Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 712270)

I believe if we don't have a deep, deep playoff run with Brees under C this season then he's not going to be here next season. Another 7-9 or even a 9-7 isn't going to cut it. Could be the FO is waiting to see how things go.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712224)

I'm well aware of market value. It's been discussed for years and years, and is a secret to no one, at this point. But market "value" is mostly a residual consequence of teams being desperate and over paying. Once they over pay, the bar is set. And when that happens every decent QB, not just the elite, want to negotiate at or above that number, because the precedent is already set that teams will do anything to have stability at the QB position.

Neither Drew nor any other of these guys with 100 million plus contracts have actually "earned" that money. Nothing they do is that important when you compare it to other jobs around the world.

Originally Posted by Seer1 (Post 712206)

Ahhh, time for the defense to carry the load for a while. Let's start going the way of the Broncos instead.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712224)

I'm well aware of market value. It's been discussed for years and years, and is a secret to no one, at this point. But market "value" is mostly a residual consequence of teams being desperate and over paying. Once they over pay, the bar is set. And when that happens every decent QB, not just the elite, want to negotiate at or above that number, because the precedent is already set that teams will do anything to have stability at the QB position.

Neither Drew nor any other of these guys with 100 million plus contracts have actually "earned" that money. Nothing they do is that important when you compare it to other jobs around the world. So I get highly annoyed by this idea that the team owes Drew something extra because market value has risen since his last deal. They don't owe him anything, he has made plenty. But I get it from his perspective that he can't just take a low ball offer when he could make more elsewhere. So I'm not gonna toilet paper his house if he should leave. It's business. But the Saints have to be reasonable. They can't pay a guy his age like he's 25.

I hear what you are saying about the cap rising, and I have heard that many times from people defending Loomis' tactics. You mentioned a couple players whom the team has signed, but the problem is it's always just a player here, and a player there, each year. I'll admit that I wanted Byrd before he came here, but when I actually saw the contract I was blown away. It was extremely ill-advised to put that much into one player with as many problems as they needed to address on defense.

There never seems to be enough money to go around in free agency. And when they do sign people, it's usually a bad move. I think they over paid for Fleener, for example, but that's just my opinion. It's hard to build through the draft alone. There are so many busts. You need to have a few proven commodities. Many of the key players who were on the '09 team were not drafted by the Saints.

For the past several years Loomis has been deferring money, which has only served to keep the team out of the penalty. I don't consider that very smart business.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712225)

Really? 40 million, and still be fine? Taking that comment at face value is completely unrealistic, for one. But if it were true, then what now do you suppose is the holdup? I'm not even concerned about him leaving. I'm more curious to see how much meat will be left on the bone when his deal is done. But if they can pay him THAT much, without even having a problem, then what would be the reason to stall? Clearly it isn't that simple.

I'm almost convinced that he could actually leave and some would still insist they know what's going on, and deny that there is any actual issue with the negotiations.

Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 712273)

I just want to make sure and point out that there are 32 teams with like 60 players each so that means that there are roughly 2,000 people in the entire world that can play in the NFL. Show me another job where only 2000 people in the entire world can do it. By the way, being one of those 2000 means you work very hard. So you decide which jobs deserve which money...I see, you're the smartest guy in the room and you will decide verse say the marketplace.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 712087)

I'm older, much older, and I have no doubt Brees can play out another four year contract at a high level. You see, I may be pushin' sixty, but I am not so stuck in the past that I base the physical capability of an athlete in 2016 based upon 1980 standards. Try joining the twenty-first century. You may enjoy it.

:lol:

Originally Posted by jeanpierre (Post 712297)

Yeah, because you and Drew are studs and aging stopped in 2000... :crazy:

Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 712298)

no because aging is not the same now as 40 years ago. the science and nutrition is better. The rules make for less wear and tear, especially for qb's.

Originally Posted by jeanpierre (Post 712301)

Yeah, okay, and we haven't seen sacks like this in forty years; did that hurt? Don't worry, Drew, have a Snickers...

http://cjzero.com/gifs/DrewBreesNeckSuperSloMo.gif

And I'll remind y'all, Brees, who never misses games, missed a game last season...What's the over/under this season?

Look, he's paid, the cap hit is done and there's absolutely no need to do an extension until after a detailed evaluation of the upcoming season can be done...

