Who do you pin the loss on?

GumboBC · 02-22-2005, 12:27 PM

Just looking back at all the games from 2004. While Brooks' had a couple of bad games, our run and pass defense, and our running game on offense played a mighty big role in the losses too.

If anyone is interested here are the games of 2004!

Saints:7 Seahawks:21

Rushing:
S. Alexander 28 135 2 27
M. Strong 7 25 0 8
M. Morris 4 10 0 6

Rushing:
D. McAllister 16 57 0 12
A. Brooks 2 16 0 14
D. Stallworth 1 1 0 1

Passing:
M. Hasselbeck 19/29 246 1 1
A. Brooks 18/37 223 1 1

Saints:30 49'ers:27

Rushing:
K. Barlow 20 114 2 60
J. Robertson 9 38 1 16
T. Jackson 5 28 0 13

Rushing:
A. Stecker 15 41 0 19
A. Brooks 6 4 0 5
D. McAllister 3 1 0 4

Passing:
K. Dorsey 18/32 205 0 1
A. Brooks 25/34 279 3 0

Saints:28 Rams:25
Passing:
A. Brooks 24/41 316 1 0
M. Bulger 32/49 358 1 0

Rushing:
A. Stecker 18 106 1 42
A. Brooks 5 27 0 12
K. Carter 7 12 0 8
D. Stallworth 1 4 0 4

Rushing:
M. Faulk 12 44 1 9
M. Bulger 1 19 1 19
S. Jackson 2 15 0 13

Saints:10 Cardinals:34

Passing:
A. Brooks 24/40 242 0 0
J. McCown 12/18 157 0 0
E. Smith 1/1 21 1 0

Rushing:
A. Stecker 8 23 0 7
A. Brooks 3 13 0 8
K. Carter 3 5 0 3

Rushing:
E. Smith 21 127 1 29
T. Hambrick 16 79 1 27
O. Ayanbadejo 2 4 0 2
J. McCown 1 1 0 1

Saints:17 Bucs:20
Passing:
B. Griese 16/19 194 1 0
C. Simms 5/8 68 0 0
A. Brooks 11/23 106 2 1

Rushing:
M. Pittman 15 51 0 10
M. Clayton 2 24 0 15
M. Alstott 4 8 0 4
B. Griese 5 -2 0 3

Rushing:
D. McAllister 21 102 0 16
A. Stecker 4 27 0 23
A. Brooks 3 15 0 9
M. Karney 1 1 0 1

Saints:31 Vikings:38

Passing:
D. Culpepper 26/37 425 5 2
A. Brooks 22/38 249 1 1

Rushing:
D. McAllister 18 78 2 14
A. Brooks 3 25 1 14
A. Stecker 1 3 0 3

Rushing:
M. Moore 15 109 0 20
M. Williams 6 66 0 49
D. Culpepper 7 13 0 8

Saints:21 Raiders:26
Passing:
A. Brooks 23/39 282 1 0
K. Collins 26/45 350 2

Rushing:
D. McAllister 24 42 2 6
A. Brooks 3 0 0 2
A. Stecker 1 0 0 0

Rushing:
A. Zereoue 21 70 0 8
Z. Crockett 2 9 0 6
K. Collins 1 3 0 3

Saints:17 Chargers:43

Passing:
A. Brooks 16/29 173 1 1
D. Brees 22/36 257 4 0

Rushing:
D. McAllister 16 63 1 10
A. Brooks 2 15 0 15

Rushing:
J. Chatman 7 51 0 22
T. Dwight 1 48 0 48
L. Tomlinson 17 36 1 8
M. Turner 5 17 0

Saints:27 Cheifs:20

Passing:
T. Green 22/33 311 1 2
A. Brooks 15/27 259 1 1

Rushing:
D. Blaylock 33 186 1 24
T. Green 1 13 0 13
T. Richardson 1 1 0 1
E. Kennison 1 0 0 0

Rushing:
D. McAllister 16 127 1 28
D. Stallworth 1 6 0 6
A. Brooks 4 1 1 1
A. Stecker 2 0 0 0

