For the Bag Head Supporters

saintfan · 10-22-2003, 10:31 AM

I only mean they\'re paid well in a tough occupation Whodat. I\'m not cuttin\' any slack and I agree with you 100 % about Johnny Construction Worker etc. I guess what I mean is that people throw the money thing around because the players are paid well. What I\'m trying to say is that, while the money is there for the players, MOST of \'em are trying VERY hard to do a good job. If I were a player makin the minimum or top 5 salary I\'d be one of the guys bustin\' my butt on every down, and the bag heads would piss me off. I also understand the fan who bought season tickets. That\'s a major investment, so I can see why some would display their displeasure that way. I still think it\'s tacky, and tasteless and disrespectful tho.

WhoDat · 10-22-2003, 10:48 AM

Saintfan - agreed.

Billy - do you read these posts? C\'mon hombre. Reread this:

\"For example, after week five the Saints had managed to go just 2-10 in their last twelve (including preseason) under Haslett. (REASON 1) The offense, defense, and special teams were all sputtering. (REASONS 2-4) Players were throwing fits on the sidelines, and making obviously disgruntled comments in the media. (REASON 5 & 6) Haslett kept babbling about not knowing what the problem was. (REASON 7) Former players and managers were coming out and talking about how the organization is Mickey Mouse. (REASON 8) Based on ALL of that information, and their PLAY ON THE FIELD, which was obviously uninspired (BIGGEST REASON), it is not unreasonable to believe that the players had quit on the team, or that hope was essentially lost for this season. \"

I just listed about 10 reasons why a person could come to the conclusion that the team was quitting on Haslett. I was one of them. Those are good reasons, and that belief is EDUCATED based on those events which I personally witnesseds.

\"What\'s educated about it? I watched the games and I saw no evidence of that? Did you?\" Yes, I did. See above.

\"I read what the players were saying and they said just the opposite!!\" No Sh!t huh? You mean the player didn\'t come out and say - \"Yeah, we quit on Jim. We\'re done. Season\'s over - pack it up guys b/c we certainly have.\" Is that what you expected? That\'s pretty ridiculous. Come one Billy. The team has won two in a row, so now you\'re talking about how ridiculous it is that everyone was saying that this team had quit. In a month, if they\'re 3-8, all these comments that you\'re making right now are going to look pretty naive, wouldn\'t you say? Those comments were all well founded and made for good reasons based on observed events. Just b/c you disagree with them now doesn\'t mean that they were unfounded then. Again, do you want me to show you comments you made during that time period?

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-22-2003, 11:08 AM

Yeah Yeah -- I hear ya. But I ain\'t buying any of it !!

With your theory then losing makes saying ANYTHING ok. It was pretty obvious to me that while the play on the field was poor that no one was giving up or quitting. Which players did you see quit WhoDat? Back some of this stuff up? All you\'re doing is trying to come up with some kind of reason to justify making these statements. The National Enquirer could come up with some reasons to why their storys are justified, but I\'ll stick to reading a more credible source !!

BlackandBlue · 10-22-2003, 11:33 AM

Need proof? How about that 55-21 ass whipping we took. There is nothing you can tell me that would convince me that the Colts are that much better than the Saints. And with a score like that, it reeks of a defeated and put-out team.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-22-2003, 11:36 AM

Need proof? How about that 55-21 ass whipping we took. There is nothing you can tell me that would convince me that the Colts are that much better than the Saints. And with a score like that, it reeks of a defeated and put-out team.

Couldn\'t resist huh? How about we had 6 starters out on defense? How about blowouts happen, even to the best of teams. Did you happen to watch what the Colts did to the super bowl champion Bucs? I\'ll ask you the same question. Which player(s) did you see quit?

