Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected

09-01-2018, 11:18 PM

jeanpierre · 09-01-2018, 11:21 PM

BY NICK UNDERHILL | NUNDERHILL@THEADVOCATE.COM SEP 1, 2018 - 6:31 PM

It can be a good sign when a team cuts good players and doesn’t have room for all of its draft picks.

Sometimes those moves create some shock. Running back Jonathan Williams getting released by the Saints on Saturday was a legitimate “whoa” moment, but more so because of what New Orleans doesn't have at the position than the talent lost in the transaction. And seeing fourth-round tackle Rick Leonard, fifth-round cornerback Natrell Jamerson and sixth-round safety Kamrin Moore let go was a bit of a surprise, just because people are conditioned to expect draft picks to make the team.

Now, it isn't all good when rookies get cut. Having a fourth-round pick fail to make the roster isn’t the best outcome. Leonard, a converted defensive end with minimal experience on the other side of the ball, was billed as a project, and while he demonstrated the physical ability to play the position, he struggled with motivation and applying coaching points.

This isn’t necessarily the end for him. He could clear waivers and continue to develop on the practice squad, but it says something that the team is willing to risk losing him.

As far as anyone else who didn’t make the team, it’s not a big deal. The headlines will read “three draft picks fail to make the roster.” But put it in context. These moves are about the strength of the roster more than the players selected.

Look at the profile of the players selected during the final day of the draft. Jamerson, Moore and running back Boston Scott all had something in common: They could perform on special teams. That tells you right away these guys needed to do more than one thing to crack the roster. If not, see ya. That’s how undrafted safety J.T. Gray ended up making the team over Moore and Jamerson (at least for now).

Moore and Jamerson looked promising at times. Moore made some plays on special teams once he returned from a hamstring injury, and secondary coach Aaron Glenn talked up Jamerson’s play at cornerback earlier in the camp.

Now, think back to two years ago when Sterling Moore and B.W. Webb started games at cornerback. The fact that a position coach wasn’t able to keep a player he thought was playing well is a testament to the strength of this roster.

The Williams cut was the most surprising move of the day. It felt like he gained momentum at the position early in the preseason and maintained it coming into this week. He rushed 31 times for 124 yards with a pair of touchdowns, averaging a respectable 4 yards per carry. But the team must prefer Scott, who averaged 4.8 yards per carry, even though he was often playing lower in the order behind a lesser offensive line.

Scott also has the added benefit of being a better receiving back and can help out in the return game.

It wouldn’t be a surprise if New Orleans looks outside of the building for additional help — coach Sean Payton has alluded to the possibility several times — and running back could be one of the spots the Saints addresses. If not, it looks like Alvin Kamara and Scott will carry the load at running back, with fullbacks Trey Edmunds and Zach Line helping out where they can until Mark Ingram returns from a four-game suspension.

But certainly, the absence of those three rookies on the initial roster does not indicate that something has gone awry with the drafting process.

New Orleans just had what might end up being one of the best draft classes in history a year ago, and another very solid draft before that. This class should be judged by what defensive end Marcus Davenport, wide receiver Tre’Quan Smith, Scott and offensive lineman Will Clapp do. Maybe even some of the other three end up on the practice squad and climb back on the roster in due time.

Say what you want about the missed risk on Leonard, but overall, these cuts are another sign of success. Carrying late-round picks because there is no one around to beat them out every year is when things are going wrong.

SmashMouth · 09-01-2018, 11:35 PM

Some of those will be PS candidates...

The Dude · 09-02-2018, 12:51 AM

Originally Posted by SmashMouth

Some of those will be PS candidates...

But if the cuts were more about the strength of our roster and the talent they were up against and less about their ability wouldn’t you think they would be picked up by someone else?

MarchingOn · 09-02-2018, 04:56 PM

BS. These cuts show this DRAFT (outside of perhaps the 1st and 3rd pick) was a disaster.

Hope whoever ran/approved it catches hell like after the 2014 draft disaster (don't think we have anyone still left on the roster from '14).

We passed on these players in order to take and cut our picks:

- 4th: DT and former top 10 player Maurice Hurst.

- 5th DE Fitts, CB Nicherson, QBs White and Falk

- 5th and 6th: WR St. Brown, OT Senat

Bad draft unless we hit on our 1st. Pathethic.

And, speaking of pathethic (our defense agains the run), I still wish we'd taken NT Phillips over our good WR in the 3rd. Someone should be removed from draft-making decisions.

dizzle88 · 09-02-2018, 05:15 PM

This draft smells of Sean Payton, moving up, taking players that are projects.

This certainly does not feel like a Jeff Ireland draft that have been so successful the past 2 years.