Saints:13 Broncos:34

Passing:
J. Plummer 19/29 224 2 0
A. Brooks 34/60 377 1 3

Rushing:
R. Droughns 28 166 1 51
J. Plummer 3 -1 0 1

Rushing:
D. McAllister 13 42 0 14
A. Brooks 1 7 0 7

Saints:21 Falcons: 24

Passing:
A. Brooks 19/34 189 1 2
M. Vick 16/29 212 2 1

Rushing:
D. McAllister 23 100 0 22
D. Stallworth 1 26 0 26
A. Brooks 3 10 1 8
A. Stecker 1 5 0 5

Rushing:
M. Vick 10 69 1 16
W. Dunn 11 59 0 24
T. Duckett 12 58 0 25

Saints: 21 Panthers:32

Passing:
J. Delhomme 22/29 294 1 0
A. Brooks 20/40 251 3 2

Rushing:
N. Goings 36 122 1 19
B. Hoover 4 10 0 4
J. Delhomme 2 0 0 1

Rushing:
D. McAllister 7 22 0 11
A. Brooks 4 8 0

JKool · 02-22-2005, 01:00 PM

W-L do not belong to players. This is a team game.

shadowdrinker · 02-22-2005, 01:06 PM

What a suprise....another Brooks thread....

You post the same argument...over and over...and expect a different result?...

There\'s a word for that...but..I won\'t be the one to say it...

GumboBC · 02-22-2005, 01:10 PM

W-L do not belong to players. This is a team game.

Believe me, JKool, I could not agree more.

But there are cases where ONE player can have a play of two that dramatically effects the outcome of the game.

Especially on offense. And that\'s especially true when you have a defense like ours. Our offensive mistakes are magnified because of our terrible defense. Does that make any sense?

Take the Bucs game for example:

Saints:17 Bucs:20

We lost by 3 points. Deuce fumbled the ball twice. One was returned for 7 points. But is the loss ALL on Decue? Of course not.

Here\'s another example:

Saints:21 Falcons: 24

We lost by 3 points. Brooks threw 2 interceptions. Is the loss all on Brooks? Of course not. We were ahead with less than 2-minutes to go and the defense let the Falcons score a TD for the win. But, I can\'t blame it ALL on the defense either.

In conclusion, you are right, you win as a team and you lose as a team.

GumboBC · 02-22-2005, 01:14 PM

What a suprise....another Brooks thread....

You post the same argument...over and over...and expect a different result?...

There\'s a word for that...but..I won\'t be the one to say it...

I\'m trying to have a quality discussion with whomever would like to participate.

Feel free to join in.

Where\'s my ignore button...LMAO!!

Here\'s a tip... when you see my name on the post, just save yourself some time and ignore it. But, feel free to send me an E-mail if you wish to tell me in the future...

Let\'s keep it without the attack, shall we?

[Edited on 22/2/2005 by JOESAM2002]

JKool · 02-22-2005, 01:38 PM

But there are cases where ONE player can have a play of two that dramatically effects the outcome of the game.

I agree. However, unless that play is a score, other players are involved in whether or not it becomes 3, 6, 7, or 0 points. Thus, even when it is the offenses fault that the defense must defend from their own four yard line, some of the blame (even if it is only a small amount) goes to the defensive players.

JOESAM2002 · 02-22-2005, 02:47 PM

Come on guys. If you don\'t want to read a post or thread, then don\'t read it. No need to comment about it. Thanks.

WhoDat · 02-22-2005, 03:43 PM

Oh. Look at that. Another post from JoeSam telling the rest of us how to post. Imagine that! LOL.

It\'s a joke Joe... don\'t want to get that blood pressure up. That heart might just jump right out of your chest. Woo-saaa.

kevinn1972 · 02-22-2005, 04:28 PM

I\'m saying you have to hang it on the coaches. Haslett has to be the one to blame. It seemed like it was always one facet of the game that didn\'t play well. And Venturi, that man is the anti-Christ in my mind. DDDDDDOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWNNNNNNNN with Venturi!!!!!!!!!!!

GumboBC · 02-22-2005, 04:30 PM

I posted the stats for the individual games because I thought it might be a little easier to factor JKool\'s \"blame distribution\" theory.

By the way, JKool, I like the blame distribution idea..

Stats in no way tell the whole story, but, they do tell a story.

Anyway, I thought it was interesting. You can just never please everyone, I suppose.

