I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT

shadowdrinker · 03-19-2005, 07:59 PM

He's not signed a new contract...but..says He will report...and NOT HOLD OUT...

http://www.neworleansprofootball.com...interview.html

Oh wow..look at the propsed deal...It's quite astounding...6 YEAR DEAL?...I'm not kidding...LARGE CONTRACT...big money...

The Saints' last offer included a $7 million signing bonus, a $2 million roster bonus in March 2006, $650,000 salary for the 2005 season, $700,000 for 06 and a $5.4 million salary in 2007. Both sides have agreed that the contract can be for six years so that the Saints can spread the signing bonus out and reduce Horn's immediate cap hit. Horn is currently due $3.8 million in base salary this season.

Wow...That's a pretty darn big contract...take particular note of the 2007 salary...

[Edited on 20/3/2005 by shadowdrinker]

spkb25 · 03-19-2005, 08:15 PM

well no its not because the only money guaranteed is the bonus. they wont resign him that last year and wont take a cap hit because of it. because he isnt going to be here at 36 for 5.4 mil. he knows that. so thats bs. but it looks to be good the first two years. what they should do in that case is make it for 4 years give him the same for the first two years add anoth 1 mil bonus his thrid year and pay him 500 grand the third year. the 4rth they can give him 12 if they want because they will let him go before they pay any bit of it. but i agree it is pretty good for two years. but the third year doesnt matter because they will never pay him that. he will be asked to take a pay cut or be released.

shadowdrinker · 03-19-2005, 09:18 PM

9 million in bonus...near 7 million in salary over 3 years?...sounds pretty large to me...

IF they decide to go 6..it will be rather huge...

spkb25 · 03-19-2005, 09:20 PM

but shadow drinker he will never see that final year.

spkb25 · 03-19-2005, 09:22 PM

so he gets 10,350,000 over two years. i mean that is nice for two years but he wont get anything the third year. he knows that. so if you give him another 1 mil. bonus with 500,000 in pay the third year it is more reasonable for him. not that i know he would sign for that. but the other contract only pays him for two years

JKool · 03-19-2005, 09:47 PM

I don\'t know how roster bonuses work with respect to the cap, but if we sign Horn to that deal, his cap number for next year will be 0.8 mil plus 1.25 mil for his averaged signing bonus. This will REDUCE our cap number for this year by about 1.8 mil.

The trick will be that third year where he will make 6.0 mil. Sure, they\'ll probably ask him to restructure at that point or cut him, but if they do, they\'ll still take a 3.75 mil for his bonus. This sounds ok to me, but I\'d try to push the big money back one more year; this way, even if he fades, we\'ll be able to keep him until his cap hit drops to 2.5 mil (and allows him to play until he is 36, if he is capable.

An interesting deal.

dberce1 · 03-20-2005, 11:30 AM

but shadow drinker he will never see that final year.

precisely, they can promise him the moon for those last few years, because they know he\'ll be cut by then. joe\'s no fool.

no_cloning · 03-20-2005, 12:39 PM

what they should do in that case is make it for 4 years give him the same for the first two years add anoth 1 mil bonus his thrid year and pay him 500 grand the third year.

So you basically change a 2-year contract averaging 5+ million to a 3-year contract averaging less than 4 million. Horn believes he has \"the body of a 25-year old\" and he can play - and at a high level - for 5 more years. So why should he accept that?
There are also problems with complicated NFL rules, namely the \"Deion Sanders rule\".
The total prorated bonus in the first three years cannot be greater than the total of the first three years of base salary, and/or reporting or roster bonuses - or something like that.

See, THAT\'s why we need Mickey Loomis.

shadowdrinker · 03-20-2005, 01:48 PM

Well..Either way..I think this shows that Horn is willing to prepare with the team, and not hold out...

He is showing that he is serious about playing here, and that He wants to be a Saint.

That\'s basically the point I was trying to get across...

He WILL be resigned obviously, and it WILL be a rather costly contract...whether or not he see\'s the final year(s) of his contract will be decided by how much our receivers step up, Or if we can get another guy next year or whatever...

Only time will tell...

JKool · 03-20-2005, 01:58 PM

Ah, good info no-cloning. The Deion rule would explain why the third year is so high. Thanks.

