Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots

K Major · 09-28-2021, 11:10 AM

I understand it's a week-to-week league however we should be able to gain some momentum offensively against the Giants on Sunday.

They (HC JJudge/media) are already hinting that Jason Garrett could be relieved of his OC duties if they continue to underperform. This is a Jacksonville Jaguar level bad team.

Rugby Saint II · 09-28-2021, 01:07 PM

I'm still hopeful that Winston can lead this team. He just hasn't looked the part yet. That's OK. We're 2-1 and I'm a patient man considering I'm so impatient.

WW_Who_Dat · 09-28-2021, 04:39 PM

Never a JW fan with all the crap in his college and early Tampa days. Most of us certainly have things that we did during that period of our life that do not define us for the rest of our lives thankfully.

I think JW has matured and is a changed person from his earlier years.

His history in Tampa was not great but he never had the coaching he needed to learn the process of being and NFL QB and to effectively use his skill set and arm talent.

Again as I stated earlier, I was not a JW fan but also honest enough to know he was better than Terry Taysom or Drew if Drew choose to return this year.

So I see and hear him being critizised for throwing under a 200 yards a game for 3 games like he can’ throw or is not able to handle reading defenses. Let’s get real for a second, he threw for over 5000 yards in 2019 and had 2 seasons (2015-16) over 4000 yards and 1 season (2017) with 3500 yards. The man can throw the ball, he did throw 30 INT’s in 2019.

He’s not throwing ball more because SP’s game play calling is not asking for to throw more, not because JW can’t throw or carry an offense if needed. Brees in his prime could make just about any skill player with average skill look like an all pro. I venture to guess it’s SP that does not have the confidence level required in our current receivers to ask JW to pass the ball much more than currently being asked. Add an offensive line that is missing now 2 key starters and Ruiz in a position he did really spend any prep time this off-season and JW has not had much of a opportunity to get comfortable in the pocket.

Only a talent on Brees’s level could make the current offensive unit look average to respectable in the passing game. We need bodies and talent back before any legit call on JW an be made.

JW’s INT’s in game 2 did not lose the game the Panthers just kicked our butt on both sides of the ball.

The Dude · 09-28-2021, 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by WW_Who_Dat

Never a JW fan with all the crap in his college and early Tampa days. Most of us certainly have things that we did during that period of our life that do not define us for the rest of our lives thankfully.

I think JW has matured and is a changed person from his earlier years.

His history in Tampa was not great but he never had the coaching he needed to learn the process of being and NFL QB and to effectively use his skill set and arm talent.

Again as I stated earlier, I was not a JW fan but also honest enough to know he was better than Terry Taysom or Drew if Drew choose to return this year.

So I see and hear him being critizised for throwing under a 200 yards a game for 3 games like he can’ throw or is not able to handle reading defenses. Let’s get real for a second, he threw for over 5000 yards in 2019 and had 2 seasons (2015-16) over 4000 yards and 1 season (2017) with 3500 yards. The man can throw the ball, he did throw 30 INT’s in 2019.

He’s not throwing ball more because SP’s game play calling is not asking for to throw more, not because JW can’t throw or carry an offense if needed. Brees in his prime could make just about any skill player with average skill look like an all pro. I venture to guess it’s SP that does not have the confidence level required in our current receivers to ask JW to pass the ball much more than currently being asked. Add an offensive line that is missing now 2 key starters and Ruiz in a position he did really spend any prep time this off-season and JW has not had much of a opportunity to get comfortable in the pocket.

Only a talent on Brees’s level could make the current offensive unit look average to respectable in the passing game. We need bodies and talent back before any legit call on JW an be made.

JW’s INT’s in game 2 did not lose the game the Panthers just kicked our butt on both sides of the ball.

I agree with everything here but you have to wonder why Payton isn’t asking him to throw more. Payton has been criticized for getting “too cute”, abandoning the run, and getting too pass happy. He likes to be aggressive, sometimes to a fault. I just don’t see him as the type of guy to not let Winston use his arm, which is one of Winstons biggest attributes unless there’s a good reason not to.
BTW I’m pulling for Winston. I respect how he’s bought into the system and it’s obvious he is trying to do everything he can to succeed. I admire how he’s matured and embraced the opportunity for a second chance.

K Major · 09-28-2021, 02:10 PM

And to piggyback on Deuce analysis on Ruiz (rough game, losing leverage), that's two straight games ...

I've asked this question last week but how likely is it we move Austin R to center & slide Ruiz to guard until McCoy is 100? Ruiz is really getting abused when a NT is lined up over him.

