Re: Brees coming back?
 

If Payton was so high on resigning Winston why would he be pumping him up so much and inflating his value? That makes no sense. It's all fluff, lee. If you want to keep a free agent you don't go out and inflate his value. That's just plain stupid.

Edit: But then again, there are some here that are convinced that Sean Payton is stupid. So there's that.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Point taken but I don’t see what any of that has to do with Brees staying or retiring.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

I was referencing lee's statement, "with Payton so vocal on Winston I don't see him (Brees) being back". The point is that if lee's argument was Payton honestly wanting Winston back based upon puffing him up, thus expecting Brees to be gone, is faulty, then Brees being gone isn't a given.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Wait for the Golden Nutria

Re: Brees coming back?
 

I need him to go man. I feel like if he comes back I’d be wasting my time watching this upcoming season.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Unfortunately, My heart and my eyes tell me he's done. He's past his prime and can't carry the team anymore. Nor can the team cover for Drew's deficiencies.

I hope he is really good at announcing. He's a very good communicator and sure knows football. I don't think that he'll ever coach in the pros. He's a family man that hasn't spent much time with his family. I don't see him spending the endless hours required to coach. Love ya' Drew.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

I have to correct you on one major point, Rugs. Drew has always spent a tremendous amount of time with his family. Probably far more than the rest of us have with ours.

As for carrying the team, that's been the problem. He shouldn't have to carry the team. If he feels that shoulder is healthy enough then he is more than capable of being a significant part of a run to another Super Bowl. I still trust him more than either Winston or Hill in that regard.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

My point is that players and coaches need to spend time away from home working out, practicing, doing philanthropy work, and other PR activities. An announcer should have more time to devote to their family than a Pro player with additional requirements. I do realize that Drew goes out of his way to spend time with his family which means announcing games are a better fit than coaching.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Indeed. Brady didn’t carry Tampa to the title, the overall team did. Conversely, Mahomes, Rodgers, Brees, and 28 other starting QBs couldn’t carry their team to the championship. Sometimes the QB wasn’t good enough but sometimes (for playoff teams especially) it was because of injuries to themselves and/or key teammates.

I fully believe if Brees comes back next season, he will be better than Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, Joe Flaco, Nick Foles or a handful of other QBs that have won the SB. Just my opinion.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

I'll agree with you on coaches. Charlie Weis has pointed out that this is why most players shy away from coaching. He has said that coaches spend as much as three times as much time away from their families as players.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

I couldn't agree more. I feel the exact same way.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Well don’t waste your time. I’d rather have drew back than you

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Any other position (except kicker/punter) on the field and he would be done and possibly would have a year or two ago. This has become a QB starved league. Even hurt he's still top 10 and healthy top 5.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

That is absolutely true....within 20-30 yards. After that not so much. Don't get me wrong I love Drew but this is really a young mans game.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Somebody sounds like they’re in their feelings. Who hurt you? 😂

Re: Brees coming back?
 

The Saints?

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Sounds about right. 😂

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Ok, that was funny!

Re: Brees coming back?
 

We could debate what Brees has left in the tank, but I certainly don't see the NFL as being QB starved, not at all. I mean, we managed to sign Winston to be a backup for close to league minimum last offseason. The success of Burrow and Herbert has also bolstered a position that is pretty strong compared to usual league-wide.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Not a one my friend. I’m just saying, drew coming back is much more important to the Saints than you watching the games. Drew gives us the best option.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Exactly how old is this year's Super Bowl winning QB? Since 2001 the winning QB's have been Tom Brady, Brad Johnson, Tom Brady, Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Eli Manning, Joe Flacco, Russell Wilson, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Nick Foles, Tom Brady, Patrick Mahomes, and Tom Brady. Out of all of those only Mahomes and possibly Wilson could be considered young when they won it all.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Generally speaking it's a young mans game. Rugby players play into their fifties very often. I retired at 59. I was a little past my prime and I admit it. O-linemen can play later in life at a top level like QB's. We all know RB's have a short shelf life. WR's are losing their advantage generally by 30.

