Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Impact of our last-game meaningless win over Tampa:
we dropped 5 draft spots (would be picking 8th) and we play Detroit and Arizona instead of Minnesota and San Fran

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Wouldn't every win account for that drop?

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

I'd rather they win and loose 8 spots in a crap shoot than lie down to a crappy team

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Exactly. I have never and will never hope for a Saints loss. To hell with draft position.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

When you play for nothing, and winning is detrimental to the future of the team you sit your players.

We are the real losers of the Tampa game. Tampa worked us until the 4th qtr, proved to themselves they could win if they wanted it then pulled their players and just ran it up the gut 3 downs and punted.

Everyone would be pissed if Brees got injured playing in a meaningless game yet no one cares winning that game might have cost us Beasley or Shelton. Instead we are hoping someone drops, shortsighted thinking at it's finest.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

A team that could have beat us if they wanted too. Let's not pretend we won that game. Tampa gave it to us.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Well that's on their stupid coaching staff not the Saints and yes the Succs were a crappy team, "you are what your record says you are"

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Only losers do that. We'll get whomever we get and we will continue to try to win every single game. I repeat, only losers think about the draft.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

We were losers, I don't recall the saints having a winning record last year. We should have been thinking about the draft and we are even bigger losers because we weren't. I understand the opposing point of view but it's a lack of foresight because of pride.

If Brees went down and never recovered, yet we won, would you care? I doubt it, and everyone would be calling for Payton's head.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

And look at the teams that get high draft picks every year, we use to be one of them. The Raiders and Browns have been taking primo picks for what a decade now. Not really working out for them. That's one thing I like though about the NBA. The lottery prevents teams from going Bucs style.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Who is we?

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Losing is an attitude, not the players on the field. Once a franchise goes into the lose to get a better pick mode they have given up. Screw that. Any player can go down any game. That means nothing. I want to win.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

The same WE you have in this post:
What's your point?

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

I understand the mentality I just don't agree with how strategic it is.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Exactly! You play to win and the let chips fall where they may.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Top ten picks do not determine successful franchises

Look at the rams, browns, bucs, jaguars and raiders

They are guaranteed top 5 picks for at least the last 5 years and besides the browns last year, have nothing to show for it.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Payton looked at the gimme' from Tampa as a better looking record. When history judges you sometimes wins and looses matter.

On the other hand Lovie Smith had nothing to lose by losing the game. He got better draft picks because of it. The Bucs are looking to make an impact with this draft and they are selecting at a good place to find talent. We are still picking where our record determined our place in this years draft.......fairly high.

I will go on record as saying I was all for pulling the starters and evaluating the back ups better with some film on them. Payton wanted a better record and he got it. Some fans feel the price was too high. But.......

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Those with quitting attitudes have been jettisoned from the Saints franchise.

Maybe we should adopt a new rule here.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Lol.

Football should be played like chess not checkers.

I for one am glad people don't always agree. If everyone agreed this would be a boring forum.

Winning tge game had no tangible effect on the team while losing would have. It also would have been a great time to try out sjb and powell.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Depends from your vantage point. From the comfort of your armchair and 20/20 hindsight, there are two possibilities. If you have those crystal ball abilities, an argument could be made that yes, indeed, every win accounts for that drop. That would mean that SP knew what his won/loss record was going to be... which is of course preposterous. So the second possibility is much more plausible in that the whole world knew within a spot or two what the outcome of that game would represent, win or lose, , including SP. So we went for the win, as we should have, and used the opportunity to evaluate talent for the hard decisions after the season and the cap decisions right before the draft. And we slip a few spots in the draft. Draft position sure has not bothered BB too much over the years. Saints just have not been as good as they should have recently.:jester:

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

we only beat tampa because they laid down, that's what is worst about the entire thing. Tampa intentionally lost, had they not we wouldn't have won that game

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

A small detail most have forgotten...

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Yeah, I think because it was so long ago people forget that they laid down in the second half. We all talked about how obvious it was back then.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

We might didn't lose by points but the saints lost that game. The Bucs didn't want to win that game, they pulled their starters in the second half and when it seems they were gonna still win they pulled their second string offensive lineman and put a player in with less than 5 game day experience which allowed Galette to get a safety.

If people on here say we should never lay down and lose, I'll say i will never would want to see us win a meaningless game like that.
http://blackandgold.com/saints/70348...rs-23-a-2.html

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Maybe a TD or sack enables a veteran to hit an earmark or make the PB but it doesn't happen because they are benched for backups. I know teams bench starters if they are in the Playoffs but that is a much different situation. Just playing devil's advocate here, something to think about if you are a veteran on a bad team. I would not want to lose a big incentive over a draft pick. I would be quite upset about it and would want to be traded if I missed it knowing I could have likely achieved it in two benched quarters.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Lying down is for QUITTERS, I don't care if TB "gave" the Saints that game. A win is a win in the NFL

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

They can't say much with the losing that put them in that situation in the 1st place. How would it look if you complain for incentives when you have the worst win/lost in league

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

It ain't gonna' be that bad playing Detroit ... Saints have spent the offseason rebuilding their O/L while the Lions have spent the offseason decimating their D/L, :rolleyes: ... sure, it may be a little too early to predict, but I'm pretty confident that'll be one for the New Orleans' "W" column, :neutral: ... Monday Nite game as well, time for the Saints to shine.

Arizona at their house can be a biotch though, :neutral:.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

LOL What IF, What IF, What IF? LOL

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

True, but what if you are Ryan Griffin, Stanley J-B, Powell, S.Jones, B. Coleman, etc? There will never be an opportunity to get game experience like this.
Lose the battle, win the war.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

I agree that we shouldn't just lay over and quit. You do play to win the game. That being said, it was a very pathetic, meaningless win in a pathetic, meaningless game. I agree that we should've let our backups play for evaluation purposes going into the off-season. Nobody seems to complain when we pull our starters going into the playoffs. I dont really care that much about our draft position. We could have the number one pick and he could turn out to be a failure. Many of the stars in this league aren't first rounders. The draft really is an educated guess.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

We were trying so hard to win that game (with our starters) and Tampa was trying so hard to lose (with backups).

We barely won. That's pathetic.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Big picture of this: Coach to starter "We're going to sit you this game so we lose and get a higher draft choice to come in and take your job next year." Anything for the team ( I won't be on next year ) coach!!

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

But that was happening anyway- we have shed 12 already players since that game. The players put themselves in that position.

As far as incentives, just as an example, if Gallette got 2 sacks in that game, he would have gotten $2.5 million. Other than JG and his agent, who would think that was reasonable?

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Well if he would of shown up in the previous 15 games, Gallette would of had that incentive hit before the TB game, sitting starters for a draft pick is what the Titans and Jaguars do, Saints and Payton do not

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Loosing a game on purpose...
Not sure I like that mindset in the locker room.
Draft posistion is next year. Anyone remember Finish Strong?

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

It's not about forum harmony. Trust me, I enjoy debating. Do you think I'm only here for the cats???

I just don't like the "we should quit" mentality on any team.

Besides, how do you know Payton wasn't using that game to assess who should be cut/traded?

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

Galette was #2 in the NFL with 29 QB hurries. 3 behind JJ Watt and 3 ahead of Justin Houston.

It's not like he wasn't getting there. Our secondary wasn't covering worth a $hit.

Re: Saints 23, Tampa 20
 

So what, if he was as good as those stats say then the CBs wouldn't had to cover as long as they had to during games last season