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 712289)

Just saw you went to the same place that I did. It is plain as day to anyone that understands basic economics. Every commodity is always worth exactly what the consumer is willing to pay. In the NFL the consumer is the team owner. We are simply customers of that consumer's business. We should have no more concern in what a player gets paid than we would be concerned about what the lady that dry cleans our pants makes.

Why can't people understand something so basic? :confused:

Originally Posted by jeanpierre (Post 712301)

Yeah, okay, and we haven't seen sacks like this in forty years; did that hurt? Don't worry, Drew, have a Snickers...

http://cjzero.com/gifs/DrewBreesNeckSuperSloMo.gif

And I'll remind y'all, Brees, who never misses games, missed a game last season...What's the over/under this season?

Look, he's paid, the cap hit is done and there's absolutely no need to do an extension until after a detailed evaluation of the upcoming season can be done...

Originally Posted by QBREES9 (Post 712306)

For the Love of GOD, pay BREES.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712224)

I'm well aware of market value. It's been discussed for years and years, and is a secret to no one, at this point. But market "value" is mostly a residual consequence of teams being desperate and over paying. Once they over pay, the bar is set. And when that happens every decent QB, not just the elite, want to negotiate at or above that number, because the precedent is already set that teams will do anything to have stability at the QB position.

Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 712270)

I believe if we don't have a deep, deep playoff run with Brees under C this season then he's not going to be here next season. Another 7-9 or even a 9-7 isn't going to cut it. Could be the FO is waiting to see how things go.

Originally Posted by jeanpierre (Post 712301)

Yeah, okay, and we haven't seen sacks like this in forty years; did that hurt? Don't worry, Drew, have a Snickers...

http://cjzero.com/gifs/DrewBreesNeckSuperSloMo.gif

And I'll remind y'all, Brees, who never misses games, missed a game last season...What's the over/under this season?

Look, he's paid, the cap hit is done and there's absolutely no need to do an extension until after a detailed evaluation of the upcoming season can be done...

Originally Posted by 44Champs (Post 712320)

Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by Danno (Post 712309)

Pay him what?

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 712288)

In case you didn't know, Brees' agent is the same one that represents Peyton Manning. If I'm not mistaken, Condon did not broker an extension twice for Manning, but did re-sign following the final season of the contract. In fact, that is how most deals work. Extensions are the exception. Yes, it would make fans like us all warm and fuzzy, but isn't necessary. SFIAH has it nailed. The cap is no longer an issue and I can't understand why people get so hung up on what players get paid. in addition, you cannot compare what an NFL QB gets paid to what people in regular jobs get paid. How many assistant managers are the in the world working at McDonalds? How many second grade math teachers are there in the world? How many car salespeople are there in the world? There are only thirty-two NFL starting QB's in the world. The NFL mandates that a vast majority of the cap has to be spent. They are not overpaid ... at all.

Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 712270)

I believe if we don't have a deep, deep playoff run with Brees under C this season then he's not going to be here next season. Another 7-9 or even a 9-7 isn't going to cut it. Could be the FO is waiting to see how things go.

Originally Posted by 44Champs (Post 712320)

Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year.

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL (Post 712329)

I agree with 44Champs here.

And a point I'm going to keep pounding until folks actually start listening:

AFTER THIS SEASON, DREW BREES IS A FREE AGENT!

He will no longer be under contract with the Saints. The Saints will have to bid with the proverbial other 31 teams in the NFL for his services.

There is no waiting to evaluate. After the season the only options the Saints have is to bid for Brees on the open market, or to franchise for 2017 for $43 million.

BTW you already have that evaluation. The Saints defenses in 2014 and 2015 were by some measures the worst in NFL history. 7 wins in that situation is frankly a miracle.

As someone else pointed out in this thread, it seems that quite a few folks are putting forward what they would like to see happen. But those wants/beliefs don't match the reality of the situation. There seems to be this pervasive fear that Brees is suddenly not going to be a HOF caliber QB in the elite category of today's NFL.

SFIAH

Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 712334)

I get he's going to be a FA. A 38 1/2 yr. old FA at seasons end at that.

Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 712273)

I just want to make sure and point out that there are 32 teams with like 60 players each so that means that there are roughly 2,000 people in the entire world that can play in the NFL. Show me another job where only 2000 people in the entire world can do it. By the way, being one of those 2000 means you work very hard. So you decide which jobs deserve which money...I see, you're the smartest guy in the room and you will decide verse say the marketplace.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 712286)

After all of that there is the one major fact that you are missing out on. Brees' age has NOTHING to do with his value. As long as he is producing as good as any 25 year old in the league why shouldn't he be paid like one? Hell, he is better than EVERY 25 year old in the league and has shown no indication that he will not still be out-performing them three or four years from now.