Once you lose that quick twitch in the NFL you are done playing at a high level at most positions in the NFL. Not necessarily just QB's. This is why I say football is a young mans game.

Edit: None of those players went through likely career ending surgery early in their career.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

lol, This logic, oh man...

Ok, in:

2001 TB was 24 (born in Aug/77) when he played his first SB, lol. They weren’t ALWAYS over 40. My guess is that Tom Brady skews your sample set wrt years upwards, as he has aged, bc of the sheer number of SB’s he’s played in..., and won. Heck ⅓ of the seasons he has won a SB during the years you provided.

In 2002, how old was Brad Johnson (born in 68)? 34, lol. So yes, at 34 he was an older player.

In 2003, TB was only 2 years older at 26.

In 2004, TB was only 3 years older at 27.

I can go on and evaluate each one, at the time they played their SB’s, but you see the logic. Brad Johnson at 52 right now..., wasn’t 52 when he played in his SB. Tom Brady at 43 now..., wasn’t 43 when he played his first SB either. Rothlesberger was 23 during his first, same as Mahomes, with Brady just months behind them as who was the youngest to win it all.

Throughout all of the SB era the age of winning SB QB’s breaks down like this:

25 and under - (6)
26-30 - (24)
31-35 - (16)
36 - (9) including this year's SB.

Of those nine over 36, they are:

John Elway (twice)
Johnny Unitas
Jim Plunkett
Peyton Manning (Broncos)
&
Tom Brady (four times with two different teams)

The sweet spot is roughly 31 years old, if you average them all up. For reference - Drew Brees, born in 79, had just turned 31 when the Saints won their SB Feb 2010.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Drew finished tied for 13TH in the league w/ 7.5 yards per attempt.
And that was w/o MT for 90% of the season. Sanders missed 4 games, Tre' Quan missed 4 games and your free agent TE was a bust.
Which led to dumping off to AK too often.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Show Rodger where they hurt you. ;)

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Indeed. Plus, going back to early Payton tenure, his offense has allways featured getting the ball to RBs through the pass. Bush, Thomas, Sproles, Kamara were all superior pass catching RBs. When a third plus of your passes go to RBs then your yard per attempt is likely to go down.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Didn’t think that one through did ya?

Ben Roethlisberger was 23 lol....
Aaron Rodgers - 27
Eli Manning - 27

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Great points here in this thread! Love the back and forth!

Re: Brees coming back?
 

I kinda have the same feelings as far as QBs. If you are a good organization with sound coaching and management, then (barring mass injuries) you can be competitive and in the playoff hunt with a variety of QB options out there. Saints did fine with fill ins when Brees was down. Although they had a down year, New England was competitive as hell last year and was in the playoff hunt until late in the season with Scam as the QB. Dallas was competitive as well when they were down to their 3rd QB.

A good offensive mind like Payton’s can hopefully figure out how to move on from here. The day they are in the bottom 10 for offense and scoring I’ll start to re-evaluate him.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Just about all of the barring Brady and Manning second when he was given probably the most tools of any QB in history where still in their Primes of late 20s to very early 30s

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Wow. Just wow. I’m speechless.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Jameis Winston is a better quarterback than Eli Manning, Nick Foles, and Joe Flacco. He can win it all here. I believe he’s the best option. Yes, even over Drew Brees. I don’t know how many more times we have to watch the offense sputter in the playoffs because a good team is playing tight and taking away everything short. If Drew Brees were to come back it would have to be accompanied with a new, innovative scheme to mask those deficiencies. Either that or he needs to start taking HGH and getting stem cell therapy.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

And all three are Hall of Fame worthy, right? They kept winning. Simply being young isn't the key to being a success as a QB as implied. They all had long successful careers because they were quality QB's. Playing QB isn't a young man's game these days. Being a quality QB is the key to winning.