BlackandBlue · 10-22-2003, 01:13 PM

You really don\'t want me to play this game with you, Billy, you really don\'t. It\'s not like any of the players went on national TV and said, \"Yeah, I quit in the game.\" Too bad in your mind that\'s the only thing that would shut you up. Yeah, blowouts happen in the NFL, and it happens to teams that have given up on that particular game. Yeah, we had half our defense out- so what? Will that be an excuse for Tampa this weekend if they get blown out by the Cowboys? In case you haven\'t noticed, thier defense is pretty banged up too. Not only did they lose Kelly for the season, Lynch, Sapp, and Rice are all banged up as well. Let\'s take a look at some of the more injured teams this year
Philadelphia
Probable
G Jermane Mayberry (elbow); QB Donovan McNabb (leg/thumb); RB Jon Ritchie (hamstring); CB Lito Sheppard (toe); DT Corey Simon (foot/back); CB Troy Vincent (hamstring); G John Welbourn (leg); DE Brandon Whiting (hamstring)
Questionable WR Todd Pinkston (knee); CB Bobby Taylor (foot); RB Brian Westbrook (hip)
Doubtful
DE Jerome McDougle (ankle)
Out
S Brian Dawkins (foot); CB Roderick Hood (hamstring)

Worst loss so far was to New England, 31-10, and the Pats are leading the AFC North. On top of that, every other game they\'ve played was close, except for this one.

Oakland
Probable
S Derrick Gibson (shoulder); LB Eric Johnson (chest)
Questionable
G Mo Collins (knee); S Anthony Dorsett (elbow); RB Ronney Jenkins (ankle); T Lincoln Kennedy (calf); TE O.J. Santiago (hamstring); C Matt Stinchcomb (shoulder); DT Dana Stubblefield (ankle); DE Sam Williams (knee); S Rod Woodson (knee)
Doubtful
G Frank Middleton (quadricep); DT John Parrella (groin); WR Jerry Porter (abdomen); LB Bill Romanowski (concussion)

Worst loss so far was 31-10 against the Broncos, who are 5-2 at the moment. The rest of thier games, they lost by a touchdown or less.

But you\'ll probably ignore all this information, and continue to ask \"who did you see give up?\" If it was that evident during the game, you can be damn sure that I would not have been the only one to see it, and the player in question would have already been lambasted by the media. Plus, I know how easy it is to fall into the temptation of giving up. It is something that hangs on you constantly. Whether or not you give in, describes the type of player you are.

Did you happen to watch what the Colts did to the super bowl champion Bucs?

Is that what you would describe as a team that quit? I don\'t think that the Buccs quit in that game, I think the Colts caught them believing their own hype.

[Edited on 22/10/2003 by BlackandBlue]

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-22-2003, 01:23 PM

You really don\'t want me to play this game with you, Billy, you really don\'t. It\'s not like any of the players went on national TV and said, \"Yeah, I quit in the game.\" Too bad in your mind that\'s the only thing that would shut you up

Yeah, I really do. If you are trying to tell me that when a team get\'s blown out that the reason for that is the players quit, then you\'ll have a better chance to get me to like \"George.\" You can talk about other teams but that\'s not relevant to the Saints. I know you put a lot of effort in looking up that information, but so what !!

Did Carolina quit against the Titans? I think not. I think things happen sometimes and blowouts happen. It sure seems that the Saints came together as a team here lately. Now, does that sound like a team that has given up? NO !! It sounds like a team that got humilated by the Colts and they had the resolve to get better. But, if you want to think that they gave up against the Colts. Then, this is America. Believe what you want to..

BlackandBlue · 10-22-2003, 01:28 PM

I\'m not the one that brought up other teams to begin with- you did! Did I say they gave up on the year, no, they\'ve proven that they haven\'t already. But they did give up in the Colts game. In my opinion, good teams do not get blown out. So, we either have a bad team on our hands, which I don\'t believe, or they gave up in the Colts game. I\'m believe that more than I do a bad team.
Since you really want to play this game, fine, let\'s play. I don\'t think Aaron Brooks is smart enough to be a starting NFL QB. I\'m going to need more proof than, \"Yes he is.\" What proof do you have that he is???

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-22-2003, 01:33 PM

In my opinion, good teams do not get blown out.

Oh, really now. Well, would you say that teams that make it to the Super Bowl are good teams? Yes?? I guess all those team that got blown out in the Super Bowl quit too huh??

Soon as you explain this to me we can continue our debate !!

saintfan · 10-22-2003, 01:35 PM

It should be noted that we\'ve had the toughest schedule in the league thus far base on our opponents records. ...for what it\'s worth...

