Pay Brees!

44Champs · 08-14-2016, 05:32 PM

Originally Posted by halloween 65

I believe if we don't have a deep, deep playoff run with Brees under C this season then he's not going to be here next season. Another 7-9 or even a 9-7 isn't going to cut it. Could be the FO is waiting to see how things go.

Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

halloween 65 · 08-14-2016, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by 44Champs

Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

I'll try. If the Saints, which I believe is into the top teir in paying for the entire team has gone 7-9 the last 2 seasons with a top paid qb( I know since his last contract he's not the #1 top paid qb. today) going 7-9, 8-8, 9-7, or 10-6 would be the same thing as paying out top dollar for Brees on a 2-14, 3-13, 4-12 team, makes entirely no since. Losing is losing, so going another direction should happen sooner than later. I don't blame Brees for not making the playoffs but why "pay the man" a huge contract if we're a stellar team. It would hurt down the road again.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 08-14-2016, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by halloween 65

I believe if we don't have a deep, deep playoff run with Brees under C this season then he's not going to be here next season. Another 7-9 or even a 9-7 isn't going to cut it. Could be the FO is waiting to see how things go.

Originally Posted by 44Champs

Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year.

I agree with 44Champs here.

And a point I'm going to keep pounding until folks actually start listening:

AFTER THIS SEASON, DREW BREES IS A FREE AGENT!

He will no longer be under contract with the Saints. The Saints will have to bid with the proverbial other 31 teams in the NFL for his services.

There is no waiting to evaluate. After the season the only options the Saints have is to bid for Brees on the open market, or to franchise for 2017 for $43 million.

BTW you already have that evaluation. The Saints defenses in 2014 and 2015 were by some measures the worst in NFL history. 7 wins in that situation is frankly a miracle.

As someone else pointed out in this thread, it seems that quite a few folks are putting forward what they would like to see happen. But those wants/beliefs don't match the reality of the situation. There seems to be this pervasive fear that Brees is suddenly not going to be a HOF caliber QB in the elite category of today's NFL.

SFIAH

halloween 65 · 08-14-2016, 07:32 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

I agree with 44Champs here.

And a point I'm going to keep pounding until folks actually start listening:

AFTER THIS SEASON, DREW BREES IS A FREE AGENT!

He will no longer be under contract with the Saints. The Saints will have to bid with the proverbial other 31 teams in the NFL for his services.

There is no waiting to evaluate. After the season the only options the Saints have is to bid for Brees on the open market, or to franchise for 2017 for $43 million.

BTW you already have that evaluation. The Saints defenses in 2014 and 2015 were by some measures the worst in NFL history. 7 wins in that situation is frankly a miracle.

As someone else pointed out in this thread, it seems that quite a few folks are putting forward what they would like to see happen. But those wants/beliefs don't match the reality of the situation. There seems to be this pervasive fear that Brees is suddenly not going to be a HOF caliber QB in the elite category of today's NFL.

SFIAH

I get he's going to be a FA. A 38 1/2 yr. old FA at seasons end at that. I just don't believe he's going to be able to play at the level he played at last season at 41 or 42 yrs. old. Also I feel he is a HOF qb but to lay out a huge contract at that age is putting all your money into assuming he will be playing at this level that long, to dicey in my opionion. I think the Saints have put themselves in a predicament with this.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 08-14-2016, 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by halloween 65

I get he's going to be a FA. A 38 1/2 yr. old FA at seasons end at that.

Once you get that then it's easy to see that the time for evaluation is over for the Saints. They have to fish or cut bait with the information they currently have because if a deal doesn't get done in the next month, then he will be a free agent next offseason.

I just don't believe he's going to be able to play at the level he played at last season at 41 or 42 yrs. old. Also I feel he is a HOF qb but to lay out a huge contract at that age is putting all your money into assuming he will be playing at this level that long, to dicey in my opionion. I think the Saints have put themselves in a predicament with this.

