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Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

this is a discussion within the Everything Else Community Forum; Many motorists don't know it, but it's likely that every time they get behind the wheel, there's a snitch along for the ride. This week ended the public comment period on a proposed law that would put so-called black boxes ...

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Old 02-19-2013, 06:34 PM   #1
 
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Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

Many motorists don't know it, but it's likely that every time they get behind the wheel, there's a snitch along for the ride.

This week ended the public comment period on a proposed law that would put so-called black boxes in every new car sold by September 1, 2014. The thing is, most cars already have them unbeknownst to many drivers.



Automakers have been quietly tucking the devices, which automatically record the actions of drivers and the responses of their vehicles in a continuous information loop, into most new cars for years.

When a car is involved in a crash or when its airbags deploy, inputs from the vehicle's sensors during the 5 to 10 seconds before impact are automatically preserved. That's usually enough to record things like how fast the car was traveling and whether the driver applied the brake, was steering erratically or had a seat belt on. This data has been used recently, for example, to determine what was happening in cars before accidents when some Toyota owners were claiming their cars were accelerating out of control as they were driving.

The idea behind mandating black box data recorders is to gather information that can help investigators determine the causes of accidents and lead to safer vehicles. But privacy advocates say government regulators and automakers are spreading an intrusive technology without first putting in place policies to prevent misuse of the information collected.

Data collected by the recorders is increasingly showing up in lawsuits, criminal cases and high-profile accidents. Massachusetts Lt. Gov. Timothy Murray initially said that he wasn't speeding and that he was wearing his seat belt when he crashed a government-owned car last year. But the Ford Crown Victoria's data recorder told a different story: It showed the car was traveling more than 100 mph and Murray wasn't belted in.

In 2007, then-New Jersey Gov. Jon Corzine was seriously injured in the crash of an SUV driven by a state trooper. Corzine was a passenger. The SUV's recorder showed the vehicle was traveling 91 mph on a parkway where the speed limit was 65 mph, and Corzine didn't have his seat belt on.

In this way, the black boxes can nail liars trying to blame their cars for bad driving.

There's no opt-out. It's extremely difficult for car owners to disable the recorders. Although some vehicle models have had recorders since the early 1990s, a federal requirement that automakers disclose their existence in owner's manuals didn't go into effect until three months ago. Automakers that voluntarily put recorders in vehicles are also now required to gather a minimum of 15 types of data.

Besides the upcoming proposal to put recorders in all new vehicles, the traffic safety administration is also considering expanding the data requirement to include as many as 30 additional types of data such as whether the vehicle's electronic stability control was engaged, the driver's seat position or whether the front-seat passenger was belted in. Some manufacturers already are collecting the information. Engineers have identified more than 80 data points that might be useful.

Privacy complaints have gone unheeded so far. The traffic safety administration says it doesn't have the authority to impose limits on how the information can be used and other privacy protections. About a dozen states have some law regarding data recorders, but the rest do not.

"Right now we're in an environment where there are no rules, there are no limits, there are no consequences and there is no transparency," said Lillie Coney, associate director of the Electronic Privacy Information Center, a privacy advocacy group. "Most people who are operating a motor vehicle have no idea this technology is integrated into their vehicle."

Part of the concern is that the increasing computerization of cars and the growing communications to and from vehicles like GPS navigation and General Motors' OnStar system could lead to unintended uses of recorder data.

"Basically your car is a computer now, so it can record all kinds of information," said Gloria Bergquist, vice president of the Alliance of Automotive Manufacturers. "It's a lot of the same issues you have about your computer or your smartphone and whether Google or someone else has access to the data."

The alliance opposes the government requiring recorders in all vehicles.

Data recorders "help our engineers understand how cars perform in the real world, and we already have put them on over 90 percent of (new) vehicles without any mandate being necessary," Bergquist said.

The National Transportation Safety Board has been pushing for recorders in all passenger vehicles since the board's investigation of a 2003 accident in which an elderly driver plowed through an open-air market in Santa Monica, Calif. Ten people were killed and 63 were injured. The driver refused to be interviewed and his 1992 Buick LeSabre didn't have a recorder. After ruling out other possibilities, investigators ultimately guessed that he had either mistakenly stepped on the gas pedal or had stepped on the gas and the brake pedals at the same time.

Some automakers began installing the recorders at a time when there were complaints that air bags might be causing deaths and injuries, partly to protect themselves against liability and partly to improve air bag technology. Most recorders are black boxes about the size of a deck of cards with circuit boards inside. After an accident, information is downloaded to a laptop computer using a tool unique to the vehicle's manufacturer. As electronics in cars have increased, the kinds of data that can be recorded have grown as well. Some more recent recorders are part of the vehicle's computers rather than a separate device.

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Old 02-20-2013, 10:45 AM   #2
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Re: Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

Right now we're in an environment where there are no rules, there are no limits, there are no consequences and there is no transparency,
And this is why you don't do it - at least not yet. I can certainly see the value in this, but I sure don't like the mandate. If having one potentially lowers the cost of insurance then I'd like to have the OPTION, but it should be my decision when it comes to who the data is shared with.
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Old 02-20-2013, 12:52 PM   #3
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Re: Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

this is more Governement CONTROL over it's people. Nothing else.

I could think of other things to spend moeny on, other than this.
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Old 02-20-2013, 02:14 PM   #4
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Re: Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

I'm saddened that pointing this out as "Big Brother" watching over you has now become passe', or has even gotten to the point of being viewed as whacky conspiracy nut.

Have we now become a nation of useful idiots?
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Old 02-20-2013, 02:19 PM   #5
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Re: Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

Originally Posted by Danno View Post
I'm saddened that pointing this out as "Big Brother" watching over you has now become passe', or has even gotten to the point of being viewed as whacky conspiracy nut.

Have we now become a nation of useful idiots?
I'd say about %51 and counting...
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Old 02-20-2013, 11:32 PM   #6
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Re: Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

Originally Posted by Danno View Post
I'm saddened that pointing this out as "Big Brother" watching over you has now become passe', or has even gotten to the point of being viewed as whacky conspiracy nut.

Have we now become a nation of useful idiots?
Yes we have.
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Old 02-21-2013, 05:44 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Danno View Post
I'm saddened that pointing this out as "Big Brother" watching over you has now become passe', or has even gotten to the point of being viewed as whacky conspiracy nut.

Have we now become a nation of useful idiots?
Loose translation of "useful" please?
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Old 02-21-2013, 08:33 AM   #8
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Re: Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

Originally Posted by TheOak View Post
Loose translation of "useful" please?
Definition: Useful Idiot is a pejorative term for people perceived as propagandists for a cause whose goals they do not understand, and who are used cynically by the leaders of the cause.
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Old 02-21-2013, 01:48 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Danno View Post
Definition: Useful Idiot is a pejorative term for people perceived as propagandists for a cause whose goals they do not understand, and who are used cynically by the leaders of the cause.
I got that lol. I just don't find them useful.
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Old 02-21-2013, 01:50 PM   #10
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Re: Feds Set To Mandate "Black Box" Data Recorders In Every Car And Truck

Originally Posted by TheOak View Post
I got that lol. I just don't find them useful.
Obviously, they're only useful to the ruling class Democrats in Washington.
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