematic. Blockbuster deals for Clinton Portis and LaDainian Tomlinson last fall complicated negotiations. Portis\' eight-year deal included $17 million in guaranteed money in the first four years of the contract. Tomlinson\'s eight-year deal included $20.5 million in guaranteed money in the first three years. Anything similar for McAllister would assure him the top contract in club history. If he wants anything close to Portis or Tomlinson I show him the door. If the Saints need more cap room, space could be made with several simple moves.Releasing veteran wide receiver Jerome Pathon, who is due a $2.5 million base salary and $650,000 roster bonus this spring, would clear $2.3 million. Bye Jerome. The Saints could clear more by releasing or restructuring deals with veterans Ashley Ambrose ($1.8 million), Derrick Rodgers ($1.7 million) and Orlando Ruff ($1.2 million). Don\'t let the door hit ya. Howard...Another option is to designate Howard as a transition free agent. That would allow Howard to test the market but grant the Saints the right to match any offer he receives from another team. They also could elect to sign Howard to a cap-friendly, long-term deal, then trade him to another club. That would clear his cap room as well as the logjam the team has at defensive end. Team officials are eager to find playing time for Will Smith, who earned All-Rookie honors with 7.5 sacks. I like both of these options. I just hope we get something for him. A perfect trade would be to swap Howard for a true 2-gap DT. On offense, ... Don\'t expect Riley back. He\'s the Grady Jackson of O-linemen. He\'ll leave and have success elsewhere but his old inconsistency habits will resurface eventually. KC knew it, now we know it. It\'s a decent year for two of their primary areas of need: linebacker and offensive line. Tackles Jonas Jennings, Floyd Womack, Kareem McKenzie and Floyd Womack are on the market. Linebackers Kendrell Bell of Pittsburgh and Edgerton Harwell of Baltimore will be top prospects. Edgar and Pork chop! SIGN BOTH! Watson can probably play WLB as well as MLB. The draft grows deeper by the day...... That could push a top cornerback, linebacker or offensive linemen to them at No. 16. Linebacker! LINEBACKER!!!! Free agent acquisitions Brian Young, Aaron Stecker and Jamar Nesbit played key roles and were solid additions to the locker room. Ditto for Jason Craft, who was acquired in a trade with Jacksonville. Now go get a 2-gap DT, and a stud LB.

01-10-2005, 10:43 AM	#14
mutineer10 Site Donor Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baton Rouge, LA Posts: 1,739	Changes on the Way (TP must read) Believe me. Coaching isn\'t going to make our offensive line good. Maybe not, but what in the heck will keep them from leading the league in false starts (often on first down, for chrissake!) and holding penalties? These are mental mistakes. Are the O-linemen poorly coached or are they just morons? For that matter, who\'s finally gonna teach Leon how to read a defense? Who had started calling the plays when our defense improved? In fact, if coaches don\'t do anything, why do we need them at all? We should just clear the sideline and let Leon draw the play on the ground with a stick. He IS great, after all...

01-10-2005, 10:53 AM	#15
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Changes on the Way (TP must read) Then why oh why WhoDat did he change the offense??????? It was a mistake, no question. And he\'s not perfect either - far from it. Here\'s my point: Look at the main players (personnel wise) involved and consider: Venturi - inherited a defense that lead the league in sacks two years in a row, that was nasty and attacking. Went big, then went fast. Changed to a read and react scheme. Defenses finshed 18th, 23rd, 27th, and 32nd - or something like that. When it was rumored that Jim or someone else took over more of the play calling, the defense turned around. Clearly this guy needs to go. Haslett - took Ditka\'s team to the playoffs in his first year. Since then he has revamped the players twice to get \"his\" team with the same results every year. Inconsistent, undisciplined, underachieving. At some point, the guy has to be held responsible for not turning this thng around. Mueller - got in on his brother\'s shirt tails. It certainly seems by the decisions that have been made and the information coming out now the guy isn\'t worth his salt. I think everyone agrees that we need better talent evaluation. Loomis - This guy can name two NFL formations - the nickel and dime. He\'s done a fantastic job with contracts to keep this team in great cap shape for 3 years. That\'s about it. He doesn\'t seem to know football and he is better served on the business operations side, and dealing with contracts. McCarthy - took a traditionally terrible offense and made it dangerous. I don\'t remember how the offense finished in 2000, but the last 4 years, if memroy serves, he\'s got two top ten finishes, once at 11th, and this year, the worst yet, 15th. We\'d all s--t our pants if the defense finished 15th. His playcalling can be questionable, and this year was bad. I just don\'t think you flush him b/c of that. I mean - the knocks on that side of the ball are inconsistent play from the line and QB (I don\'t know how HE fixes that. I guess you have to hold him responsible, but it\'s not like he\'s getting the draft picks or FAs that the defense is), and an oft injured RB over the last few seasons. I just think that if the Saints keep anyone, it should probably be him.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

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01-10-2005, 11:57 AM	#16
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Changes on the Way (TP must read) Seems to me this year McCarthy\'s brain went the way of Venturi\'s. If it ain\'t broke, let\'s fix it and screw it all to hell. That offensive change was a HUGE mistake and cost us some games, I feel. Defense didn\'t help, but 7 points against Seattle and the Cards is just ridiculous. And I just can\'t get by the not scoring in the first quarter bit for the vast majority of the year. What is he doing all week? That kills me. It was an albatross around the whole team\'s neck until the special teams got us some first quarter points late in the season. Why can they score in the second half and not the first if they gameplan all week? Surely some of this is McCarthy. Certainly he doesn\'t deserve as much of the blame, but if you see a pile of turds on your porch, do you try to distinguish one turd from the others or hose off the whole stinking pile?

01-10-2005, 02:39 PM	#17
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Changes on the Way (TP must read) I agree Whoodi - the whole pile of deserves to get sprayed the hell out of here. But that won\'t happen. Thus, if forced to distinguish between the, I\'ll take the beagle-sized well formed (McCarthy) over the Rottweiler-sized mushy (Haslett) or the giant liquidy mess of Great Dane (Venturi). Why was that? [Edited on 10/1/2005 by JOESAM2002]
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631

01-10-2005, 03:09 PM	#18
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Changes on the Way (TP must read) I lost my lunch on your colorful analogy WhoDat , but I see what you are saying.