02-22-2005, 12:27 PM	#1
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Who do you pin the loss on? Just looking back at all the games from 2004. While Brooks' had a couple of bad games, our run and pass defense, and our running game on offense played a mighty big role in the losses too. If anyone is interested here are the games of 2004! Saints:7 Seahawks:21 Rushing: S. Alexander 28 135 2 27 M. Strong 7 25 0 8 M. Morris 4 10 0 6 Rushing: D. McAllister 16 57 0 12 A. Brooks 2 16 0 14 D. Stallworth 1 1 0 1 Passing: M. Hasselbeck 19/29 246 1 1 A. Brooks 18/37 223 1 1 Saints:30 49'ers:27 Rushing: K. Barlow 20 114 2 60 J. Robertson 9 38 1 16 T. Jackson 5 28 0 13 Rushing: A. Stecker 15 41 0 19 A. Brooks 6 4 0 5 D. McAllister 3 1 0 4 Passing: K. Dorsey 18/32 205 0 1 A. Brooks 25/34 279 3 0 Saints:28 Rams:25 Passing: A. Brooks 24/41 316 1 0 M. Bulger 32/49 358 1 0 Rushing: A. Stecker 18 106 1 42 A. Brooks 5 27 0 12 K. Carter 7 12 0 8 D. Stallworth 1 4 0 4 Rushing: M. Faulk 12 44 1 9 M. Bulger 1 19 1 19 S. Jackson 2 15 0 13 Saints:10 Cardinals:34 Passing: A. Brooks 24/40 242 0 0 J. McCown 12/18 157 0 0 E. Smith 1/1 21 1 0 Rushing: A. Stecker 8 23 0 7 A. Brooks 3 13 0 8 K. Carter 3 5 0 3 Rushing: E. Smith 21 127 1 29 T. Hambrick 16 79 1 27 O. Ayanbadejo 2 4 0 2 J. McCown 1 1 0 1 Saints:17 Bucs:20 Passing: B. Griese 16/19 194 1 0 C. Simms 5/8 68 0 0 A. Brooks 11/23 106 2 1 Rushing: M. Pittman 15 51 0 10 M. Clayton 2 24 0 15 M. Alstott 4 8 0 4 B. Griese 5 -2 0 3 Rushing: D. McAllister 21 102 0 16 A. Stecker 4 27 0 23 A. Brooks 3 15 0 9 M. Karney 1 1 0 1 Saints:31 Vikings:38 Passing: D. Culpepper 26/37 425 5 2 A. Brooks 22/38 249 1 1 Rushing: D. McAllister 18 78 2 14 A. Brooks 3 25 1 14 A. Stecker 1 3 0 3 Rushing: M. Moore 15 109 0 20 M. Williams 6 66 0 49 D. Culpepper 7 13 0 8 Saints:21 Raiders:26 Passing: A. Brooks 23/39 282 1 0 K. Collins 26/45 350 2 Rushing: D. McAllister 24 42 2 6 A. Brooks 3 0 0 2 A. Stecker 1 0 0 0 Rushing: A. Zereoue 21 70 0 8 Z. Crockett 2 9 0 6 K. Collins 1 3 0 3 Saints:17 Chargers:43 Passing: A. Brooks 16/29 173 1 1 D. Brees 22/36 257 4 0 Rushing: D. McAllister 16 63 1 10 A. Brooks 2 15 0 15 Rushing: J. Chatman 7 51 0 22 T. Dwight 1 48 0 48 L. Tomlinson 17 36 1 8 M. Turner 5 17 0 Saints:27 Cheifs:20 Passing: T. Green 22/33 311 1 2 A. Brooks 15/27 259 1 1 Rushing: D. Blaylock 33 186 1 24 T. Green 1 13 0 13 T. Richardson 1 1 0 1 E. Kennison 1 0 0 0 Rushing: D. McAllister 16 127 1 28 D. Stallworth 1 6 0 6 A. Brooks 4 1 1 1 A. Stecker 2 0 0 0 Saints:13 Broncos:34 Passing: J. Plummer 19/29 224 2 0 A. Brooks 34/60 377 1 3 Rushing: R. Droughns 28 166 1 51 J. Plummer 3 -1 0 1 Rushing: D. McAllister 13 42 0 14 A. Brooks 1 7 0 7 Saints:21 Falcons: 24 Passing: A. Brooks 19/34 189 1 2 M. Vick 16/29 212 2 1 Rushing: D. McAllister 23 100 0 22 D. Stallworth 1 26 0 26 A. Brooks 3 10 1 8 A. Stecker 1 5 0 5 Rushing: M. Vick 10 69 1 16 W. Dunn 11 59 0 24 T. Duckett 12 58 0 25 Saints: 21 Panthers:32 Passing: J. Delhomme 22/29 294 1 0 A. Brooks 20/40 251 3 2 Rushing: N. Goings 36 122 1 19 B. Hoover 4 10 0 4 J. Delhomme 2 0 0 1 Rushing: D. McAllister 7 22 0 11 A. Brooks 4 8 0
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-22-2005, 01:00 PM	#2
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Who do you pin the loss on? W-L do not belong to players. This is a team game.

