If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously?

The Dude · 10-05-2022, 11:38 AM

Sex

Boston Saint · 10-05-2022, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by The Dude

Sex

He He He He!

BakoSaint · 10-05-2022, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by rezburna

Shane Steichen
Demeco Ryans
Kellen Moore
Byron Leftwich
Eric Bieniemy

We can't get those guys mid-season. We could probably get Marv Lewis at any time. His career winning percentage is .518. Allen's is .225. He is a known commodity as a coach with a predictable .500 level coaching record who would allow us to assess whether coaching or talent is the problem on our roster starting now, not next year. We have no idea how those young coordinators would transition to head coaching, the best of them probably wouldn't take a job from us if they had any other offer, and we can't ask until January. Marv Lewis is an option now.

If everyone can take Andy Dalton seriously but nobody can take Marv Lewis seriously I have to ask why? Would it have helped if Marv Lewis had been an interim coach for the Cowboys and Bears the last couple of years and was really bad? What is the difference? Is there something superficial about Dalton and Allen that some people just prefer over Winston and Lewis, where its fair to replace Winston after a few games with Dalton, but Allen deserves a full season minimum and the replacement can't be Lewis?

BakoSaint · 10-05-2022, 12:29 PM

I just don't get the reaction:

Andy Dalton: The Red Baron, Redhead Redemption, A Real Life Viking, Awesome, Book Your Tickets For the Superbowl!!!!!!!!!!

Marvin Lewis: OMG NOOOO!!!, Why Even Mention His Name, Total Loser, Who Dey, Hopeless!

Why is it the twilight zone to suggest one as a replacement and totally reasonable to suggest the other? To me they are totally equivalent, most of their past track record is shared on the same sideline.

Also both Allen and Lewis had Carson Palmer as their QB. Guess who won more with Palmer? Lewis is a superior coach to Allen in every possible way who would probably be available at a moments notice. Its like trading the Terrelle Pryor / Matt McGloin of head coaches for the Carson Palmer / Andy Dalton of head coaches. Neither are Sean Payton / Drew Brees but its a safe immediate upgrade.

Boston Saint · 10-05-2022, 01:34 PM

Originally Posted by BakoSaint

I just don't get the reaction:

Andy Dalton: The Red Baron, Redhead Redemption, A Real Life Viking, Awesome, Book Your Tickets For the Superbowl!!!!!!!!!!

Marvin Lewis: OMG NOOOO!!!, Why Even Mention His Name, Total Loser, Who Dey, Hopeless!

Why is it the twilight zone to suggest one as a replacement and totally reasonable to suggest the other? To me they are totally equivalent, most of their past track record is shared on the same sideline.

Also both Allen and Lewis had Carson Palmer as their QB. Guess who won more with Palmer? Lewis is a superior coach to Allen in every possible way who would probably be available at a moments notice. Its like trading the Terrelle Pryor / Matt McGloin of head coaches for the Carson Palmer / Andy Dalton of head coaches. Neither are Sean Payton / Drew Brees but its a safe immediate upgrade.

So your solution to fixing the Saints 4 games into the season is fire Allen and bring in a 64 year old coach not connected or familiar with the system, players, or team who is a career +3 games over .500 over a 16 year career and who knows he is there as a lame duck?

I’ll repeat my answer. No.

BakoSaint · 10-05-2022, 02:38 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

So your solution to fixing the Saints 4 games into the season is fire Allen and bring in a 64 year old coach not connected or familiar with the system, players, or team who is a career +3 games over .500 over a 16 year career and who knows he is there as a lame duck?

I’ll repeat my answer. No.