Those free rushes are going to get Winston hurt (sack or running) or force him into a bad throw & subsequent turnover.

dizzle88 · 09-28-2021, 02:56 PM

I thought all the talk of camp was how much better Ruiz was -_-

Guy is getting abused week in and week out it seems. First Round picks really aren't going well over the last few years.

AsylumGuido · 09-28-2021, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by dizzle88

I thought all the talk of camp was how much better Ruiz was -_-

Guy is getting abused week in and week out it seems. First Round picks really aren't going well over the last few years.

Week in week out? They've only played three weeks and he looked great week one in relief of McCoy. In week two the entire team was discombobulated with half the coaching staff missing and defensive holes everywhere. He looked really good all last season. It is a tad early to write him off as a first round failure, don't you think?

dizzle88 · 09-28-2021, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

Week in week out? They've only played three weeks and he looked great week one in relief of McCoy. In week two the entire team was discombobulated with half the coaching staff missing and defensive holes everywhere. He looked really good all last season. It is a tad early to write him off as a first round failure, don't you think?

I mean he didn't look really good all last season, he basically ended Brees' career when he whiffed on a block.

AsylumGuido · 09-28-2021, 05:02 PM

Originally Posted by dizzle88

I mean he didn't look really good all last season, he basically ended Brees' career when he whiffed on a block.

The offensive line is a unit. One thing I have heard many times over the years from players and coaches alike is that a mistake by one lineman can reflect badly upon another. What we see as a "whiff" by one player on the line is very often that player trying to cover on a missed assignment by the man beside him. This can happen more frequently on a line in flux. That said, even the best of offensive linemen miss a block here or there that is his take. It happens and doesn't always happen in a planting of the QB.

Rugby Saint II · 09-28-2021, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by dizzle88

I thought all the talk of camp was how much better Ruiz was -_-

Guy is getting abused week in and week out it seems. First Round picks really aren't going well over the last few years.

Cosidering he hasn't had reps at the position I'm fine with giving him some time to grow into the player we hoped for. Before McCoy went down the buzz was about how well he was looking in TC and the preseason.

09-28-2021, 11:10 AM	#1
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,831 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots I understand it's a week-to-week league however we should be able to gain some momentum offensively against the Giants on Sunday. They (HC JJudge/media) are already hinting that Jason Garrett could be relieved of his OC duties if they continue to underperform. This is a Jacksonville Jaguar level bad team. jnormand and SmashMouth like this.

09-28-2021, 01:07 PM	#2
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,153	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots I'm still hopeful that Winston can lead this team. He just hasn't looked the part yet. That's OK. We're 2-1 and I'm a patient man considering I'm so impatient. jnormand, SmashMouth and Boston Saint like this.

09-28-2021, 04:39 PM	#3
WW_Who_Dat 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Lafayette, La and Valencia CA Posts: 1,279 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots Never a JW fan with all the crap in his college and early Tampa days. Most of us certainly have things that we did during that period of our life that do not define us for the rest of our lives thankfully. I think JW has matured and is a changed person from his earlier years. His history in Tampa was not great but he never had the coaching he needed to learn the process of being and NFL QB and to effectively use his skill set and arm talent. Again as I stated earlier, I was not a JW fan but also honest enough to know he was better than Terry Taysom or Drew if Drew choose to return this year. So I see and hear him being critizised for throwing under a 200 yards a game for 3 games like he can’ throw or is not able to handle reading defenses. Let’s get real for a second, he threw for over 5000 yards in 2019 and had 2 seasons (2015-16) over 4000 yards and 1 season (2017) with 3500 yards. The man can throw the ball, he did throw 30 INT’s in 2019. He’s not throwing ball more because SP’s game play calling is not asking for to throw more, not because JW can’t throw or carry an offense if needed. Brees in his prime could make just about any skill player with average skill look like an all pro. I venture to guess it’s SP that does not have the confidence level required in our current receivers to ask JW to pass the ball much more than currently being asked. Add an offensive line that is missing now 2 key starters and Ruiz in a position he did really spend any prep time this off-season and JW has not had much of a opportunity to get comfortable in the pocket. Only a talent on Brees’s level could make the current offensive unit look average to respectable in the passing game. We need bodies and talent back before any legit call on JW an be made. JW’s INT’s in game 2 did not lose the game the Panthers just kicked our butt on both sides of the ball. Boston Saint likes this.