10-22-2003, 10:31 AM	#11
saintfan Donated Plasma Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 18,556 Blog Entries: 5	For the Bag Head Supporters I only mean they\'re paid well in a tough occupation Whodat. I\'m not cuttin\' any slack and I agree with you 100 % about Johnny Construction Worker etc. I guess what I mean is that people throw the money thing around because the players are paid well. What I\'m trying to say is that, while the money is there for the players, MOST of \'em are trying VERY hard to do a good job. If I were a player makin the minimum or top 5 salary I\'d be one of the guys bustin\' my butt on every down, and the bag heads would piss me off. I also understand the fan who bought season tickets. That\'s a major investment, so I can see why some would display their displeasure that way. I still think it\'s tacky, and tasteless and disrespectful tho.
	C'mon Man...

10-22-2003, 10:48 AM	#12
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	For the Bag Head Supporters Saintfan - agreed. Billy - do you read these posts? C\'mon hombre. Reread this: \"For example, after week five the Saints had managed to go just 2-10 in their last twelve (including preseason) under Haslett. (REASON 1) The offense, defense, and special teams were all sputtering. (REASONS 2-4) Players were throwing fits on the sidelines, and making obviously disgruntled comments in the media. (REASON 5 & 6) Haslett kept babbling about not knowing what the problem was. (REASON 7) Former players and managers were coming out and talking about how the organization is Mickey Mouse. (REASON 8) Based on ALL of that information, and their PLAY ON THE FIELD, which was obviously uninspired (BIGGEST REASON), it is not unreasonable to believe that the players had quit on the team, or that hope was essentially lost for this season. \" I just listed about 10 reasons why a person could come to the conclusion that the team was quitting on Haslett. I was one of them. Those are good reasons, and that belief is EDUCATED based on those events which I personally witnesseds. \"What\'s educated about it? I watched the games and I saw no evidence of that? Did you?\" Yes, I did. See above. \"I read what the players were saying and they said just the opposite!!\" No Sh!t huh? You mean the player didn\'t come out and say - \"Yeah, we quit on Jim. We\'re done. Season\'s over - pack it up guys b/c we certainly have.\" Is that what you expected? That\'s pretty ridiculous. Come one Billy. The team has won two in a row, so now you\'re talking about how ridiculous it is that everyone was saying that this team had quit. In a month, if they\'re 3-8, all these comments that you\'re making right now are going to look pretty naive, wouldn\'t you say? Those comments were all well founded and made for good reasons based on observed events. Just b/c you disagree with them now doesn\'t mean that they were unfounded then. Again, do you want me to show you comments you made during that time period?
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

10-22-2003, 11:08 AM	#13
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	For the Bag Head Supporters Yeah Yeah -- I hear ya. But I ain\'t buying any of it !! With your theory then losing makes saying ANYTHING ok. It was pretty obvious to me that while the play on the field was poor that no one was giving up or quitting. Which players did you see quit WhoDat? Back some of this stuff up? All you\'re doing is trying to come up with some kind of reason to justify making these statements. The National Enquirer could come up with some reasons to why their storys are justified, but I\'ll stick to reading a more credible source !!
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-22-2003, 11:33 AM	#14
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	For the Bag Head Supporters Need proof? How about that 55-21 ass whipping we took. There is nothing you can tell me that would convince me that the Colts are that much better than the Saints. And with a score like that, it reeks of a defeated and put-out team.

10-22-2003, 11:36 AM	#15
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	For the Bag Head Supporters Need proof? How about that 55-21 ass whipping we took. There is nothing you can tell me that would convince me that the Colts are that much better than the Saints. And with a score like that, it reeks of a defeated and put-out team. Couldn\'t resist huh? How about we had 6 starters out on defense? How about blowouts happen, even to the best of teams. Did you happen to watch what the Colts did to the super bowl champion Bucs? I\'ll ask you the same question. Which player(s) did you see quit?
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