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL (Post 712319)

I know there are other responses that match this. I thought I had posted this before I left out. Posting anyway.



That coupled with the available pool of money is what defined the market.


I disagree about "earned". The value of any good or service is strictly defined by what people are willing to pay for it. It's the reason that the highest paid employee in virtually every state government is the high-profile football coach.

Brees does a job in a nearly $14 billion a year market that has less than 10,000 employees at a level that less than 5 people on this planet can do. Now is it fair that the NFL has that market size? Probably not. But has Brees earned his share of the market? Absolutely.

And you are asking the correct question. You have a guy that is far outproducing all the 25 year olds that are getting paid more than he is. The desperate teams in the market will pay to get the type of stability we've had at the QB position for the last decade.


So that's the value choice that each and every GM has to make. The system is set up with cost controls for the first 5 years of the contract after the draft and an open market afterwords. Players who are extremely productive before free agency build a potential value that can be tapped on the second contract. Teams always make the value proposition that the production will continue and match the value of the dollars. Sometimes it works (Brees, Jordan, Ingram) and sometimes it doesn't (Byrd, Gallette, up until now Spiller). And the Saints will have make more of these choices in the future (Cooks, Breaux). And sometimes I think the team just takes a flyer where the value of the contract doesn't match the previous production and there is a hope that the future production will in fact pan out. As of today I put Fleener in that category.

Deferring the money is the teams hedge against bad decisions in theory. All organizations are only on the hook for guaranteed money. So pushing a chunk of money in the future allows for further evaluation into the next contract as to make decision of whether to continue to pay or not.

It has to be balanced against players wanting their money up front. The NFL is the only pro league that has deferred non guaranteed contracts. When Lebron signed his 3 year $100 million contract this month, he's going to get that money whether or not he ever steps foot on the court for Cleveland ever again. It's all guaranteed. You can see the failures of that model with Kobe as an example. His last contract paid him I believe $24 million/year over a number of years, many of which he simply did not play. That contract in the NFL would be structured as up front guaranteed money, bonus payments contingent on being on the team, and unguaranteed salary, which simply isn't paid when the player is cut.

We'll see a sample of this with Byrd next year. He'll either restructure, or he will be cut because it'll cost the team more to keep him than to cut him.

But at the end of the day, this is the chess match of the NFL. Teams like the Patriots tend to cut most of their high profile people the year before they come into big money and continue their success with getting and developing young talent. Other clubs are a continual string of poor choices. The Saints have been hit and miss. But understand it's rare that someone becomes a Hall of Famer with their second or third club. Brees has been nothing but money since 2006. So my opinion is that the title of this thread is absolutely correct.

SFIAH

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712347)

Because when you're getting old and getting beat up (we already know he can't throw as far as he used to, and there is no way in predicting how quickly his arm strength may continue to diminish) it's difficult to project forward like you can with a younger player. Did you see Peyton Manning last year? He went from breaking the single season passing yards and TD's record one year, to being maybe half that guy the next year, to being one of the worst QB's in the league last year. That big contract he signed seemed all fine and dandy two years ago. And then, suddenly, it wasn't anymore.

I'll wait for your sarcastic attempt to dance around that one.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712344)

In no way do I pretend to be the smartest guy in the room. You are basing your argument on market value within the league. That's the only reason players make the kind of money they make. What part of the word "important" did you not understand? You and others are using the lame "you're worth whatever someone wants to pay you" logic. I'm not begrudging Brees for the money he makes, despite the fact that I think his contract has been an albatross, and it would be nice if he could make a few concessions. Some players do that, and some don't.

But my point has nothing to do with market value. I said that nothing these players do is as important as some of the other jobs out there.

Just so YOU know, Millions of people through the years have fought and died, and made peanuts in the process, so that you and those who agree with you can sit here and have the lame opinion that football players are more important because there are fewer of them.

Chew on that for a minute, smart guy.

My whole point was that nobody "owes" Drew anything. If they want to pay him whatever he wants, that's them. If they don't, and he leaves, oh well. People keep talking like it would be disrespectful to him to ask him to take a little less than he could get elsewhere. It's up to Drew if he'd be willing to do that, but I'll stand by the Saints on this one, if they set a limit on what they are willing to pay. I don't know how it's going to play out in the end. I'm simply giving my opinion. Unlike some of you who have thought all off-season that you knew what was coming. That kind of crap is what deserves the "smartest guy in the room" comment.

