ScottF

Accountability is not a fault exclusive to liberals. It seems what you are saying is that you do not have issue with the programs, but how they are administered. If that's true, I agree 100%.

However, there are countless examples of government programs that are not monitored, abused, and are therefore not cost effective, not just 'liberal' programs. As a matter of fact, the average American would be hard pressed to name the programs that are successful.

Keeping with your school example, look at No Child Left Behind. Great idea in theory, but underfunded from day one, and never gave 'failing' schools a chance to get out of hole. How do you fix an at-need school? Penalize it by witholding funding. Brilliant.
That law was compliments of Bush, Secretary of Education Rod Paige and co-authored by Boehner. Yep, FEDERAL law imposed upon individual states , and written by conservatives. Hmmmmm...

saintfan

If you think this is a liberal / conservative issue, at least from my perspective, you couldn't be more mistaken. I'm sick of big government. ALL big government. I have a - and fundamental is a key word - FUNDAMENTAL difference of opinion with the progression of a welfare state, and it isn't that we are creating one, we already HAVE created one.

Now, if you want to create a running list of social programs penned by liberals and conservatives, I can guarantee you which list will be longer, and to that end which list will host the most failures, but that's not my point. And I think you know that sir.

And here again is the problem. Here we are being kept busy while the real problems in Washington hide behind them. There isn't a politician in Washington overly concerned with the abuse of the free lunch system in our public schools beyond whether or not he/she can get a vote as a result of either implementing or ending it. You know it. I know it. And yet we do nothing about it.

If we agree on accountability (and how can thought people disagree) then we must also agree that these programs are created, not for their social benefit, but for the garnering of votes. Thing is Conservatives will listen to me, while my liberal buddies are hell bent on thinking I just don't get it. They don't understand they aren't really helping these people that they think they're helping. They are simply funding a mentality that is quickly destroying our country.

And when I bring up the fact, for example, that the school lunch system is being robbed blind here's what I get in response:

1) There must surely be no reason to have this conversation with me because I'm against feeding hungry kids.

Well that's bull**** and it's typed here by me, both before AND AFTER that silly thoughtless response.

2) Well, hey, the Conservatives do it too.

A point which I would never deny, but that's the old deflection defense. Nothing substantial in it a'tall.

So who's going to stand up and FIX the problems? I can tell you, and anyone else who stands still long enough to listen, and whether you believe it or not unfortunately IS my problem, but Obama has worsened the problem. Spending is OUT OF CONTROL. We just turned health care in to another overly-convoluted expensive silly government program that the medical system isn't equipped to handle, and that will do NOTHING to make health care cheaper because it doesn't even approach addressing the REAL problem because the REAL problems are the people in Washington making laws based on their special interests and in the interest of getting themselves and they buddies reelected. And yet the American public was stupid enough to allow it to happen.

If you don't believe me, consider Obama said OVER AND OVER again "NO NEW TAXES", and yet the deciding supreme court justice on his health care law had to "decide what was meant" and decided it was okay defined as a tax and that's what was meant. Obama is on record promising no new taxes, so how could this justice determine he meant otherwise? The whole thing was rigged from the get go, and you know it, and I know it, and yet American's keep towing the line and becoming more and more powerless as Government gets bigger and bigger and more in control of our lives - THE VERY THING THE FOUNDERS PREACHED AGAINST!!!!!!!!!!

Anyone who reads the Constitution - and not only the Constitution but the correspondence and communication between the men who wrote it as they carefully crafted every word - can only come away with a rude awakening. America offers opportunity and nothing more. That is it. That is all. Period. End of page. End of paragraph. End of story. Anything else is a bastardization of the principles upon which those men designed the way our government 'should' be run. And there's no arguing that. It is fact. There is no more clear fact in the whole debate, so why not lets just get back to the Constitution? Nobody wants to do that because half the country would have to recognize their agendas don't fit here. Nobody in this country is guaranteed a cell phone for the love of God. This country doesn't promise central air and heat for everyone? That's insane, and yet here we are...

There was a woman on PBS TV today smiling and speaking softly, all proud of herself, because she is part of some government program that teaches illegals how to navigate our system and her heart is bleeding because it is SO challenging to these people because they don't know the culture and they don't speak the language.

HELLO? You stupid person! They aren't even supposed to BE HERE?!?!?!?! The liberal is okay with the money spent helping these poor illegal people "navigate our system" and the Conservative wants them run out of the country on a rail because being here, even when measured against federal laws Obama and his ilk flatly refuse to enforce, is AGAINST THE FUC**** law! Count me with the Conservatives. I simply cannot understand how anyone could possibly disagree, but they exist, and they are destroying this country one social program at a time.

C'mon Man...