Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878618)

No need to brace. We won't have postseason disappointment because we won't be going to the playoffs. Some need to brace themselves for that very real possibility.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878621)

Predictable response. If Drew is playing, he's carrying the team. If he's not playing, and the team is winning, the defense is carrying the team.

With all due respect, the correct answer is the TEAM wins games. When Drew was still in his prime, but the defense was bad, the team went 7-9 a bunch of times, and 8-8 once. If you're going to win, you need to have a good team. That should be plainly obvious to any reasonable observer.

Did the defense carry the Saints against the Bucs the first time? No. Did they carry the team against Chicago? No. Seattle? No. In all of those games there was a combination of offense, defense and special teams. When Drew came back, did they score more points? If they did, it was negligible. Did they have a better winning percentage? No. The offense needed a couple of weeks to find it's bearings after Drew went down, and once it did, it was on a roll. They found a new identity. One very similar to what the Titans used to go from 2-4, to one game short of the Super Bowl.

I'd say the Saints definitely have more talent than Tennessee, and if they could figure it out with Tannehill, I think the Saints can do better. When Drew came back, the team went back to playing unbalanced offense, and a lack of consistent ball control.

Be careful what I wish for? What is it you believe I'm wishing for? Drew is declining. I should want to stay on a sinking ship, shoveling water out by hand, while the ocean swallows it up? No. This team has talent. It can win with decent QB play, but it's not likely to get over the top. Start developing someone now, rather than flaming out with an aging QB, with no plan for the future.

Originally Posted by st thomas (Post 878623)

I’m accepting that AG we have to feel this thing out with or not with the master


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Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878627)

A diminishing Brees is still heads and shoulders better than the next closest option. Until he clearly isn't I want him out there giving us our best chance.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878621)

Predictable response. If Drew is playing, he's carrying the team. If he's not playing, and the team is winning, the defense is carrying the team.

With all due respect, the correct answer is the TEAM wins games. When Drew was still in his prime, but the defense was bad, the team went 7-9 a bunch of times, and 8-8 once. If you're going to win, you need to have a good team. That should be plainly obvious to any reasonable observer.

Did the defense carry the Saints against the Bucs the first time? No. Did they carry the team against Chicago? No. Seattle? No. In all of those games there was a combination of offense, defense and special teams. When Drew came back, did they score more points? If they did, it was negligible. Did they have a better winning percentage? No. The offense needed a couple of weeks to find it's bearings after Drew went down, and once it did, it was on a roll. They found a new identity. One very similar to what the Titans used to go from 2-4, to one game short of the Super Bowl.

I'd say the Saints definitely have more talent than Tennessee, and if they could figure it out with Tannehill, I think the Saints can do better. When Drew came back, the team went back to playing unbalanced offense, and a lack of consistent ball control.

Be careful what I wish for? What is it you believe I'm wishing for? Drew is declining. I should want to stay on a sinking ship, shoveling water out by hand, while the ocean swallows it up? No. This team has talent. It can win with decent QB play, but it's not likely to get over the top. Start developing someone now, rather than flaming out with an aging QB, with no plan for the future.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878624)

As long as that aging QB is better than the alternative I want him out there. It is your prerogative to feel differently. I just don't want to hear your *****ing about QB play post Brees.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878633)

The aging QB did not prove, this year, to be better than the alternative who immediately stepped into his place.

You don't want to hear my "*****ing" about QB play post Brees? You already don't want to hear any dissenting opinion about QB play, present Brees. Plain and simple, you just don't want to accept reality regarding Brees. And that is YOUR prerogative. But you don't have any facts to support your assertions.

Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 878631)

No doubt about the decline. There has been quite a few times he should have rolled out to extend plays and instead watched the pocket collapse in his face.
Really never had to much to run all that much to be honest, he's had the benefit of good to great O-line play since he's been here. I agree when he's behind C that we get away from a balanced O.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878636)

Are you serious? Did you see the stat comparisons between Brees and Bridgewater this season. Teddy didn't play near as efficiently as Brees. He was the recipient of the defense at its healthiest playing out their asses. Brees outplayed Bridgewater in virtually every category. I gave you those facts.

Reposted here:

In 2019 Brees averaged more yards per attempt (7.9 to 7.1), more yards per completion (10.6 to 10.4), double the touchdowns per attempt (7.1 to 4.6), better completion percentage (74.3 to 67.9), far higher QB rate (116.3 to 99.1), much higher QBR (74.2 to 45.0), and much lower sack percent (3.1% to 5.8%) than Bridgewater. And these are just a few of the stats where Brees clearly outperformed Teddy.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878637)

After Brees returned to the staring lineup we lost FOUR of our eleven defensive starters. That's over 36% of our starting defensive lineup. Kiko Alonzo, Anzalone, Rankins and Davenport. That wasn't on Brees.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878639)

And I suppose you're going to conveniently ignore what I said about the offense needing a couple weeks to find it's bearings after Drew went down?

Sean wouldn't even allow Teddy to attempt anything beyond 15 yards. He was scared to let him play, because he hadn't started a meaningful game in three years. Once the training wheels started to come off, the offense was efficient, and so was he. Was he a star? No. I'm not in favor of him as the heir apparent, as I think his ceiling is limited, but his floor is good enough that we don't really take a step back from Drew, at THIS stage of his career.

That's why I'd look to draft a QB now, and let him sit behind Brees for what will likely be his last year.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878640)

Anzalone was already done by week two. Did the injuries on defense effect the Saints offense against the Falcons? Did it effect them against the Vikings?