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL (Post 712351)

There's no need to dance around it. A decline is a possibility. But you can only make the current decision with the available information. Brees was 15 games, 4800+ yards, 32 TDs for the #1 passing offense in football in 2015. He's 37 years old. That's the available information.

So you don't pull the trigger on Brees. What do you suggest the Saints do then? Take a look here at available free agent QBs for 2017:

2017 NFL Free Agents Tracker | Spotrac

You can forget about Cousins. If he has another year like 2015 Washington will tag him a second time as an exclusive franchise player then work to back up the money truck to Cousins house.

So what's the game plan if you let Brees go. There's no Rodgers or Luck waiting in the wings. The last guy that moved and playing at an elite level is Carson Palmer. But he was injured in Cincinnati.

I know that it feels like Guido and I are stating the obvious. But there simply do not seem to be any better options than Brees in the short term and the market is what it is.

Someone please show me what I'm missing. And I'm not missing the fact that Brees will be over 40 by the time he ends his next contract.

SFIAH

Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 712352)

This is why you're an absolute idiot...important has nothing to do with it. It is all about what someone is willing to pay you. Whether you like that or agree with that is utterly irrelevant. When you purchase a team you can spend your money how you choose, but since you do not own the Saints you have literally no say in how they conduct their business.

Next, people choose to spend money on the Saints. It is their choice and you or I have absolutely no ability to dictate to others how they spend their money. That is the reason that Drew can be paid this amount of money because people choose to purchase the product.

You discussing importance is asinine. People aren't paid by their importance, they're paid per their market value because the business earner determines what their value is based off of what they can do for them.

It is like you exist in some Utopian wet ****ing dream instead of reality

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712350)

I feel like a broken record having to say this over and over. And before I continue, let me make sure you understand that this is not meant to be condescending towards you. You are making a point based strictly on market value, of which I fully understand how it works. I'm arguing against the opinion that he is necessarily worth, or owed market value. We disagree on that, and that's fine. But the real disconnect here, is that you are going the long way of explaining the market, when that isn't real the point here. You should be worth what your performance states you are worth in comparison to the other players' salaries. He's worth being paid as one of the best, but he's not THE best. And without knowing for sure, I feel pretty confident that's what his agent is trying to get him paid like. That's the agent's job.

He might be out performing 25 year old's now but for how long? And I think a lot of fans are over estimating his performance. He throws a ton of passes, and has been quite turnover prone in recent years. Points per game are well down. Not all of that is his fault as he has taken a beating. He's still a top QB, but is he top 5 in terms of efficiency? I'm, not so sure, and it's the beating he keeps taking that makes me worry about his future. The line needed to be addressed. It was not. That needs to be addressed, in my opinion, before dealing out another mega contract.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712353)

I would rather not see it come to the point of Drew leaving. I think that's pretty obvious that we don't want that. But if this coaching staff and front office can't properly prepare for life after Drew then maybe we should be discussing THIER worth. Tom Brady sure wasn't a great college QB, but they developed him, and as I mentioned before, they won even without him. I look at the Ravens and see that they won two super bowls with Trent Dilfer and Joe Flacco. I think back to last year when Peyton Manning resembled Danny Wuerfful, and his team still won the Superbowl. There are other ways of winning. Allocate money wherever you have to in order to be successful, and more importantly, have the ability to develop players within your system.

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL (Post 712358)

The problem is that there's no time to do that now. The Saints are not going to be able to compete with "we need a QB stat!" teams in the open market. And honestly the Saints have made some attempts at addressing the line issues including trading for Unger and drafting Peat.

As for efficiency, Football Outsiders has a chart of QB metrics for last year:

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | QUARTERBACKS 2015

Brees was ranked 3rd in total QBR and 6th and 7th respectively in DVOR and DVOA.


That argument certainly would hold water for other QBs. But Brees run for the last 10 years is unprecedented. He isn't average by any stretch of the imagination. And on QB performance, he should be at the very top of the QB pay list.

Now the Saints have been up and down over the duration of that deal. But Brees has not.
He's averaging 5000 yards passing, 36.8 TDs, and a passer rating of 99.8 from 2012 to 2015 over the current length of the contract. So other than the 19 INTs in 2012 where exactly are the "ups and downs" you refer to?


