2016 Saints Free Agency

The Dude · 01-09-2016, 09:37 PM

Evans played well in spite of injury. I think he's good for one more year. I doubt Byrd and Browner will go anywhere. Too many other holes to start over at their position. Plus the cap implications would hurt. We get a pass rusher along side Evans and I have a feeling we will all have forgiven Browner by mid season.

AsylumGuido · 01-09-2016, 09:47 PM

Originally Posted by jeanpierre

And yet you feel the need to post and antagonize...

You pretty much confirmed what you've signaled in your other posts, you're pretty unhappy unless you're tearing down other people...

I feel sorry for you that you're that pathetic...

And I have seen your own share of personally attacking the current ownership.

As far as happiness, I am abounding in it. Always. I simply pointed out how silly it was to even infer that any of us as fans could honestly feel that we could educate the professionals that have access to tons more information than any of us could dream to have.

I understand this is a fun exercise that gets you prepared for the next real portion of the "season", the free agent market and draft, where we are all nothing more than eager fans.

I have no problem with those that get into this. It is the implication that the front office could learn from it that I continuously find amusing.

That was all I was pointing out.

jeanpierre · 01-09-2016, 11:14 PM

Originally Posted by ChrisXVI

Dennis Allen has never run a 3-4 defense so let's look for guys that will fit on a 4 man front.

Regardless of preferences to a 3-4 or a 4-3 scheme, not to mention the sub packages (nickel, dime), here's the thing...

We've posted this on multiple threads that we've drafted players that would seem to be better suited to a 3-4 base front...

After Payton made the declaration to move to a 3-4, and in the following draft we traded two picks to move up and select NT John Jenkins...

Stephone Anthony will be a fine Mike in either front, but could be more of a playmaker in a 3-4...

Hau'oli Kikaha would be a way better OLB in a 3-4 where he's focused more of rushing the passer, as is his strength, rather than in a 4-3 where he's dropping more into coverage...

Then we took another OLB in Davis Tull who's very much a clone of Kikaha...

Then there's the wasted talent on the bench of Kasim Edebali who's got five sacks in very limited play...

I'd rather just get a 3-4 defensive coordinator to see this thing through rather than change course mid-stream again and spend 2-3 seasons rebuilding for a 4-3...

It's just this rudderless zig-zaging that is the primary cause for our defense sucking balls...

Allen is obviously a much more organized, meticulous coach than Ryan was...

But we need a Defensive Coordinator who'll scheme with what we have rather than putting his system in and trying to fit square pegs into round holes...

rezburna · 01-10-2016, 01:16 AM

We might as well stick with the 3-4 defense. I'd make serious runs at both Tamba Hali and Aldon Smith. Sign both of them. I'd move Ellerbe inside with Anthony. Kikiha would become a rotational player and learn from a veteran pass rusher like Hali. I'd also go after Kelvin Sheppard. Let Ellerbe be a rotational guy and conserve his health. With the upgrade at rushing the passer, the defense is set.

We have to release Colston, Browner, Evans and Strief. I'd let a good majority of our free agents walk as well. Restructure Brees, and continue the youth movement.

jeanpierre · 01-10-2016, 06:50 AM

Originally Posted by rezburna

We might as well stick with the 3-4 defense. I'd make serious runs at both Tamba Hali and Aldon Smith. Sign both of them. I'd move Ellerbe inside with Anthony. Kikiha would become a rotational player and learn from a veteran pass rusher like Hali. I'd also go after Kelvin Sheppard. Let Ellerbe be a rotational guy and conserve his health. With the upgrade at rushing the passer, the defense is set.

We have to release Colston, Browner, Evans and Strief. I'd let a good majority of our free agents walk as well. Restructure Brees, and continue the youth movement.

Rez, believe we have the pieces needed at OLB if we scheme more 3-4...

But we'd definitely need some help on the inside; I like Broncos' ILB Danny Trevathan to complement Anthony...

Agree with the cuts; Colston is painful as he's been a class act and a warrior throughout, but his cap number is far too great; unsure he'd want a reduced role...

Evans and Strief are done; Evans hasn't played all-out since he got paid; Strief is the model of overachiever since being a 7th round pick and a great teammate, but he's an old 7th round pick, and it's shown...

Browner just got on my wrong side with his preseason comment about wanting to return to the S'hawks; his play was awful and continued a pattern from his New England tenure where he was benched inactive for the post-season...

Why we signed Browner is one of the great mysteries...

brees84 · 01-10-2016, 08:39 AM

Broncos have two great MLBs who will be free agents. Trevathan and Marshall. They have to pay Von Miller so one of those guys will leave.
Huge upgrade if we sign one of those two.

halloween 65 · 01-10-2016, 09:40 AM

Originally Posted by jeanpierre

Regardless of preferences to a 3-4 or a 4-3 scheme, not to mention the sub packages (nickel, dime), here's the thing...

