Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Other than couple/handful of teams, there is really no one good this year. Scores have been lower, OL play has been all over the page, OPI and PI is not called with any consistency, phantom calls for take your pick penalty, etc... Last night's game with Russell Wilson showed much of that, the same things we're seeing with the Saints. Some of your points are valid in terms of maybe some of the players we have we've hung on to too long and signed guys we shouldn't have. I still say Ceedy's loss is greater than we realize, than what DA realizes. The NFC isn't a strong conference. So at the end of the day, we'll still have a shot at season's end, albeit with probably a similar record as last year's. With the complement of a full season, we'll have more ammo to evaluate and re-evaluate the talent that maybe we should have moved on from.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

The trouble is that nobody has spent as much 2023 cap and 2023 draft stock being not good in 2022. We have dug a deep hole and struck the septic tank in doing it. This is why Mickey Loomis has to go.

We know the talent we have to move on from but in most cases moving on from them will mean a cap hit we won't be able to take because we will be $100 million over the cap or whatever. So all the players we need to move on from, we will instead sign them to restructured contracts that lower their 2023 cap number while making more of their salary in 2024-2026 guaranteed, perhaps even signing them to long term extensions with voidable years to pay them well into the late 2020's. This is the problem with Loomis' 'wizardry', it's all smoke and mirrors and we are paying the price now. With incredible amazing super luck we could have a 10% chance to sneak into the playoffs at 9-8, but we are not beating teams like Buffalo, Miami, Philly, LA, Tampa, Green Bay, KC, etc in the playoffs. And in the offseason due to having the highest cap we are going to have to sacrifice, not everyone, but a few key players. And to replace them we will not have a 1st round pick, because it was needed as one part of a package to trade up for a receiver. The only way this gets fixed is removing Mickey Loomis and committing to rebuilding. We need to cut back and pay off our debts. Gamblers like Loomis don't know how to eat Top Ramen and send checks to the credit card company. We can't fix this with that loser.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

This screenshot looks like the same play the pick6 came against TB. Only difference is Tony J Jr was the back instead of AK.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

This definitely needs fixed. Kamara is a THE difference maker in the open field. This between the tackle stuff on first down needs to be shaken up.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Was the O-line really that bad though? They looked a lot better than week 1. I was distracted and didn’t pay close attention to what was going on in the trenches. At a casual glance it looked like stupid mistakes (botched snaps) and miscommunication with receivers. Penalties need to be cleaned up on both sides of the ball. It’s time to put Dalton in, I think he will do more with less than Winston had assuming Thomas and Landry miss time. I think it’s highly probable that they do.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

I'm believing there's light at the end of the tunnel and this is about to turn around.

Not slinging no rainbows and glee type **** around either just thinking with a somewhat new regime getting ready to go forwards, that this could be a blessing in disguise and work as a character building type thing into the future.

Or... Of course it can go down the tubes.
This next game should fully tell the tale.

I'm hardheaded but I'd like to think I'm not deaf, dumb, nor blind.

#13 and #5 will hurt pretty damn bad if they're really banged up.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

It didn’t/doesn’t help much that 3 of the first games were played on the road…one in London! Plus the one home game was against a SB favorite. Schedule is what the schedule is, and I’m not making excuses; just thinking about how last season and this one had rough conditions to start under.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

The early snap by McCoy was made with 2 seconds on the playclock, so in my opinion, that goes down as time mismanagement by the QB and/or OC.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

My Post-Mortem 'Monday' Assessment:

I generally like to end with positive notes but since there were so few, I drop them first and save some of my distress.

Upppers-
* Olave is really coming into his own and showing 1st round talent early.
* Sample size is getting better and I like Ruiz's progress. (Better late than never, I guess!)
* Defense overall is really doing a good job of keeping points off the boards. (Exception: Bad tackling on Shenault. Their ONLY offensive TD.)

Downers
* Turnovers and penalties are killing this team. Remove the TO's for TD (2 in 3 games.) and in in spite of INT's from JW, we're still in a strong position to win the 2 loses so far. -6 in TO ration for the season is not winning football anywhere in the NFL.
* Referencing the above: ZERO INTs so far in the season despite being top 5 in defended passing yardage. With our DB's we are better than that number shows.
* JW isn't getting the ball out quick enough to hit passing lanes in stride.
* Coaching is weak at best. Play calling is Vanilla and predictable on offense. Pitiful with the weapons at their disposal.
* Special Teams. This used to be one of the tried and true strengths of this team. Now, not so much. Lutz gets one blocked and shanks another one leaving 6 points on the field. Nope. Coaches need to get this one fixed NOW! Close games will be decided on the leg of Lutz. If he's not dependable, we lose.

Earlier I said it's too soon to stand on the ledge...well, I'm moving towards the window.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Good Post Mortem … I have the window open but will walk out of the room this week. Can’t watch the Saints Offense and enjoy the product that is being put on the field.

Was one of the give JW a chance if will be better after his time spent with SP DB and the offensive scheme. He has had ample opportunities and continues to show he can not read the defensive sets or is not able to reset protection and get the ball out to hot reads. Great arm but he will not help this team with all the ill advised throws into situation that the defense is at a extreme advantage with their coverage. He is just not processing.

The issue are not all on JW with unimaginative play calling on 1st and 2nd downs, penalties, fumbles and spotty Oline play.