But it's clear that they are not. And even if they were prepared, as I stated before this run is unprecedented.

I found an article that mirrors our discussion and refers to Brees explicitly. Describes it as a dilemma.

https://theringer.com/nfl-new-era-ol...ed4#.w7y03lehd

The article points out this is really new territory in the NFL. There just hasn't been an elite healthy 38 year old QB near the top of the league in the free agent market before.

BTW I don't think that Brees is asking for everything in the world. But it makes no sense for him to sign a below market contract either.

I get that you don't like the market. But that dislike doesn't change it. If Brees keeps up close to the same production that he's had the last 10 years, and the Saints make the decision not to sign him, then many teams next year will see Brees for his production: A HOF caliber 38 year old QB.

SFIAH

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL (Post 712359)

The difference in all of your examples is that each and every one of those teams carried a top 5 defense. The Saints defense in the last two years has been so bad that literally rank 35 out of 32 teams in many categories. Historically bad. 3-13 or 2-14 bad. Yet the Saints went 7-9 and amazingly actually had a chance to make the playoffs in 2014.

And I think you are still missing a critical point... moving on..



I call BS on your tons of yards comments. Brees has been a master of being efficient completing the ball and having a high yards per attempt. There is a reason that Brees has 4 of the 8 5000 yard seasons and why no other QB has more than 1. Even in today's NFL if 5000 yards was simple then a ton of QBs would attain it.

Back to the critical point, which is Brees is still playing at an elite level. So preparing for life after Brees really isn't the crucial item. Preparing to support Brees in another SuperBowl run soon certainly should be.

SFIAH

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712356)

You know what? 'guido and I argue a lot, but I have to say after reading this comment that you are the one I have the least amount of respect for on this board. Calling me an idiot is classless and childish. But I'm a big boy, I can handle your name calling.

The bigger reason is that you are a complete waffler. One day you're on one side of this subject and the next day you do a complete 180. When the season starts and Drew has a bad game, you'll say that you love Drew but he might be nearing the end. So I'm not sure what makes you think you are qualified to even make a judgement against me.

And since you want to resort to nastiness, I won't stoop to your level, but I will point something out. You have shown zero ability to understand anything I have said. You're beating a dead horse, and just randomly telling anyone you disagree with that they have no clue, or in this case calling me an idiot. You don't understand any part of what I'm trying to say. All you seem to get out of it is that I'm a massive Brees hater (which is ridiculous) and therefore everything I say is just stupid, and you don't read anything else. Sound about right?

So let me make it clear, one more time, since you keep ignoring it. I'm not talking about the business aspect of what a player "deserves" or is "worth". I wouldn't pay Drew more than 25 million if it were up to me, which of course it isn't. But some have suggested that he deserves whatever he wants because of what he has meant, and blah blah. That makes me nauseated, considering what he's already made. That's why I pointed out that nothing these athletes do is so important that we should feel indebted to them and just pay whatever. I can think of people who deserve much more and don't get it. SOOOO, with that in mind I don't get caught up in what Drew has done. I appreciate what he has done. But I think if you are the Saints it might not be wise to go higher than 25 million, or to give him many years.

And here's the thing... They might not. We just don't know what kind of money is being discussed. It's purely hypothetical. All of our discussion is hypothetical. Does that make sense?

By the way, I'm not "dictating" what the Saints should spend. I'm giving my opinion. For all you know, the Saints might have the same numbers in their collective heads that I have, or close to it. Common sense tells you there is only so much you can pay any one player. Either they don't agree with his asking price, or perhaps waiting to see how he performs this year (letting him hit the open market could allow a very QB hungry team to offer Brees an astronomical number). Either way, that tells you the Saints obviously have some hang up, which makes any assumption that the Saints will automatically pay him market value a bit premature.

I live in no alternate reality or "wet dream". It was a simple side bar comment that you decided to blow up into a toxic nuclear catastrophe. Freaking chill out.

Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 712367)

I am a consistent supporter of Brees, I don't waffle. Clearly you have no idea what you're talking about or you're making it up. He hasn't slowed down a bit. Matter of fact he had more than 4800 yards last year and he missed a game. He had a staggering 68% completion rate and threw 32 td's to 11 int's. I have never once said you like or dislike Brees because I could care less. This was about what he deserves to be paid per the market.

