It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees

RaginCajun83 · 09-19-2017, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II

Don't cut bait. We've got new leadership throughout this team. Our new additions have all been beneficial. Whether they are coaches, players or front office. It's a new team that needs time to become a collective unit.

I believe that Payton needs to be reigned in and let Loomis be an accountant and have a real football GM.

They hired Ireland to be the talent evaluator role of GM

73Saint · 09-19-2017, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by RaginCajun83

They hired Ireland to be the talent evaluator role of GM

Not to derail the thread, but you just indirectly pointed out our biggest problem. What we need is a COACHING talent evaluator. Where can we get one of them?

K Major · 09-19-2017, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by 73Saint

Not to derail the thread, but you just indirectly pointed out our biggest problem. What we need is a COACHING talent evaluator. Where can we get one of them?

Omar Khan.

He's a smart guy (Tulane educated), home grown and has a solid track record.

jeanpierre · 09-19-2017, 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

Omar Khan.

He's a smart guy (Tulane educated), home grown and has a solid track record.

Meh, those were some awful drafts under Mike Ditka and Jim Haslett; and I'm not so sure Omar hasn't benefited from the scenery more than his own making...

We do some tweaking with reducing Payton's GM authority, make Jeff Ireland the GM, hell, bring Parcells in as Team President if that's what it takes...

WillSaints81 · 09-22-2017, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II

Don't cut bait. We've got new leadership throughout this team. Our new additions have all been beneficial. Whether they are coaches, players or front office. It's a new team that needs time to become a collective unit.

I believe that Payton needs to be reigned in and let Loomis be an accountant and have a real football GM.

No GM wants to feel like he has less power than a HC.

Mardigras9 · 09-18-2017, 02:18 PM

Loomis and his philosophy has been a question for years. It's not that we are 0-2, that was really expected looking at the schedule, it is the ugliness of the losses. The next 2 will tell the tale of the future. We are not the only team trying to get it together out of the gates.

NOLA54 · 09-18-2017, 09:06 PM

Yep

saintshrimp · 09-18-2017, 09:48 PM

The sean payton era is pretty much over it was great for a while but all good things come to a end at somepoint the thing is to recognize it when it does. Im pretty sure i seen it for a couple years now

spkb25 · 09-19-2017, 05:13 AM

I have no idea what Benson will do, but he definitely is or appears not to be in the frame of mind to do what needs doing. I am holding out for a 3 win season if we are going to miss the playoffs again. At least maybe we finally fire SP.

That said, please stop with the fire DA threads. Jesus H Christ...how many people have to be laid out to the alter for SP? We just remade our entire defensive coaching unit to which 90% or more on this board swore was the answer. It does not appear to have been the coaching...so who is left to fire? Who is the main culprit, the common link, the least common denom?

BTW- I remember asking, when people were gushing about the new coaches, if we failed again would people be quick to point out the issue wasn't coaching. Someone replied no, lol. I guess it is true.

Sean is the issue, repeat after me, Sean can no longer win and has lost the team.

burningmetal · 09-19-2017, 05:48 AM

Originally Posted by spkb25

I have no idea what Benson will do, but he definitely is or appears not to be in the frame of mind to do what needs doing. I am holding out for a 3 win season if we are going to miss the playoffs again. At least maybe we finally fire SP.

That said, please stop with the fire DA threads. Jesus H Christ...how many people have to be laid out to the alter for SP? We just remade our entire defensive coaching unit to which 90% or more on this board swore was the answer. It does not appear to have been the coaching...so who is left to fire? Who is the main culprit, the common link, the least common denom?

BTW- I remember asking, when people were gushing about the new coaches, if we failed again would people be quick to point out the issue wasn't coaching. Someone replied no, lol. I guess it is true.

Sean is the issue, repeat after me, Sean can no longer win and has lost the team.

It was and is coaching. Some talent issues here and there, but mostly coaching. I liked the hiring of Mike Nolan, and liked bringing back Curtis Johnson. I don't know anything about the defensive line coach they brought in, so that one didn't move me one way or the other.

But I have never been an advocate of Dennis Allen as DC. I don't see anything schematically that is overwhelming, and I surely don't see any discipline. The discipline problem is team wide, which means the head coach isn't getting his message across. Why, I don't know... there clearly seems to be a disconnect, but who knows how that came to be. I have a bunch of theories, but there's no point in getting into that.

Offensively, we have gotten behind the times. It goes to show how quickly things can change in the NFL. Payton thinks he can do the same things he did a few years ago, but people adjust eventually. Great coaches adapt to changing times. Coaches with fancy schemes and no backup plan tend to fade out just like any other trendy thing in life. Remember "the greatest show on turf"? Those Rams offenses were like man landing on Mars; it was so advanced, and it just seemed like no one would ever stop that team. And yet, it was over relatively quickly, and Mike Martz moved on to a couple of different places, but his offense never succeeded again.

This seems to be the track Sean Payton is on. I don't know if he has a second wind in him, but right now it looks like he isn't the type of coach who is ever going to adapt to the ever changing league. I hope I'm wrong for his sake and ours, but if I happen to be right, I would rather this not drag on longer than it needs to.