It is the same predicament that each and every team with a high quality QB goes through. It gets even more difficult with the heir apparent has shown they are ready. There was drama with Young and Montana. There was drama with Farve and Rodgers. I predict there will be drama in the near future with Brady and Grappalo.

But it seems clear there is no Rodgers waiting in the wings on the Saints roster. Unlike Denver, it's not clear that the Saints have the defense to start from scratch at the QB position and still remain competitive in the near future.

And the simple fact is there is no real evidence of how Brees may perform 3 years from now.

Let's try a different tack here. Everyone has outlined their fears and issues. Explain what outcomes you would like to see given the circumstances. I do ask to keep everything within the realm of NFL reality. That means no Brees accepting a 2 year $40 million contracts offered at the end of the 2016 season. By any objective measure it is completely nonsensical.

Do we get someone younger and pay them the money for extended years? If so, who? Do we draft a new QB? If so who and when? Do we pay Brees? If so, how much and how long.

I agree it's a predicament. My estimation is simple. I presume the Saints want to make another championship run in the next 3 years. If that's the case it can likely only be done with Brees on board. So we pay him the smallest market contract that he'll accept. Start at 3 years/$75 million all guaranteed and work your way up from there.

That's my opinion. What's yours?

SFIAH

halloween 65 · 08-15-2016, 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

Once you get that then it's easy to see that the time for evaluation is over for the Saints. They have to fish or cut bait with the information they currently have because if a deal doesn't get done in the next month, then he will be a free agent next offseason.

It is the same predicament that each and every team with a high quality QB goes through. It gets even more difficult with the heir apparent has shown they are ready. There was drama with Young and Montana. There was drama with Farve and Rodgers. I predict there will be drama in the near future with Brady and Grappalo.

But it seems clear there is no Rodgers waiting in the wings on the Saints roster. Unlike Denver, it's not clear that the Saints have the defense to start from scratch at the QB position and still remain competitive in the near future.

And the simple fact is there is no real evidence of how Brees may perform 3 years from now.

Let's try a different tack here. Everyone has outlined their fears and issues. Explain what outcomes you would like to see given the circumstances. I do ask to keep everything within the realm of NFL reality. That means no Brees accepting a 2 year $40 million contracts offered at the end of the 2016 season. By any objective measure it is completely nonsensical.

Do we get someone younger and pay them the money for extended years? If so, who? Do we draft a new QB? If so who and when? Do we pay Brees? If so, how much and how long.

I agree it's a predicament. My estimation is simple. I presume the Saints want to make another championship run in the next 3 years. If that's the case it can likely only be done with Brees on board. So we pay him the smallest market contract that he'll accept. Start at 3 years/$75 million all guaranteed and work your way up from there.

That's my opinion. What's yours?

SFIAH

You make exceptionally good points with alot of validation and things are clearly well spoken. Some of the questions that you have ask can't be answered by anyone other than the Saints FO as I think you know. But hypothetically Brees might command another huge contract although it may be from another team but one main thing he wouldn't have is Paytons system. Brees has executed Paytons system like a true field general for the Saints there is no denying that. I do feel after this season even if Brees plays at a high level we move on with another qb. because of his age. I know it's apples and oranges but I look at how GB did with Farve, he was still playing at a high level for 2 years after he left there although the 2 systems he played in (Jets and Vikings) were totally different, one suited his stye of play the other didn't. I believe if he leaves there will be a dropoff to a point in production from a new qb. but it would be kind of unrealistic to think someone could just step in and match Brees type of numbers but it falls on Payton and his system to adjust with a new gunslinger under center. Growing pains will happen and at times might not be pretty. I also feel that next season with a couple of good G, a young qb. with a stout front line coupled with the insane firepower we have could have a pretty decent year under C. So not paying Brees a 3 or 4 year top dollar contract might not be so bad with Payton at the helm. You and I both know until the D gets fixed paying Brees or getting a new qb. want matter. Although a young qb. has more time to wait things out.