You're certainly jealous of what athletes make and that is kind of sad. 'oh they don't deserve it wah wah." "I would do their job any day of the week, all they do is play a game, wah wah".
Yeah you can't do their job and that is why you don't earn what they do, but cry a little more about how unfair it is, and your job is more important. Boo Hoo.

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL (Post 712341)

Once you get that then it's easy to see that the time for evaluation is over for the Saints. They have to fish or cut bait with the information they currently have because if a deal doesn't get done in the next month, then he will be a free agent next offseason.

It is the same predicament that each and every team with a high quality QB goes through. It gets even more difficult with the heir apparent has shown they are ready. There was drama with Young and Montana. There was drama with Farve and Rodgers. I predict there will be drama in the near future with Brady and Grappalo.

But it seems clear there is no Rodgers waiting in the wings on the Saints roster. Unlike Denver, it's not clear that the Saints have the defense to start from scratch at the QB position and still remain competitive in the near future.

And the simple fact is there is no real evidence of how Brees may perform 3 years from now.

Let's try a different tack here. Everyone has outlined their fears and issues. Explain what outcomes you would like to see given the circumstances. I do ask to keep everything within the realm of NFL reality. That means no Brees accepting a 2 year $40 million contracts offered at the end of the 2016 season. By any objective measure it is completely nonsensical.

Do we get someone younger and pay them the money for extended years? If so, who? Do we draft a new QB? If so who and when? Do we pay Brees? If so, how much and how long.

I agree it's a predicament. My estimation is simple. I presume the Saints want to make another championship run in the next 3 years. If that's the case it can likely only be done with Brees on board. So we pay him the smallest market contract that he'll accept. Start at 3 years/$75 million all guaranteed and work your way up from there.

That's my opinion. What's yours?

SFIAH

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712368)

Dude go crawl back into what ever closet you came out of today. If you can't think of a single constructive and half adult thing to say, then you are wasting everyone's time.

I didn't say anything I do is more or less important. I said there are more important things than what athletes do. That's a fact. Without taking into considering anything to do with an inflated market, which has nothing to do with anything I'm talking about, you cannot tell me that football players are worth what they make. I don't care if it's fair or unfair. I have no jealousy towards them. I watch and pull for these guys every freaking year. I know they will always make more than everyone else, and that doesn't bother me. What bothers me is when people start acting like taking a little less is going to kill the guy. I'm not even saying he should take less than market value. I don't want to see it go way over.

But let's say he did take less. Is he going to be hurting from that? I always hear the argument "you can't compare what an athlete does, or makes, with regular jobs". Well, that goes both ways. An athlete taking a little less won't hurt him like it would an average person. You can't afford to take less when you aren't making that much to begin with. And you aren't working for the sake of your co-workers. They aren't your teammates. You're there to do your job and there is no trophy at the end.

If an athlete wants to win bad enough he can afford to take less, and it has happened before. But I won't sit here and expect that. They are fortunate enough to be in a position of power and leverage. I don't think it's evil. Though there are certainly some greedy people out there, being rich doesn't make you automatically greedy.

Just don't tell me tossing a football around is worth hundreds of millions of dollars. "they're worth whatever someone wants to pay him"... blah blah blah. Let me break this down for you: If you needed a new car to get around and work but you decided to buy a house instead, you would consider the house worth whatever you paid for it, because it seemed like the thing to do. But then you realize that you are having a hard time paying the bills and you still don't have a car to get around. You might wish you had gotten a car and an apartment, saved some money, then bought the house. But it's too late.

You thought the house was worth it, but that doesn't mean it actually was. It turns out that in reality, you just made a dumb decision.

Now I'm not saying extending Drew would be dumb. Not at all. As long as the price is reasonable. Maybe it will be. I guess we'll all find out. I'm not worried about it. I know that whatever happens will happen, and there's nothing any of us can do about it. Maybe we'll go 7-9 again and we can all talk about how great our offense is.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 712347)

Because when you're getting old and getting beat up (we already know he can't throw as far as he used to, and there is no way in predicting how quickly his arm strength may continue to diminish) it's difficult to project forward like you can with a younger player. Did you see Peyton Manning last year? He went from breaking the single season passing yards and TD's record one year, to being maybe half that guy the next year, to being one of the worst QB's in the league last year. That big contract he signed seemed all fine and dandy two years ago. And then, suddenly, it wasn't anymore.

I'll wait for your sarcastic attempt to dance around that one.