In my humble opinion if we correct all the play calling, penalties, fumbling and the Oline starts to perform we still have the issue of JW just not able to run the offense. Trash time yards and points tends to deflect from his command of the offense in anything other gun and shoot downfield.

Other commitment this Sunday so I will not be able to watch, of the opinion that a QB change is necessary and that will probably not happen this week.

Hope all things start to improve and the light comes on for JW and the offensive play calling becomes more dynamic but not holding my breath that the a new and different JW shows up.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

So many high draft picks and superstars on this team

Hard to believe they won't respond to this adversity.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Coaching? Starting with DA perhaps ...

These men did not look prepared at all on Sunday & Dennis had that deer in headlights/stoic demeanor.

3 games in & almost 12 quarters, his team has looked terrible offensively.

Meanwhile Doug Petersen (he should have received more consideration for HC in NO) and his Jaguars are competing out of the gate.

Coaching matters, even at this level. Better get it together coaches.

"End rant"x(

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Well a delay of game is better than a fumble, right? Cant imagine the center should snap it before the QB calls no matter whats on the clock.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Not sure if this was posted yet. Sorry if so. This video sums up most of my thoughts…

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

I don't know how much longer it can be called "Offensive Struggles" because it's not like they are "usually good" and had an off day. They are consistently awful, so it's just the same old offense.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Matt touched on an interesting name for me ...

Deonte' Harty. Was he a healthy scratch? Noticed we had Landry on punt returns and Washington on kick-offs.

Harty is an electric player that has a knack for making big plays - we need him on the field. Interesting that he didn't play. Especially considering Taysom was out.

Saints OC needs to be more creative with our playmakers going forward.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

True dizz. But as this video points out, look at the first drive. We had a completion down to the 19 that was called back because of a bs penalty. That’s a successful drive to start the game. If they get even three points there the tone is different. Add that with a fumble 6 and two missed/ locked field goals and that’s a 16 point swing.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

At least we'll have a high first round draft pick next year! Oh, that'll go to the only undefeated NFC team in the NFL so far...







https://c.tenor.com/RF6J3JyMApAAAAAd/jump-off.gif

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Ahh…go catch a fish! 😝

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Didn't you see Draft Day? We will get that back. :confused:

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Well it was used to address a very important need in us getting a starting LT. I'm not ready to write off this season after 3 weeks, and we haven't seen him play in the regular season yet.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

I LOLed at that Oak!

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Me either, shawnky. Hopefully that 1st rounder the Eagles got will be quite a bit lower than they hope. And if what we are seeing out of Hurst is any indication, I can't wait to see Penning back on the field. At least it will give a more of a sense of aggressiveness than we've seen thus far.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

You jest, but if there is someone that Loomis wants in the first he's very capable of making the moves to trade back in.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Lets say there is a QB we like who is expected to go #1 overall. If we had the #1 overall pick we could just take him. If we had a top 5 pick we could trade up. What sort of package would you propose that Loomis offer for the #1 overall pick that doesnt include any current year 1st rounders? What is the precedent that such a trade would be accepted? What if we want a player who will go 5th or 10th in the 1st? How much will we have to give up with no 1st rounder at all to offer? Seems like the cost will be exorbitant? Trading future picks is like taking out a loan with high interest. Now you are talking about taking out one high interest loan to pay another.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Of course we don't move up to #1. Even if we still had our2023 1st rounder we would be hard pressed moving up from #32. But, we can still move into the 1st round somewhere.

That said, we didn't waste our 2023 1st. We used it to get arguably the best rookie WR in the draft and what could end up being our starting LT for the next decade. Sounds like a pretty good deal to me.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Robbing Peter to pay Paul.

When this finally catches up to us, it's going to hit like a ton of bricks.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

That's exactly what people were saying ten years ago. Teams across the league are going to the same cap management strategy as the Saints. You borrow from Peter when the amount leveraged is a smaller percentage of the total cap to pay Paul and remain competitive. As long as the cap numbers keep skyrocketing it will remain a very sound strategy. And given the record revenues annually in the NFL there's little reason to believe the growth won't continue beyond the term of the newest CBA and broadcast contracts.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Plenty of teams are using that strategy now. It definitely works... until it doesn't. Eventually you're going to need a reset and when that does happen, hopefully we'll have the draft picks to use to capitalize on it.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

I'm not sure if the ton of bricks has hit us yet but I've been seeing a few precursory rocks dropping here and there.:bng:

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Seems to me two different issues are being conflated; the hazards of burrowing against picks in future drafts and the hazards of burrowing against the future salary cap. When debating about being able to get back into the first round next year the rise of future salary caps really isn’t part of the discussion.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

It actually does come into play to a small degree. As the cap rises each year so does the slotted rate associated with that pick. The salary associated with the #5 overall pick will be incrementally higher in 2023 than it was in 2022. Not that big of a deal, but there is a degree of correlation.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

To an infinitesimal degree perhaps. Nothing that would influence a trade. The only real impact would be if a player was involved in the trade to move back into the first next year.

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

Highghgh Hopes ....yall got high___ hopes; Pie in the sky.. kinda Highhh Hopes....:dunce:

Re: Observations from the Saints Loss at Panthers
 

It could be a Fantastic Voyage! RIP Coolio