We've posted this on multiple threads that we've drafted players that would seem to be better suited to a 3-4 base front...

After Payton made the declaration to move to a 3-4, and in the following draft we traded two picks to move up and select NT John Jenkins...

Stephone Anthony will be a fine Mike in either front, but could be more of a playmaker in a 3-4...

Hau'oli Kikaha would be a way better OLB in a 3-4 where he's focused more of rushing the passer, as is his strength, rather than in a 4-3 where he's dropping more into coverage...

Then we took another OLB in Davis Tull who's very much a clone of Kikaha...

Then there's the wasted talent on the bench of Kasim Edebali who's got five sacks in very limited play...

I'd rather just get a 3-4 defensive coordinator to see this thing through rather than change course mid-stream again and spend 2-3 seasons rebuilding for a 4-3...

It's just this rudderless zig-zaging that is the primary cause for our defense sucking balls...

Allen is obviously a much more organized, meticulous coach than Ryan was...

But we need a Defensive Coordinator who'll scheme with what we have rather than putting his system in and trying to fit square pegs into round holes...

If we go 3-4 I will agree that Anthony will be fine, hell I'll go as far a saying he becomes a stud in a 3-4, thats a stretch for me not wanting him in the draft but in a 4-3 I don't see it at all he has a long, long way to go in that scheme. Tull is still a ? mark but I do like his motor. Now Ediboli I think we have a very good OLB in a 3-4 . This draft is loaded with ILB and OLB that could help set the lb.'ers for years. I still slide Ellerbe on the inside with Anthony and Ediboli on the outside draft a OLB that can be a 3 down player and let Ellerbe groom a young thumper to compliment Anthony and fill in immediately if Ellerbe or Anthony go down. That gaping hole in the middle has plagued us for a long time and still hasn't been fixed year after year. I still draft a OG and a big run stuffing DE before anything else. I do agree about a SS also and totally agree about a 3-4 DC just as long as he can pick his staff.You made a great point about constantly flip flooping schemes, it usually if ever works quickly.

hagan714 · 01-10-2016, 10:03 AM

The blame for this mess rests with Rob Ryan, These are the players he wanted. He got rid of the players he did not want. So sticking with 34 seems like long long road to rebuilding an average defense. 43 appears to be the answer with the roster, draft and lack of cap money. Just fielding a competitive 43 defense is with reach for 2016.

Safety is a position were a ton of money was spent and nothing has been done to maximize that investment. So I hope they address the option in the back end at safety and get a player that helps maximize Byrd investment. KV is not a complimentary safety to Byrd.

OLB that can run the edges and cover is huge

After that a CB that can tackle, A DT/NT that does little more than eat up space. DE? just keep adding quality of depth this year. Setting the edge against the run must out weigh the desire for sacks.

Like I said it will take time to clean up this mess Rob put together either way.

By the end of round 3 in the draft we should have an idea what the saints are going to do. great if the first pick in the draft answers our question.

I still believe either way we go the saints can field a defense next year that is competitive with Rob out of picture with little trouble.

Pick for 2017 baby ......2017

K Major · 01-10-2016, 10:58 AM

Originally Posted by hagan714

OLB that can run the edges and cover is huge

After that a CB that can tackle, A DT/NT that does little more than eat up space. DE? just keep adding quality of depth this year. Setting the edge against the run must out weigh the desire for sacks.

I second that. Finding a OLB who can cover TE's has to be a huge priority this off season.

Yes sir. Did you notice NT -POE yesterday for KC? Man this guy can really clog up the middle. Made the Texans one dimensional ... if we can do a better job in this area, we can win most of the battles.

Continue to build a solid foundation through the draft.

K Major · 01-10-2016, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by jeanpierre

We've posted this on multiple threads that we've drafted players that would seem to be better suited to a 3-4 base front...

Hau'oli Kikaha would be a way better OLB in a 3-4 where he's focused more of rushing the passer, as is his strength, rather than in a 4-3 where he's dropping more into coverage...

If DA stays as DC, why not use Kikaha and Tull in similar fashion as Oakland uses Mack (SAM LB & a rush DE nickle/sub packages)?