09-19-2017, 12:03 PM	#1
RaginCajun83 Hou Saints Fan Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Houston, Tx Posts: 5,050	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II Don't cut bait. We've got new leadership throughout this team. Our new additions have all been beneficial. Whether they are coaches, players or front office. It's a new team that needs time to become a collective unit. I believe that Payton needs to be reigned in and let Loomis be an accountant and have a real football GM. They hired Ireland to be the talent evaluator role of GM

09-19-2017, 12:35 PM	#2
73Saint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: NOLA Posts: 2,336	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Originally Posted by RaginCajun83 They hired Ireland to be the talent evaluator role of GM Not to derail the thread, but you just indirectly pointed out our biggest problem. What we need is a COACHING talent evaluator. Where can we get one of them?

09-19-2017, 12:54 PM	#3
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,840 Blog Entries: 3	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Originally Posted by 73Saint Not to derail the thread, but you just indirectly pointed out our biggest problem. What we need is a COACHING talent evaluator. Where can we get one of them? Omar Khan. He's a smart guy (Tulane educated), home grown and has a solid track record.

09-19-2017, 01:27 PM	#4
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Originally Posted by K Major Omar Khan. He's a smart guy (Tulane educated), home grown and has a solid track record. Meh, those were some awful drafts under Mike Ditka and Jim Haslett; and I'm not so sure Omar hasn't benefited from the scenery more than his own making... We do some tweaking with reducing Payton's GM authority, make Jeff Ireland the GM, hell, bring Parcells in as Team President if that's what it takes...

09-22-2017, 02:31 PM	#5
WillSaints81 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 4,285	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II Don't cut bait. We've got new leadership throughout this team. Our new additions have all been beneficial. Whether they are coaches, players or front office. It's a new team that needs time to become a collective unit. I believe that Payton needs to be reigned in and let Loomis be an accountant and have a real football GM. No GM wants to feel like he has less power than a HC.

09-18-2017, 02:18 PM	#6
Mardigras9 Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Land Mass between LA and AL Posts: 4,375	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Loomis and his philosophy has been a question for years. It's not that we are 0-2, that was really expected looking at the schedule, it is the ugliness of the losses. The next 2 will tell the tale of the future. We are not the only team trying to get it together out of the gates.

09-18-2017, 09:06 PM	#7
NOLA54 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 1,708 Blog Entries: 1	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Yep

09-18-2017, 09:48 PM	#8
saintshrimp 500th Post Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Houma,LA. Posts: 695	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees The sean payton era is pretty much over it was great for a while but all good things come to a end at somepoint the thing is to recognize it when it does. Im pretty sure i seen it for a couple years now

09-19-2017, 05:13 AM	#9
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,145	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees I have no idea what Benson will do, but he definitely is or appears not to be in the frame of mind to do what needs doing. I am holding out for a 3 win season if we are going to miss the playoffs again. At least maybe we finally fire SP. That said, please stop with the fire DA threads. Jesus H Christ...how many people have to be laid out to the alter for SP? We just remade our entire defensive coaching unit to which 90% or more on this board swore was the answer. It does not appear to have been the coaching...so who is left to fire? Who is the main culprit, the common link, the least common denom? BTW- I remember asking, when people were gushing about the new coaches, if we failed again would people be quick to point out the issue wasn't coaching. Someone replied no, lol. I guess it is true. Sean is the issue, repeat after me, Sean can no longer win and has lost the team. neugey, Kryptonite and WhoDatLucky like this.
	Your team stinks

09-19-2017, 05:48 AM	#10
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: It's time for the Saints to move on from Sean Payton and Drew Brees Originally Posted by spkb25 I have no idea what Benson will do, but he definitely is or appears not to be in the frame of mind to do what needs doing. I am holding out for a 3 win season if we are going to miss the playoffs again. At least maybe we finally fire SP. That said, please stop with the fire DA threads. Jesus H Christ...how many people have to be laid out to the alter for SP? We just remade our entire defensive coaching unit to which 90% or more on this board swore was the answer. It does not appear to have been the coaching...so who is left to fire? Who is the main culprit, the common link, the least common denom? BTW- I remember asking, when people were gushing about the new coaches, if we failed again would people be quick to point out the issue wasn't coaching. Someone replied no, lol. I guess it is true. Sean is the issue, repeat after me, Sean can no longer win and has lost the team. It was and is coaching. Some talent issues here and there, but mostly coaching. I liked the hiring of Mike Nolan, and liked bringing back Curtis Johnson. I don't know anything about the defensive line coach they brought in, so that one didn't move me one way or the other. But I have never been an advocate of Dennis Allen as DC. I don't see anything schematically that is overwhelming, and I surely don't see any discipline. The discipline problem is team wide, which means the head coach isn't getting his message across. Why, I don't know... there clearly seems to be a disconnect, but who knows how that came to be. I have a bunch of theories, but there's no point in getting into that. Offensively, we have gotten behind the times. It goes to show how quickly things can change in the NFL. Payton thinks he can do the same things he did a few years ago, but people adjust eventually. Great coaches adapt to changing times. Coaches with fancy schemes and no backup plan tend to fade out just like any other trendy thing in life. Remember "the greatest show on turf"? Those Rams offenses were like man landing on Mars; it was so advanced, and it just seemed like no one would ever stop that team. And yet, it was over relatively quickly, and Mike Martz moved on to a couple of different places, but his offense never succeeded again. This seems to be the track Sean Payton is on. I don't know if he has a second wind in him, but right now it looks like he isn't the type of coach who is ever going to adapt to the ever changing league. I hope I'm wrong for his sake and ours, but if I happen to be right, I would rather this not drag on longer than it needs to. spkb25, neugey and Kryptonite like this.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

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