09-28-2021, 07:00 PM	#4
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,060	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots Originally Posted by WW_Who_Dat Never a JW fan with all the crap in his college and early Tampa days. Most of us certainly have things that we did during that period of our life that do not define us for the rest of our lives thankfully. I think JW has matured and is a changed person from his earlier years. His history in Tampa was not great but he never had the coaching he needed to learn the process of being and NFL QB and to effectively use his skill set and arm talent. Again as I stated earlier, I was not a JW fan but also honest enough to know he was better than Terry Taysom or Drew if Drew choose to return this year. So I see and hear him being critizised for throwing under a 200 yards a game for 3 games like he can’ throw or is not able to handle reading defenses. Let’s get real for a second, he threw for over 5000 yards in 2019 and had 2 seasons (2015-16) over 4000 yards and 1 season (2017) with 3500 yards. The man can throw the ball, he did throw 30 INT’s in 2019. He’s not throwing ball more because SP’s game play calling is not asking for to throw more, not because JW can’t throw or carry an offense if needed. Brees in his prime could make just about any skill player with average skill look like an all pro. I venture to guess it’s SP that does not have the confidence level required in our current receivers to ask JW to pass the ball much more than currently being asked. Add an offensive line that is missing now 2 key starters and Ruiz in a position he did really spend any prep time this off-season and JW has not had much of a opportunity to get comfortable in the pocket. Only a talent on Brees’s level could make the current offensive unit look average to respectable in the passing game. We need bodies and talent back before any legit call on JW an be made. JW’s INT’s in game 2 did not lose the game the Panthers just kicked our butt on both sides of the ball. I agree with everything here but you have to wonder why Payton isn’t asking him to throw more. Payton has been criticized for getting “too cute”, abandoning the run, and getting too pass happy. He likes to be aggressive, sometimes to a fault. I just don’t see him as the type of guy to not let Winston use his arm, which is one of Winstons biggest attributes unless there’s a good reason not to. BTW I’m pulling for Winston. I respect how he’s bought into the system and it’s obvious he is trying to do everything he can to succeed. I admire how he’s matured and embraced the opportunity for a second chance. iceshack149, jnormand, leilung and 1 others like this.
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,060	"Where life had no value, death, sometimes, had its price. That is why the bounty killers appeared."

09-28-2021, 02:10 PM	#5
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,831 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots And to piggyback on Deuce analysis on Ruiz (rough game, losing leverage), that's two straight games ... I've asked this question last week but how likely is it we move Austin R to center & slide Ruiz to guard until McCoy is 100? Ruiz is really getting abused when a NT is lined up over him. Those free rushes are going to get Winston hurt (sack or running) or force him into a bad throw & subsequent turnover. jnormand likes this.

09-28-2021, 02:56 PM	#6
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,534	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots I thought all the talk of camp was how much better Ruiz was -_- Guy is getting abused week in and week out it seems. First Round picks really aren't going well over the last few years.

09-28-2021, 03:08 PM	#7
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,622	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots Originally Posted by dizzle88 I thought all the talk of camp was how much better Ruiz was -_- Guy is getting abused week in and week out it seems. First Round picks really aren't going well over the last few years. Week in week out? They've only played three weeks and he looked great week one in relief of McCoy. In week two the entire team was discombobulated with half the coaching staff missing and defensive holes everywhere. He looked really good all last season. It is a tad early to write him off as a first round failure, don't you think? Rugby Saint II likes this.

09-28-2021, 04:21 PM	#8
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,534	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots Originally Posted by AsylumGuido Week in week out? They've only played three weeks and he looked great week one in relief of McCoy. In week two the entire team was discombobulated with half the coaching staff missing and defensive holes everywhere. He looked really good all last season. It is a tad early to write him off as a first round failure, don't you think? I mean he didn't look really good all last season, he basically ended Brees' career when he whiffed on a block. jeanpierre and K Major like this.

09-28-2021, 05:02 PM	#9
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,622	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots Originally Posted by dizzle88 I mean he didn't look really good all last season, he basically ended Brees' career when he whiffed on a block. The offensive line is a unit. One thing I have heard many times over the years from players and coaches alike is that a mistake by one lineman can reflect badly upon another. What we see as a "whiff" by one player on the line is very often that player trying to cover on a missed assignment by the man beside him. This can happen more frequently on a line in flux. That said, even the best of offensive linemen miss a block here or there that is his take. It happens and doesn't always happen in a planting of the QB.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

09-28-2021, 04:17 PM	#10
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,153	Re: Observations from the Saints' Win over the Patriots Originally Posted by dizzle88 I thought all the talk of camp was how much better Ruiz was -_- Guy is getting abused week in and week out it seems. First Round picks really aren't going well over the last few years. Cosidering he hasn't had reps at the position I'm fine with giving him some time to grow into the player we hoped for. Before McCoy went down the buzz was about how well he was looking in TC and the preseason.