ScottF · 09-02-2018, 05:31 PM

At least we got a 7th back for Lawrence.
Gotta love the Browns

frydaddy · 09-02-2018, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by ScottF

At least we got a 7th back for Lawrence.
Gotta love the Browns

Lol That surprised the hell out of me, until I saw it was the browns. I thought there's no way someone would give up a pick for an unproven and formerly undrafted player. But then there's the browns. God bless em.

The Dude · 09-02-2018, 11:34 PM

Originally Posted by MarchingOn

BS. These cuts show this DRAFT (outside of perhaps the 1st and 3rd pick) was a disaster.

Hope whoever ran/approved it catches hell like after the 2014 draft disaster (don't think we have anyone still left on the roster from '14).

We passed on these players in order to take and cut our picks:

- 4th: DT and former top 10 player Maurice Hurst.

- 5th DE Fitts, CB Nicherson, QBs White and Falk

- 5th and 6th: WR St. Brown, OT Senat

Bad draft unless we hit on our 1st. Pathethic.

And, speaking of pathethic (our defense agains the run), I still wish we'd taken NT Phillips over our good WR in the 3rd. Someone should be removed from draft-making decisions.

The article is nothing more than the media trying to sell us on the idea that it wasn’t a bad draft class. The Saints are a product and sports media is nothing more than an industry specific commercial. Winning alone will sell season tickets and merch for now, but they have to keep the ticket sales coming in when a team is 2-14.
Perfect example is how Bobby and Kristain flip flopped from calling Bridgewater a bust to comparing him to Russel Wilson and loving the idea the very next day.

I seriously put more stock in some of the crap that Guido posts than I do in anything put out by the sports media.
Davenport is going to be worth the price and I have a feeling he will contribute more to stopping the run than most people think

Cruize · 09-03-2018, 05:59 AM

Maulet and Hardee simply outplayed Jamerson. Moore was a long shot and a wasted pick. Davenport is legit. Smith is legit. Scott is legit. Clapp outplayed some veterans and must be legit. Leonard was a project and hopefully will make the 53 next year. Solid draft.

09-01-2018, 11:18 PM	#1
Threaded by jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39 Rating: (0 votes - average) Twitter
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09-01-2018, 11:21 PM	#2
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected BY NICK UNDERHILL \| NUNDERHILL@THEADVOCATE.COM SEP 1, 2018 - 6:31 PM It can be a good sign when a team cuts good players and doesn’t have room for all of its draft picks. Sometimes those moves create some shock. Running back Jonathan Williams getting released by the Saints on Saturday was a legitimate “whoa” moment, but more so because of what New Orleans doesn't have at the position than the talent lost in the transaction. And seeing fourth-round tackle Rick Leonard, fifth-round cornerback Natrell Jamerson and sixth-round safety Kamrin Moore let go was a bit of a surprise, just because people are conditioned to expect draft picks to make the team. Now, it isn't all good when rookies get cut. Having a fourth-round pick fail to make the roster isn’t the best outcome. Leonard, a converted defensive end with minimal experience on the other side of the ball, was billed as a project, and while he demonstrated the physical ability to play the position, he struggled with motivation and applying coaching points. This isn’t necessarily the end for him. He could clear waivers and continue to develop on the practice squad, but it says something that the team is willing to risk losing him. As far as anyone else who didn’t make the team, it’s not a big deal. The headlines will read “three draft picks fail to make the roster.” But put it in context. These moves are about the strength of the roster more than the players selected. Look at the profile of the players selected during the final day of the draft. Jamerson, Moore and running back Boston Scott all had something in common: They could perform on special teams. That tells you right away these guys needed to do more than one thing to crack the roster. If not, see ya. That’s how undrafted safety J.T. Gray ended up making the team over Moore and Jamerson (at least for now). Moore and Jamerson looked promising at times. Moore made some plays on special teams once he returned from a hamstring injury, and secondary coach Aaron Glenn talked up Jamerson’s play at cornerback earlier in the camp. Now, think back to two years ago when Sterling Moore and B.W. Webb started games at cornerback. The fact that a position coach wasn’t able to keep a player he thought was playing well is a testament to the strength of this roster. The Williams cut was the most surprising move of the day. It felt like he gained momentum at the position early in the preseason and maintained it coming into this week. He rushed 31 times for 124 yards with a pair of touchdowns, averaging a respectable 4 yards per carry. But the team must prefer Scott, who averaged 4.8 yards per carry, even though he was often playing lower in the order behind a lesser offensive line. Scott also has the added benefit of being a better receiving back and can help out in the return game. It wouldn’t be a surprise if New Orleans looks outside of the building for additional help — coach Sean Payton has alluded to the possibility several times — and running back could be one of the spots the Saints addresses. If not, it looks like Alvin Kamara and Scott will carry the load at running back, with fullbacks Trey Edmunds and Zach Line helping out where they can until Mark Ingram returns from a four-game suspension. But certainly, the absence of those three rookies on the initial roster does not indicate that something has gone awry with the drafting process. New Orleans just had what might end up being one of the best draft classes in history a year ago, and another very solid draft before that. This class should be judged by what defensive end Marcus Davenport, wide receiver Tre’Quan Smith, Scott and offensive lineman Will Clapp do. Maybe even some of the other three end up on the practice squad and climb back on the roster in due time. Say what you want about the missed risk on Leonard, but overall, these cuts are another sign of success. Carrying late-round picks because there is no one around to beat them out every year is when things are going wrong. SmashMouth and Audiotom like this.
	It's not that my way is the right way, I just make the right way my way...