Yes. He is a viable option for an immediate in season upgrade over a coach who is a career 22 games under .500 over a 2.5 season head coaching career. Dennis Allen is proving what the numbers already said, he is Urban Meyer and Hue Jackson level. He is like if we brought in Terrelle Pryor or Matt McGloin as QB, his fellow Raider misfits. I dont understand how Marv Lewis is worse than Andy Dalton. 34 at QB is maybe worse than 64 as head coach especially for a QB who has been playing backup and losing for years. Dalton has a similar .500 type record. Dalton is likely a lake duck too but either one could stick around if they win enough. I would rather finish this year with a Jim Mora type head coach than with the least accomplished head coach in modern Saints history who can’t even be positively compared to Haslett or Ditka because they both had better results.

Boston Saint · 10-05-2022, 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by BakoSaint

Yes. He is a viable option for an immediate in season upgrade over a coach who is a career 22 games under .500 over a 2.5 season head coaching career. Dennis Allen is proving what the numbers already said, he is Urban Meyer and Hue Jackson level. He is like if we brought in Terrelle Pryor or Matt McGloin as QB, his fellow Raider misfits. I dont understand how Marv Lewis is worse than Andy Dalton. 34 at QB is maybe worse than 64 as head coach especially for a QB who has been playing backup and losing for years. Dalton has a similar .500 type record. Dalton is likely a lake duck too but either one could stick around if they win enough. I would rather finish this year with a Jim Mora type head coach than with the least accomplished head coach in modern Saints history who can’t even be positively compared to Haslett or Ditka because they both had better results.

I honestly can’t tell if you are serious. Well played.

Rugby Saint II · 10-05-2022, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by BakoSaint

Yes. He is a viable option for an immediate in season upgrade over a coach who is a career 22 games under .500 over a 2.5 season head coaching career. Dennis Allen is proving what the numbers already said, he is Urban Meyer and Hue Jackson level. He is like if we brought in Terrelle Pryor or Matt McGloin as QB, his fellow Raider misfits. I dont understand how Marv Lewis is worse than Andy Dalton. 34 at QB is maybe worse than 64 as head coach especially for a QB who has been playing backup and losing for years. Dalton has a similar .500 type record. Dalton is likely a lake duck too but either one could stick around if they win enough. I would rather finish this year with a Jim Mora type head coach than with the least accomplished head coach in modern Saints history who can’t even be positively compared to Haslett or Ditka because they both had better results.

If the Saints were to fire DA before the season is over I hope that the front office would promote from within to maintain continuity rather than blow the whole thing up mid season. Sometimes just a fresh face in charge can turn things around, even if it's just a temporary Band Aid while you find out who is available after the season. There should be some young up and coaching coaches for the front office next year. No need to rush DA out the door.

But I do agree with the idea that change to the old ways might be appropriate now. What we have going now is stale and is simply regurgitating Sean Paytons' formula back again.

However, it's too early to make a decision on whether to cut bait with DA just yet. Do you demote DA back to DC? How would the defense react to that?

AsylumGuido · 10-05-2022, 04:33 PM

Rugs has a better shot at being named Miss Louisiana than the Saints making a head coaching move midseason.

BakoSaint · 10-05-2022, 04:40 PM

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II

If the Saints were to fire DA before the season is over I hope that the front office would promote from within to maintain continuity rather than blow the whole thing up mid season. Sometimes just a fresh face in charge can turn things around, even if it's just a temporary Band Aid while you find out who is available after the season. There should be some young up and coaching coaches for the front office next year. No need to rush DA out the door.

But I do agree with the idea that change to the old ways might be appropriate now. What we have going now is stale and is simply regurgitating Sean Paytons' formula back again.

However, it's too early to make a decision on whether to cut bait with DA just yet. Do you demote DA back to DC? How would the defense react to that?

We can't demote DA to DC or we would have to demote two co-DC's or have 3 DCs. He would have to go. I am generally all for promoting from within but what unit on the team is performing well to deserve a promotion? I feel like we have been disappointing in every area. Doug Marrone has been a head coach but was not very good and his oline unit is stinking it up. The defense is better but the pass rush and coverage are both having an off year. I guess they could interview everyone and see who has fresh answers.