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10-22-2003, 01:13 PM	#16
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	For the Bag Head Supporters You really don\'t want me to play this game with you, Billy, you really don\'t. It\'s not like any of the players went on national TV and said, \"Yeah, I quit in the game.\" Too bad in your mind that\'s the only thing that would shut you up. Yeah, blowouts happen in the NFL, and it happens to teams that have given up on that particular game. Yeah, we had half our defense out- so what? Will that be an excuse for Tampa this weekend if they get blown out by the Cowboys? In case you haven\'t noticed, thier defense is pretty banged up too. Not only did they lose Kelly for the season, Lynch, Sapp, and Rice are all banged up as well. Let\'s take a look at some of the more injured teams this year Philadelphia Probable G Jermane Mayberry (elbow); QB Donovan McNabb (leg/thumb); RB Jon Ritchie (hamstring); CB Lito Sheppard (toe); DT Corey Simon (foot/back); CB Troy Vincent (hamstring); G John Welbourn (leg); DE Brandon Whiting (hamstring) Questionable WR Todd Pinkston (knee); CB Bobby Taylor (foot); RB Brian Westbrook (hip) Doubtful DE Jerome McDougle (ankle) Out S Brian Dawkins (foot); CB Roderick Hood (hamstring) Worst loss so far was to New England, 31-10, and the Pats are leading the AFC North. On top of that, every other game they\'ve played was close, except for this one. Oakland Probable S Derrick Gibson (shoulder); LB Eric Johnson (chest) Questionable G Mo Collins (knee); S Anthony Dorsett (elbow); RB Ronney Jenkins (ankle); T Lincoln Kennedy (calf); TE O.J. Santiago (hamstring); C Matt Stinchcomb (shoulder); DT Dana Stubblefield (ankle); DE Sam Williams (knee); S Rod Woodson (knee) Doubtful G Frank Middleton (quadricep); DT John Parrella (groin); WR Jerry Porter (abdomen); LB Bill Romanowski (concussion) Worst loss so far was 31-10 against the Broncos, who are 5-2 at the moment. The rest of thier games, they lost by a touchdown or less. But you\'ll probably ignore all this information, and continue to ask \"who did you see give up?\" If it was that evident during the game, you can be damn sure that I would not have been the only one to see it, and the player in question would have already been lambasted by the media. Plus, I know how easy it is to fall into the temptation of giving up. It is something that hangs on you constantly. Whether or not you give in, describes the type of player you are. Did you happen to watch what the Colts did to the super bowl champion Bucs? Is that what you would describe as a team that quit? I don\'t think that the Buccs quit in that game, I think the Colts caught them believing their own hype. [Edited on 22/10/2003 by BlackandBlue]
	The waiting drove me mad.... I don't want to hear from those that know... Everything has changed, absolutely nothing's changed Eddie is a....draftnik?

10-22-2003, 01:23 PM	#17
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	For the Bag Head Supporters You really don\'t want me to play this game with you, Billy, you really don\'t. It\'s not like any of the players went on national TV and said, \"Yeah, I quit in the game.\" Too bad in your mind that\'s the only thing that would shut you up Yeah, I really do. If you are trying to tell me that when a team get\'s blown out that the reason for that is the players quit, then you\'ll have a better chance to get me to like \"George.\" You can talk about other teams but that\'s not relevant to the Saints. I know you put a lot of effort in looking up that information, but so what !! Did Carolina quit against the Titans? I think not. I think things happen sometimes and blowouts happen. It sure seems that the Saints came together as a team here lately. Now, does that sound like a team that has given up? NO !! It sounds like a team that got humilated by the Colts and they had the resolve to get better. But, if you want to think that they gave up against the Colts. Then, this is America. Believe what you want to..
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-22-2003, 01:28 PM	#18
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	For the Bag Head Supporters I\'m not the one that brought up other teams to begin with- you did! Did I say they gave up on the year, no, they\'ve proven that they haven\'t already. But they did give up in the Colts game. In my opinion, good teams do not get blown out. So, we either have a bad team on our hands, which I don\'t believe, or they gave up in the Colts game. I\'m believe that more than I do a bad team. Since you really want to play this game, fine, let\'s play. I don\'t think Aaron Brooks is smart enough to be a starting NFL QB. I\'m going to need more proof than, \"Yes he is.\" What proof do you have that he is???
	The waiting drove me mad.... I don't want to hear from those that know... Everything has changed, absolutely nothing's changed Eddie is a....draftnik?

10-22-2003, 01:33 PM	#19
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	For the Bag Head Supporters In my opinion, good teams do not get blown out. Oh, really now. Well, would you say that teams that make it to the Super Bowl are good teams? Yes?? I guess all those team that got blown out in the Super Bowl quit too huh?? Soon as you explain this to me we can continue our debate !!
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-22-2003, 01:35 PM	#20
saintfan Donated Plasma Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 18,556 Blog Entries: 5	For the Bag Head Supporters It should be noted that we\'ve had the toughest schedule in the league thus far base on our opponents records. ...for what it\'s worth...