01-09-2016, 09:37 PM	#21
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Evans played well in spite of injury. I think he's good for one more year. I doubt Byrd and Browner will go anywhere. Too many other holes to start over at their position. Plus the cap implications would hurt. We get a pass rusher along side Evans and I have a feeling we will all have forgiven Browner by mid season.
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048

01-09-2016, 09:47 PM	#22
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,210	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Originally Posted by jeanpierre And yet you feel the need to post and antagonize... You pretty much confirmed what you've signaled in your other posts, you're pretty unhappy unless you're tearing down other people... I feel sorry for you that you're that pathetic... And I have seen your own share of personally attacking the current ownership. As far as happiness, I am abounding in it. Always. I simply pointed out how silly it was to even infer that any of us as fans could honestly feel that we could educate the professionals that have access to tons more information than any of us could dream to have. I understand this is a fun exercise that gets you prepared for the next real portion of the "season", the free agent market and draft, where we are all nothing more than eager fans. I have no problem with those that get into this. It is the implication that the front office could learn from it that I continuously find amusing. That was all I was pointing out.

01-09-2016, 11:14 PM	#23
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Originally Posted by ChrisXVI Dennis Allen has never run a 3-4 defense so let's look for guys that will fit on a 4 man front. Regardless of preferences to a 3-4 or a 4-3 scheme, not to mention the sub packages (nickel, dime), here's the thing... We've posted this on multiple threads that we've drafted players that would seem to be better suited to a 3-4 base front... After Payton made the declaration to move to a 3-4, and in the following draft we traded two picks to move up and select NT John Jenkins... Stephone Anthony will be a fine Mike in either front, but could be more of a playmaker in a 3-4... Hau'oli Kikaha would be a way better OLB in a 3-4 where he's focused more of rushing the passer, as is his strength, rather than in a 4-3 where he's dropping more into coverage... Then we took another OLB in Davis Tull who's very much a clone of Kikaha... Then there's the wasted talent on the bench of Kasim Edebali who's got five sacks in very limited play... I'd rather just get a 3-4 defensive coordinator to see this thing through rather than change course mid-stream again and spend 2-3 seasons rebuilding for a 4-3... It's just this rudderless zig-zaging that is the primary cause for our defense sucking balls... Allen is obviously a much more organized, meticulous coach than Ryan was... But we need a Defensive Coordinator who'll scheme with what we have rather than putting his system in and trying to fit square pegs into round holes... hagan714, \|Mitch\|, The Dude and 5 others like this.
	It's not that my way is the right way, I just make the right way my way... Last edited by jeanpierre; 01-10-2016 at 06:41 AM..

01-10-2016, 01:16 AM	#24
rezburna 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Kenner, LA Posts: 7,903	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency We might as well stick with the 3-4 defense. I'd make serious runs at both Tamba Hali and Aldon Smith. Sign both of them. I'd move Ellerbe inside with Anthony. Kikiha would become a rotational player and learn from a veteran pass rusher like Hali. I'd also go after Kelvin Sheppard. Let Ellerbe be a rotational guy and conserve his health. With the upgrade at rushing the passer, the defense is set. We have to release Colston, Browner, Evans and Strief. I'd let a good majority of our free agents walk as well. Restructure Brees, and continue the youth movement.
	"The first need of a free people is to define their own terms.” - Stokely Carmichael

01-10-2016, 06:50 AM	#25
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Originally Posted by rezburna We might as well stick with the 3-4 defense. I'd make serious runs at both Tamba Hali and Aldon Smith. Sign both of them. I'd move Ellerbe inside with Anthony. Kikiha would become a rotational player and learn from a veteran pass rusher like Hali. I'd also go after Kelvin Sheppard. Let Ellerbe be a rotational guy and conserve his health. With the upgrade at rushing the passer, the defense is set. We have to release Colston, Browner, Evans and Strief. I'd let a good majority of our free agents walk as well. Restructure Brees, and continue the youth movement. Rez, believe we have the pieces needed at OLB if we scheme more 3-4... But we'd definitely need some help on the inside; I like Broncos' ILB Danny Trevathan to complement Anthony... Agree with the cuts; Colston is painful as he's been a class act and a warrior throughout, but his cap number is far too great; unsure he'd want a reduced role... Evans and Strief are done; Evans hasn't played all-out since he got paid; Strief is the model of overachiever since being a 7th round pick and a great teammate, but he's an old 7th round pick, and it's shown... Browner just got on my wrong side with his preseason comment about wanting to return to the S'hawks; his play was awful and continued a pattern from his New England tenure where he was benched inactive for the post-season... Why we signed Browner is one of the great mysteries... rezburna and brees84 like this.
	It's not that my way is the right way, I just make the right way my way... Last edited by jeanpierre; 01-10-2016 at 07:27 AM..