08-14-2016, 05:32 PM	#1
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589	Re: Pay Brees! Originally Posted by halloween 65 I believe if we don't have a deep, deep playoff run with Brees under C this season then he's not going to be here next season. Another 7-9 or even a 9-7 isn't going to cut it. Could be the FO is waiting to see how things go. Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589

08-14-2016, 06:05 PM	#2
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: Pay Brees! Originally Posted by 44Champs Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk I'll try. If the Saints, which I believe is into the top teir in paying for the entire team has gone 7-9 the last 2 seasons with a top paid qb( I know since his last contract he's not the #1 top paid qb. today) going 7-9, 8-8, 9-7, or 10-6 would be the same thing as paying out top dollar for Brees on a 2-14, 3-13, 4-12 team, makes entirely no since. Losing is losing, so going another direction should happen sooner than later. I don't blame Brees for not making the playoffs but why "pay the man" a huge contract if we're a stellar team. It would hurt down the road again.

08-14-2016, 06:59 PM	#3
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,783	Re: Pay Brees! Originally Posted by halloween 65 I believe if we don't have a deep, deep playoff run with Brees under C this season then he's not going to be here next season. Another 7-9 or even a 9-7 isn't going to cut it. Could be the FO is waiting to see how things go. Originally Posted by 44Champs Please expound on your point as to why that would be. Brees isnt the reason why we didnt make the playoffs and had back to back 7-9 seasons. He's the reason why we're still a contender every year. I agree with 44Champs here. And a point I'm going to keep pounding until folks actually start listening: AFTER THIS SEASON, DREW BREES IS A FREE AGENT! He will no longer be under contract with the Saints. The Saints will have to bid with the proverbial other 31 teams in the NFL for his services. There is no waiting to evaluate. After the season the only options the Saints have is to bid for Brees on the open market, or to franchise for 2017 for $43 million. BTW you already have that evaluation. The Saints defenses in 2014 and 2015 were by some measures the worst in NFL history. 7 wins in that situation is frankly a miracle. As someone else pointed out in this thread, it seems that quite a few folks are putting forward what they would like to see happen. But those wants/beliefs don't match the reality of the situation. There seems to be this pervasive fear that Brees is suddenly not going to be a HOF caliber QB in the elite category of today's NFL. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

08-14-2016, 07:32 PM	#4
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: Pay Brees! Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL I agree with 44Champs here. And a point I'm going to keep pounding until folks actually start listening: AFTER THIS SEASON, DREW BREES IS A FREE AGENT! He will no longer be under contract with the Saints. The Saints will have to bid with the proverbial other 31 teams in the NFL for his services. There is no waiting to evaluate. After the season the only options the Saints have is to bid for Brees on the open market, or to franchise for 2017 for $43 million. BTW you already have that evaluation. The Saints defenses in 2014 and 2015 were by some measures the worst in NFL history. 7 wins in that situation is frankly a miracle. As someone else pointed out in this thread, it seems that quite a few folks are putting forward what they would like to see happen. But those wants/beliefs don't match the reality of the situation. There seems to be this pervasive fear that Brees is suddenly not going to be a HOF caliber QB in the elite category of today's NFL. SFIAH I get he's going to be a FA. A 38 1/2 yr. old FA at seasons end at that. I just don't believe he's going to be able to play at the level he played at last season at 41 or 42 yrs. old. Also I feel he is a HOF qb but to lay out a huge contract at that age is putting all your money into assuming he will be playing at this level that long, to dicey in my opionion. I think the Saints have put themselves in a predicament with this.