I worry that we will not be an attractive destination to young promising outside head coaches in the offseason because we have no solution at qb, no first round pick or big cap space to get one, one of the oldest teams in the league, the highest over the salary cap, a GM on borrowed time if he is retained, etc. We could only get candidates that have no other offers. However I said before and will say again Flores is a good option. No other team will take him because it would anger King Roger but he can't be more angry at us so it would actually make it harder for him to act out against us due to more eyes and media narrative on the situation. Same reason we should lure JC Tretter out of retirement if he or McCoy could play guard. F Roger.

10-05-2022, 11:38 AM	#11
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,050	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Sex Boston Saint likes this.
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10-05-2022, 11:45 AM	#12
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Originally Posted by The Dude Sex He He He He!

10-05-2022, 12:14 PM	#13
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Originally Posted by rezburna Shane Steichen Demeco Ryans Kellen Moore Byron Leftwich Eric Bieniemy We can't get those guys mid-season. We could probably get Marv Lewis at any time. His career winning percentage is .518. Allen's is .225. He is a known commodity as a coach with a predictable .500 level coaching record who would allow us to assess whether coaching or talent is the problem on our roster starting now, not next year. We have no idea how those young coordinators would transition to head coaching, the best of them probably wouldn't take a job from us if they had any other offer, and we can't ask until January. Marv Lewis is an option now. If everyone can take Andy Dalton seriously but nobody can take Marv Lewis seriously I have to ask why? Would it have helped if Marv Lewis had been an interim coach for the Cowboys and Bears the last couple of years and was really bad? What is the difference? Is there something superficial about Dalton and Allen that some people just prefer over Winston and Lewis, where its fair to replace Winston after a few games with Dalton, but Allen deserves a full season minimum and the replacement can't be Lewis?
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10-05-2022, 12:29 PM	#14
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? I just don't get the reaction: Andy Dalton: The Red Baron, Redhead Redemption, A Real Life Viking, Awesome, Book Your Tickets For the Superbowl!!!!!!!!!! Marvin Lewis: OMG NOOOO!!!, Why Even Mention His Name, Total Loser, Who Dey, Hopeless! Why is it the twilight zone to suggest one as a replacement and totally reasonable to suggest the other? To me they are totally equivalent, most of their past track record is shared on the same sideline. Also both Allen and Lewis had Carson Palmer as their QB. Guess who won more with Palmer? Lewis is a superior coach to Allen in every possible way who would probably be available at a moments notice. Its like trading the Terrelle Pryor / Matt McGloin of head coaches for the Carson Palmer / Andy Dalton of head coaches. Neither are Sean Payton / Drew Brees but its a safe immediate upgrade.
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173

10-05-2022, 01:34 PM	#15
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Originally Posted by BakoSaint I just don't get the reaction: Andy Dalton: The Red Baron, Redhead Redemption, A Real Life Viking, Awesome, Book Your Tickets For the Superbowl!!!!!!!!!! Marvin Lewis: OMG NOOOO!!!, Why Even Mention His Name, Total Loser, Who Dey, Hopeless! Why is it the twilight zone to suggest one as a replacement and totally reasonable to suggest the other? To me they are totally equivalent, most of their past track record is shared on the same sideline. Also both Allen and Lewis had Carson Palmer as their QB. Guess who won more with Palmer? Lewis is a superior coach to Allen in every possible way who would probably be available at a moments notice. Its like trading the Terrelle Pryor / Matt McGloin of head coaches for the Carson Palmer / Andy Dalton of head coaches. Neither are Sean Payton / Drew Brees but its a safe immediate upgrade. So your solution to fixing the Saints 4 games into the season is fire Allen and bring in a 64 year old coach not connected or familiar with the system, players, or team who is a career +3 games over .500 over a 16 year career and who knows he is there as a lame duck? I’ll repeat my answer. No. iceshack149, leilung and Rugby Saint II like this.