03-19-2005, 07:59 PM	#1
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT He's not signed a new contract...but..says He will report...and NOT HOLD OUT... http://www.neworleansprofootball.com...interview.html Oh wow..look at the propsed deal...It's quite astounding...6 YEAR DEAL?...I'm not kidding...LARGE CONTRACT...big money... The Saints' last offer included a $7 million signing bonus, a $2 million roster bonus in March 2006, $650,000 salary for the 2005 season, $700,000 for 06 and a $5.4 million salary in 2007. Both sides have agreed that the contract can be for six years so that the Saints can spread the signing bonus out and reduce Horn's immediate cap hit. Horn is currently due $3.8 million in base salary this season. Wow...That's a pretty darn big contract...take particular note of the 2007 salary... [Edited on 20/3/2005 by shadowdrinker]
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517

03-19-2005, 08:15 PM	#2
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,101	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT well no its not because the only money guaranteed is the bonus. they wont resign him that last year and wont take a cap hit because of it. because he isnt going to be here at 36 for 5.4 mil. he knows that. so thats bs. but it looks to be good the first two years. what they should do in that case is make it for 4 years give him the same for the first two years add anoth 1 mil bonus his thrid year and pay him 500 grand the third year. the 4rth they can give him 12 if they want because they will let him go before they pay any bit of it. but i agree it is pretty good for two years. but the third year doesnt matter because they will never pay him that. he will be asked to take a pay cut or be released.
	Your team stinks

03-19-2005, 09:18 PM	#3
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT 9 million in bonus...near 7 million in salary over 3 years?...sounds pretty large to me... IF they decide to go 6..it will be rather huge...
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517

03-19-2005, 09:20 PM	#4
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,101	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT but shadow drinker he will never see that final year.

03-19-2005, 09:22 PM	#5
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,101	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT so he gets 10,350,000 over two years. i mean that is nice for two years but he wont get anything the third year. he knows that. so if you give him another 1 mil. bonus with 500,000 in pay the third year it is more reasonable for him. not that i know he would sign for that. but the other contract only pays him for two years

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03-19-2005, 09:47 PM	#6
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT I don\'t know how roster bonuses work with respect to the cap, but if we sign Horn to that deal, his cap number for next year will be 0.8 mil plus 1.25 mil for his averaged signing bonus. This will REDUCE our cap number for this year by about 1.8 mil. The trick will be that third year where he will make 6.0 mil. Sure, they\'ll probably ask him to restructure at that point or cut him, but if they do, they\'ll still take a 3.75 mil for his bonus. This sounds ok to me, but I\'d try to push the big money back one more year; this way, even if he fades, we\'ll be able to keep him until his cap hit drops to 2.5 mil (and allows him to play until he is 36, if he is capable. An interesting deal.
	"... I was beating them with my eyes the whole game..." - Aaron Brooks

03-20-2005, 11:30 AM	#7
dberce1 Chuck Liddells Right Hand Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Prairieville, Louisiana Posts: 1,227	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT but shadow drinker he will never see that final year. precisely, they can promise him the moon for those last few years, because they know he\'ll be cut by then. joe\'s no fool.

03-20-2005, 12:39 PM	#8
no_cloning 100th Post Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 249	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT what they should do in that case is make it for 4 years give him the same for the first two years add anoth 1 mil bonus his thrid year and pay him 500 grand the third year. So you basically change a 2-year contract averaging 5+ million to a 3-year contract averaging less than 4 million. Horn believes he has \"the body of a 25-year old\" and he can play - and at a high level - for 5 more years. So why should he accept that? There are also problems with complicated NFL rules, namely the \"Deion Sanders rule\". The total prorated bonus in the first three years cannot be greater than the total of the first three years of base salary, and/or reporting or roster bonuses - or something like that. See, THAT\'s why we need Mickey Loomis.
no_cloning 100th Post Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 249

03-20-2005, 01:48 PM	#9
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT Well..Either way..I think this shows that Horn is willing to prepare with the team, and not hold out... He is showing that he is serious about playing here, and that He wants to be a Saint. That\'s basically the point I was trying to get across... He WILL be resigned obviously, and it WILL be a rather costly contract...whether or not he see\'s the final year(s) of his contract will be decided by how much our receivers step up, Or if we can get another guy next year or whatever... Only time will tell...
shadowdrinker Banned Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 517

03-20-2005, 01:58 PM	#10
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	I'm going to squash the Horn Debate...HORN WILL NOT HOLD OUT Ah, good info no-cloning. The Deion rule would explain why the third year is so high. Thanks.