The list I shared is made up entirely of either future HOF QB's or veterans. And most all of them had a top notch defense, as well.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Thank God.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Lol , u both have great points and it was a awesome end to a debate hopefully. No pun intended


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Re: Brees coming back?
 

The new innovated scheme is exactly what we we’ve seen the last few years and it works great until we get to the point where we're facing teams with the talent and coaching to make the playoffs. The ship has sailed and I agree that Winston is the best shot we have given our circumstances.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Good point Rez, the only way I see him coming back is a semi backup role. It will never happen though . Love Brees to death , never dreamed he would have to go out with a season like the last one. I if all wanted him to set the TD record. But Brady the greedy bastard will have it all.


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Re: Brees coming back?
 

Could be Rez. I have no issue if Winston is the QB next year. I also don’t have a problem if it’s Brees. I respect you and your opinion. I’m just not sure I agree with writing the loss off to a Brees weak arm when Tampa took out two of the strongest arms in the game in Rodgers and Mahomes right after they beat the Saints. If Cook doesn’t play like a scrub Or they had another healthy target on the field, then the Saints win that game. Just my view of things.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

If Brees comes back they will prioritize the Oline and stabilize the run and pass coverage TB made their final run by but extreme pressure on the backfield with the outside rush and solid middle pressure with two extremely fast LB’s. This caused the Saints, Greenbay and KC the same problems getting the offense moving and all three of us could not affect TB’s offense anywhere near the same level in pressure points.

There where occasional long throws buy Brady but mostly he attacked between the hashes and the run game made KC pay with their zone coverage.

If Brees come back he will be the best QB in the room. If he does come back and we have players not willing to get onboard CSP will probably work those issues out of the system.

If TH does not want to play tight end, slot, fullback and special teams might be a shame to lose a really good football player who wants to play QB in the NFL but shows mediocre QB skills CSP might allow him the possibility to go somewhere else to pursue.

Re: Brees coming back?
 

Good QB’s, all of them, who had their day in the sun..., an argument can be made that Aaron Rodgers, fresh off his MVP title, is still playing at an elite level at a more advanced age. But, let’s look at the numbers deeper.

Eli Manning:

Manning won his SB’s at ages 27 and 31. After his final SB at age 31, he made the playoffs once, a loss. Then promptly retired. So, he wasn’t successful after age 31, at all.

https://www.pro-football-reference.c.../gamelog/post/

Big Ben:

Both Ben’s SB wins came early, ages 23 and 26. Even his SB loss was at age 28. Since that SB loss, Big Ben led Steelers have made the playoffs 6 (six) times. Of those six appearances, they lost immediately four times. They lost in the divisional round (age 33) and at the AFC Championship round (age 34) once also. He hasn’t done anything since age 34. And the following very recent statement about Big Ben isn’t exactly a ringing endorsement of the player.

"As we sit here today, Ben is a member of the Pittsburgh Steelers. ... He reiterated to us that he wants to continue to play. We told him we have to look at this current situation." - Pittsburg Steelers GM Kevin Colbert

https://mobile.twitter.com/bepryor/s...00804337958912

https://www.pro-football-reference.c.../gamelog/post/

Aaron Rodgers:

This is the player that is still playing well, and being successful in the playoffs also. But his lone SB appearance was a decade ago, Feb 2011 (age 27) via the 2010 NFL season. Since then, he’s been to the NFC Championship game three times, all losses (ages 31, 33, and 37). But I agree here, he is still playing well, MVP level according to the NFL, and being .500 (2 wins, 2 losses) in the playoffs after the age of 36. But his window is closing quickly..., very, very quickly imho.

https://www.pro-football-reference.c.../gamelog/post/

Bottom line, there are exceptions to every rule. But the idea that SB success is built around an “aged” veteran SB in their mid to late 30’s/early 40’s is faulty. There is a “sweet spot”, roughly at 31. The gradual decline begins for all of us, even the greatest athletes.

As others around here have quipped - Father Time remains undefeated.