08-14-2016, 09:44 PM	#5
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,783	Re: Pay Brees! Originally Posted by halloween 65 I get he's going to be a FA. A 38 1/2 yr. old FA at seasons end at that. Once you get that then it's easy to see that the time for evaluation is over for the Saints. They have to fish or cut bait with the information they currently have because if a deal doesn't get done in the next month, then he will be a free agent next offseason. I just don't believe he's going to be able to play at the level he played at last season at 41 or 42 yrs. old. Also I feel he is a HOF qb but to lay out a huge contract at that age is putting all your money into assuming he will be playing at this level that long, to dicey in my opionion. I think the Saints have put themselves in a predicament with this. It is the same predicament that each and every team with a high quality QB goes through. It gets even more difficult with the heir apparent has shown they are ready. There was drama with Young and Montana. There was drama with Farve and Rodgers. I predict there will be drama in the near future with Brady and Grappalo. But it seems clear there is no Rodgers waiting in the wings on the Saints roster. Unlike Denver, it's not clear that the Saints have the defense to start from scratch at the QB position and still remain competitive in the near future. And the simple fact is there is no real evidence of how Brees may perform 3 years from now. Let's try a different tack here. Everyone has outlined their fears and issues. Explain what outcomes you would like to see given the circumstances. I do ask to keep everything within the realm of NFL reality. That means no Brees accepting a 2 year $40 million contracts offered at the end of the 2016 season. By any objective measure it is completely nonsensical. Do we get someone younger and pay them the money for extended years? If so, who? Do we draft a new QB? If so who and when? Do we pay Brees? If so, how much and how long. I agree it's a predicament. My estimation is simple. I presume the Saints want to make another championship run in the next 3 years. If that's the case it can likely only be done with Brees on board. So we pay him the smallest market contract that he'll accept. Start at 3 years/$75 million all guaranteed and work your way up from there. That's my opinion. What's yours? SFIAH AsylumGuido and halloween 65 like this.
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

08-15-2016, 07:57 AM	#6
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: Pay Brees! Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL Once you get that then it's easy to see that the time for evaluation is over for the Saints. They have to fish or cut bait with the information they currently have because if a deal doesn't get done in the next month, then he will be a free agent next offseason. It is the same predicament that each and every team with a high quality QB goes through. It gets even more difficult with the heir apparent has shown they are ready. There was drama with Young and Montana. There was drama with Farve and Rodgers. I predict there will be drama in the near future with Brady and Grappalo. But it seems clear there is no Rodgers waiting in the wings on the Saints roster. Unlike Denver, it's not clear that the Saints have the defense to start from scratch at the QB position and still remain competitive in the near future. And the simple fact is there is no real evidence of how Brees may perform 3 years from now. Let's try a different tack here. Everyone has outlined their fears and issues. Explain what outcomes you would like to see given the circumstances. I do ask to keep everything within the realm of NFL reality. That means no Brees accepting a 2 year $40 million contracts offered at the end of the 2016 season. By any objective measure it is completely nonsensical. Do we get someone younger and pay them the money for extended years? If so, who? Do we draft a new QB? If so who and when? Do we pay Brees? If so, how much and how long. I agree it's a predicament. My estimation is simple. I presume the Saints want to make another championship run in the next 3 years. If that's the case it can likely only be done with Brees on board. So we pay him the smallest market contract that he'll accept. Start at 3 years/$75 million all guaranteed and work your way up from there. That's my opinion. What's yours? SFIAH You make exceptionally good points with alot of validation and things are clearly well spoken. Some of the questions that you have ask can't be answered by anyone other than the Saints FO as I think you know. But hypothetically Brees might command another huge contract although it may be from another team but one main thing he wouldn't have is Paytons system. Brees has executed Paytons system like a true field general for the Saints there is no denying that. I do feel after this season even if Brees plays at a high level we move on with another qb. because of his age. I know it's apples and oranges but I look at how GB did with Farve, he was still playing at a high level for 2 years after he left there although the 2 systems he played in (Jets and Vikings) were totally different, one suited his stye of play the other didn't. I believe if he leaves there will be a dropoff to a point in production from a new qb. but it would be kind of unrealistic to think someone could just step in and match Brees type of numbers but it falls on Payton and his system to adjust with a new gunslinger under center. Growing pains will happen and at times might not be pretty. I also feel that next season with a couple of good G, a young qb. with a stout front line coupled with the insane firepower we have could have a pretty decent year under C. So not paying Brees a 3 or 4 year top dollar contract might not be so bad with Payton at the helm. You and I both know until the D gets fixed paying Brees or getting a new qb. want matter. Although a young qb. has more time to wait things out.

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