09-01-2018, 11:35 PM	#3
SmashMouth I donated, did you? Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Mandeville, LA Posts: 38,125 Blog Entries: 29	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected Some of those will be PS candidates...

09-02-2018, 12:51 AM	#4
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected Originally Posted by SmashMouth Some of those will be PS candidates... But if the cuts were more about the strength of our roster and the talent they were up against and less about their ability wouldn’t you think they would be picked up by someone else?
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048

09-02-2018, 04:56 PM	#5
MarchingOn 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 387 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected BS. These cuts show this DRAFT (outside of perhaps the 1st and 3rd pick) was a disaster. Hope whoever ran/approved it catches hell like after the 2014 draft disaster (don't think we have anyone still left on the roster from '14). We passed on these players in order to take and cut our picks: - 4th: DT and former top 10 player Maurice Hurst. - 5th DE Fitts, CB Nicherson, QBs White and Falk - 5th and 6th: WR St. Brown, OT Senat Bad draft unless we hit on our 1st. Pathethic. And, speaking of pathethic (our defense agains the run), I still wish we'd taken NT Phillips over our good WR in the 3rd. Someone should be removed from draft-making decisions.

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09-02-2018, 05:15 PM	#6
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,208	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected This draft smells of Sean Payton, moving up, taking players that are projects. This certainly does not feel like a Jeff Ireland draft that have been so successful the past 2 years.

09-02-2018, 05:31 PM	#7
ScottF 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 6,324	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected At least we got a 7th back for Lawrence. Gotta love the Browns

09-02-2018, 05:42 PM	#8
frydaddy 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Lafayette Posts: 1,950 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected Originally Posted by ScottF At least we got a 7th back for Lawrence. Gotta love the Browns Lol That surprised the hell out of me, until I saw it was the browns. I thought there's no way someone would give up a pick for an unproven and formerly undrafted player. But then there's the browns. God bless em.

09-02-2018, 11:34 PM	#9
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected Originally Posted by MarchingOn BS. These cuts show this DRAFT (outside of perhaps the 1st and 3rd pick) was a disaster. Hope whoever ran/approved it catches hell like after the 2014 draft disaster (don't think we have anyone still left on the roster from '14). We passed on these players in order to take and cut our picks: - 4th: DT and former top 10 player Maurice Hurst. - 5th DE Fitts, CB Nicherson, QBs White and Falk - 5th and 6th: WR St. Brown, OT Senat Bad draft unless we hit on our 1st. Pathethic. And, speaking of pathethic (our defense agains the run), I still wish we'd taken NT Phillips over our good WR in the 3rd. Someone should be removed from draft-making decisions. The article is nothing more than the media trying to sell us on the idea that it wasn’t a bad draft class. The Saints are a product and sports media is nothing more than an industry specific commercial. Winning alone will sell season tickets and merch for now, but they have to keep the ticket sales coming in when a team is 2-14. Perfect example is how Bobby and Kristain flip flopped from calling Bridgewater a bust to comparing him to Russel Wilson and loving the idea the very next day. I seriously put more stock in some of the crap that Guido posts than I do in anything put out by the sports media. Davenport is going to be worth the price and I have a feeling he will contribute more to stopping the run than most people think
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048	"Where life had no value, death, sometimes, had its price. That is why the bounty killers appeared."

09-03-2018, 05:59 AM	#10
Cruize 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,457	Re: Analysis: Saints’ cuts more about strength of roster than players selected Maulet and Hardee simply outplayed Jamerson. Moore was a long shot and a wasted pick. Davenport is legit. Smith is legit. Scott is legit. Clapp outplayed some veterans and must be legit. Leonard was a project and hopefully will make the 53 next year. Solid draft.
Cruize 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,457

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