02-22-2005, 01:06 PM	#3
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517	Who do you pin the loss on? What a suprise....another Brooks thread.... You post the same argument...over and over...and expect a different result?... There\'s a word for that...but..I won\'t be the one to say it...
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517

02-22-2005, 01:10 PM	#4
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Who do you pin the loss on? W-L do not belong to players. This is a team game. Believe me, JKool, I could not agree more. But there are cases where ONE player can have a play of two that dramatically effects the outcome of the game. Especially on offense. And that\'s especially true when you have a defense like ours. Our offensive mistakes are magnified because of our terrible defense. Does that make any sense? Take the Bucs game for example: Saints:17 Bucs:20 We lost by 3 points. Deuce fumbled the ball twice. One was returned for 7 points. But is the loss ALL on Decue? Of course not. Here\'s another example: Saints:21 Falcons: 24 We lost by 3 points. Brooks threw 2 interceptions. Is the loss all on Brooks? Of course not. We were ahead with less than 2-minutes to go and the defense let the Falcons score a TD for the win. But, I can\'t blame it ALL on the defense either. In conclusion, you are right, you win as a team and you lose as a team.
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-22-2005, 01:14 PM	#5
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Who do you pin the loss on? What a suprise....another Brooks thread.... You post the same argument...over and over...and expect a different result?... There\'s a word for that...but..I won\'t be the one to say it... I\'m trying to have a quality discussion with whomever would like to participate. Feel free to join in. Where\'s my ignore button...LMAO!! Here\'s a tip... when you see my name on the post, just save yourself some time and ignore it. But, feel free to send me an E-mail if you wish to tell me in the future... Let\'s keep it without the attack, shall we? [Edited on 22/2/2005 by JOESAM2002]
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

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02-22-2005, 01:38 PM	#6
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Who do you pin the loss on? But there are cases where ONE player can have a play of two that dramatically effects the outcome of the game. I agree. However, unless that play is a score, other players are involved in whether or not it becomes 3, 6, 7, or 0 points. Thus, even when it is the offenses fault that the defense must defend from their own four yard line, some of the blame (even if it is only a small amount) goes to the defensive players.

02-22-2005, 02:47 PM	#7
JOESAM2002 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: CRYSTAL BEACH TEXAS Posts: 4,100	Who do you pin the loss on? Come on guys. If you don\'t want to read a post or thread, then don\'t read it. No need to comment about it. Thanks.

02-22-2005, 03:43 PM	#8
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Who do you pin the loss on? Oh. Look at that. Another post from JoeSam telling the rest of us how to post. Imagine that! LOL. It\'s a joke Joe... don\'t want to get that blood pressure up. That heart might just jump right out of your chest. Woo-saaa.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631

02-22-2005, 04:28 PM	#9
kevinn1972 Registered Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Wichita Falls, TX Posts: 71	Who do you pin the loss on? I\'m saying you have to hang it on the coaches. Haslett has to be the one to blame. It seemed like it was always one facet of the game that didn\'t play well. And Venturi, that man is the anti-Christ in my mind. DDDDDDOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWNNNNNNNN with Venturi!!!!!!!!!!!

02-22-2005, 04:30 PM	#10
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Who do you pin the loss on? I posted the stats for the individual games because I thought it might be a little easier to factor JKool\'s \"blame distribution\" theory. By the way, JKool, I like the blame distribution idea.. Stats in no way tell the whole story, but, they do tell a story. Anyway, I thought it was interesting. You can just never please everyone, I suppose.
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616