No one's saying Drew lost those games by himself. The point is that he didn't elevate the play of the team upon his return. The offense, as a whole, was not more efficient.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878641)

And what were those three games after the "training wheels" came off? Tampa Bay, Jacksonville and Chicago. Three subpar teams. Woohoo!

Bridgewater is definitely a step back from Brees at this point in both of their careers. If you couldn't see that from their play on the field you weren't watching closely.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878644)

Jacksonville and Chicago had solid defenses. And Bridgewater improved dramatically over a very short period of time. But hey, at least we had Brees doing nothing against those Vikings when we needed him the most. All hail Brees.

I did watch closely. It's how I noticed the difference in Bridgewater's play when he was finally allowed some freedom. It's how I noticed that a funny thing happened when the team played well AS a team. They won. Imagine that!

This team hasn't sniffed a Super Bowl since 2009, but every year, without fail, you insist Brees is the way back. It takes more than one man, and that one man has not been exceptional when his team has needed him most, in recent years.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878642)

The fact that half the offensive line, as well as others, were struggling with effects from the flu versus the Falcons affected the offensive outcome more than anything. Or did you completely forget about that fact? Brees was sacked five times in less than four seconds in that game.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878650)

Armstead had the flu. not the entire offensive line. The Falcons defense was atrocious. The Saints came into that game thinking they would just air it out all game, and it would be easy. But the Falcons decided to come after Brees with everything they had, and Payton made no adjustment.

That was not the style of play that led the team to success in Brees' absence. You're hung up on defending Brees, and neglecting to remember that it's that my point from to beginning of this conversation was how well the formula was working on offense when Brees was out. Bridgewater and Brees can both be game managers and win games. But with Brees, Payton thinks he can still go all air-raid. But that doesn't work well anymore. He can't get the ball out there. And he isn't going to get any better.

Those are the facts. You can either sit and wait till his arm falls off, are you can do something about the future now, while Drew is still capable of keeping the team reasonably afloat.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878648)

Bridgewater was LESS than exceptional. Who do you propose would be more than "exeptional" post Brees? I know. ANYONE but Brees. That is obvious.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878644)

This team hasn't sniffed a Super Bowl since 2009, but every year, without fail, you insist Brees is the way back. It takes more than one man, and that one man has not been exceptional when his team has needed him most, in recent years.

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 878654)

Did I say Teddy was exceptional? Did I not say I was NOT in favor of him as the heir apparent? The point was that the team did not suffer with him in there, over Brees. Not once Payton let him play.

Who will be more exceptional than Brees, right now? Gee, I don't know Guido, let's go shake a magic 8-ball and maybe we'll find the answer. The Saints will have to figure it out. Because what they have now, is NOT exceptional, anymore. You don't make a change because the future is guaranteed to be successful. You make changes because when something, or someone is deteriorating, it IS a guarantee that you will fail if you do nothing about it.

Originally Posted by K Major (Post 878655)

That's just it Burn. TEAM.

I'm rolling with the New Orleans Saints and not the New Orleans Brees.

Believe or not, there will be life after Drew. He's 41.

For me it's getting kind of stale having to worry how much time he has left with us, and at this point I'll be ok with whatever he decides to do this season. When the quarterback position is cheap (Ravens/Texas/Chiefs), you can throw money around to other needed skill positions on both sides of the ball.

It's time for the Saints to "hit" on another QB and I hope we draft one early.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878653)

I'll catch up later. Need to prepare dinner.

Originally Posted by K Major (Post 878655)

That's just it Burn. TEAM.

I'm rolling with the New Orleans Saints and not the New Orleans Brees.

Believe or not, there will be life after Drew. He's 41.

For me it's getting kind of stale having to worry how much time he has left with us, and at this point I'll be ok with whatever he decides to do this season. When the quarterback position is cheap (Ravens/Texas/Chiefs), you can throw money around to other needed skill positions on both sides of the ball.

It's time for the Saints to "hit" on another QB and I hope we draft one early.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878652)

Armstead had the worst case. Others across the team were recovering and suffering as well. And Bridgewater is not an answer. Payton KNOWS he can't go air raid with him at all. Same with Hill. Six for thirteen passing in his career. Wow!!

And the winning formula was NOT the offense when Brees was out. It was the defense playing out of their asses.

Originally Posted by st thomas (Post 878660)

I mean that’s funny AG clock in later please lol


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Originally Posted by Lord_Saint83 (Post 878661)

I agree, drew will be done soon and some want to wait after he leaves to draft a qb its too late by then. We gotta play the long game. Imma Saints fan above anything or one else. I just hope drew would not pull a brett favre and not help coach the guy. That said we got a real good leader in demario that i feel with all my heart can be the leader that drew is.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 878667)

After almost 32 years of marriage I have cooked almost every single meal ... minus a few when I was recovering from the cancer surgery which I kicked its ass.

Originally Posted by K Major (Post 878655)

That's just it Burn. TEAM.

I'm rolling with the New Orleans Saints and not the New Orleans Brees.

Believe or not, there will be life after Drew. He's 41.

For me it's getting kind of stale having to worry how much time he has left with us, and at this point I'll be ok with whatever he decides to do this season. When the quarterback position is cheap (Ravens/Texas/Chiefs), you can throw money around to other needed skill positions on both sides of the ball.

It's time for the Saints to "hit" on another QB and I hope we draft one early.