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01-10-2016, 08:39 AM	#26
brees84 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 3,015	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Broncos have two great MLBs who will be free agents. Trevathan and Marshall. They have to pay Von Miller so one of those guys will leave. Huge upgrade if we sign one of those two. MarchingOn and ctsaint01 like this.
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01-10-2016, 09:40 AM	#27
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Originally Posted by jeanpierre Regardless of preferences to a 3-4 or a 4-3 scheme, not to mention the sub packages (nickel, dime), here's the thing... We've posted this on multiple threads that we've drafted players that would seem to be better suited to a 3-4 base front... After Payton made the declaration to move to a 3-4, and in the following draft we traded two picks to move up and select NT John Jenkins... Stephone Anthony will be a fine Mike in either front, but could be more of a playmaker in a 3-4... Hau'oli Kikaha would be a way better OLB in a 3-4 where he's focused more of rushing the passer, as is his strength, rather than in a 4-3 where he's dropping more into coverage... Then we took another OLB in Davis Tull who's very much a clone of Kikaha... Then there's the wasted talent on the bench of Kasim Edebali who's got five sacks in very limited play... I'd rather just get a 3-4 defensive coordinator to see this thing through rather than change course mid-stream again and spend 2-3 seasons rebuilding for a 4-3... It's just this rudderless zig-zaging that is the primary cause for our defense sucking balls... Allen is obviously a much more organized, meticulous coach than Ryan was... But we need a Defensive Coordinator who'll scheme with what we have rather than putting his system in and trying to fit square pegs into round holes... If we go 3-4 I will agree that Anthony will be fine, hell I'll go as far a saying he becomes a stud in a 3-4, thats a stretch for me not wanting him in the draft but in a 4-3 I don't see it at all he has a long, long way to go in that scheme. Tull is still a ? mark but I do like his motor. Now Ediboli I think we have a very good OLB in a 3-4 . This draft is loaded with ILB and OLB that could help set the lb.'ers for years. I still slide Ellerbe on the inside with Anthony and Ediboli on the outside draft a OLB that can be a 3 down player and let Ellerbe groom a young thumper to compliment Anthony and fill in immediately if Ellerbe or Anthony go down. That gaping hole in the middle has plagued us for a long time and still hasn't been fixed year after year. I still draft a OG and a big run stuffing DE before anything else. I do agree about a SS also and totally agree about a 3-4 DC just as long as he can pick his staff.You made a great point about constantly flip flooping schemes, it usually if ever works quickly.

01-10-2016, 10:03 AM	#28
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency The blame for this mess rests with Rob Ryan, These are the players he wanted. He got rid of the players he did not want. So sticking with 34 seems like long long road to rebuilding an average defense. 43 appears to be the answer with the roster, draft and lack of cap money. Just fielding a competitive 43 defense is with reach for 2016. Safety is a position were a ton of money was spent and nothing has been done to maximize that investment. So I hope they address the option in the back end at safety and get a player that helps maximize Byrd investment. KV is not a complimentary safety to Byrd. OLB that can run the edges and cover is huge After that a CB that can tackle, A DT/NT that does little more than eat up space. DE? just keep adding quality of depth this year. Setting the edge against the run must out weigh the desire for sacks. Like I said it will take time to clean up this mess Rob put together either way. By the end of round 3 in the draft we should have an idea what the saints are going to do. great if the first pick in the draft answers our question. I still believe either way we go the saints can field a defense next year that is competitive with Rob out of picture with little trouble. Pick for 2017 baby ......2017
	"We may have lost the game, but you'll be hurting tomorrow." Doug Atkins

01-10-2016, 10:58 AM	#29
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,619 Blog Entries: 3	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Originally Posted by hagan714 OLB that can run the edges and cover is huge After that a CB that can tackle, A DT/NT that does little more than eat up space. DE? just keep adding quality of depth this year. Setting the edge against the run must out weigh the desire for sacks. I second that. Finding a OLB who can cover TE's has to be a huge priority this off season. Yes sir. Did you notice NT -POE yesterday for KC? Man this guy can really clog up the middle. Made the Texans one dimensional ... if we can do a better job in this area, we can win most of the battles. Continue to build a solid foundation through the draft. MarchingOn likes this.

01-10-2016, 11:22 AM	#30
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,619 Blog Entries: 3	Re: 2016 Saints Free Agency Originally Posted by jeanpierre We've posted this on multiple threads that we've drafted players that would seem to be better suited to a 3-4 base front... Hau'oli Kikaha would be a way better OLB in a 3-4 where he's focused more of rushing the passer, as is his strength, rather than in a 4-3 where he's dropping more into coverage... If DA stays as DC, why not use Kikaha and Tull in similar fashion as Oakland uses Mack (SAM LB & a rush DE nickle/sub packages)?

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