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10-05-2022, 02:38 PM	#16
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Originally Posted by Boston Saint So your solution to fixing the Saints 4 games into the season is fire Allen and bring in a 64 year old coach not connected or familiar with the system, players, or team who is a career +3 games over .500 over a 16 year career and who knows he is there as a lame duck? I’ll repeat my answer. No. Yes. He is a viable option for an immediate in season upgrade over a coach who is a career 22 games under .500 over a 2.5 season head coaching career. Dennis Allen is proving what the numbers already said, he is Urban Meyer and Hue Jackson level. He is like if we brought in Terrelle Pryor or Matt McGloin as QB, his fellow Raider misfits. I dont understand how Marv Lewis is worse than Andy Dalton. 34 at QB is maybe worse than 64 as head coach especially for a QB who has been playing backup and losing for years. Dalton has a similar .500 type record. Dalton is likely a lake duck too but either one could stick around if they win enough. I would rather finish this year with a Jim Mora type head coach than with the least accomplished head coach in modern Saints history who can’t even be positively compared to Haslett or Ditka because they both had better results.
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173

10-05-2022, 03:48 PM	#17
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Originally Posted by BakoSaint Yes. He is a viable option for an immediate in season upgrade over a coach who is a career 22 games under .500 over a 2.5 season head coaching career. Dennis Allen is proving what the numbers already said, he is Urban Meyer and Hue Jackson level. He is like if we brought in Terrelle Pryor or Matt McGloin as QB, his fellow Raider misfits. I dont understand how Marv Lewis is worse than Andy Dalton. 34 at QB is maybe worse than 64 as head coach especially for a QB who has been playing backup and losing for years. Dalton has a similar .500 type record. Dalton is likely a lake duck too but either one could stick around if they win enough. I would rather finish this year with a Jim Mora type head coach than with the least accomplished head coach in modern Saints history who can’t even be positively compared to Haslett or Ditka because they both had better results. I honestly can’t tell if you are serious. Well played.

10-05-2022, 03:53 PM	#18
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,073	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Originally Posted by BakoSaint Yes. He is a viable option for an immediate in season upgrade over a coach who is a career 22 games under .500 over a 2.5 season head coaching career. Dennis Allen is proving what the numbers already said, he is Urban Meyer and Hue Jackson level. He is like if we brought in Terrelle Pryor or Matt McGloin as QB, his fellow Raider misfits. I dont understand how Marv Lewis is worse than Andy Dalton. 34 at QB is maybe worse than 64 as head coach especially for a QB who has been playing backup and losing for years. Dalton has a similar .500 type record. Dalton is likely a lake duck too but either one could stick around if they win enough. I would rather finish this year with a Jim Mora type head coach than with the least accomplished head coach in modern Saints history who can’t even be positively compared to Haslett or Ditka because they both had better results. If the Saints were to fire DA before the season is over I hope that the front office would promote from within to maintain continuity rather than blow the whole thing up mid season. Sometimes just a fresh face in charge can turn things around, even if it's just a temporary Band Aid while you find out who is available after the season. There should be some young up and coaching coaches for the front office next year. No need to rush DA out the door. But I do agree with the idea that change to the old ways might be appropriate now. What we have going now is stale and is simply regurgitating Sean Paytons' formula back again. However, it's too early to make a decision on whether to cut bait with DA just yet. Do you demote DA back to DC? How would the defense react to that?
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10-05-2022, 04:33 PM	#19
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Rugs has a better shot at being named Miss Louisiana than the Saints making a head coaching move midseason. Rugby Saint II likes this.

10-05-2022, 04:40 PM	#20
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173	Re: If Andy Dalton, Why Not Marv Lewis, Seriously? Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II If the Saints were to fire DA before the season is over I hope that the front office would promote from within to maintain continuity rather than blow the whole thing up mid season. Sometimes just a fresh face in charge can turn things around, even if it's just a temporary Band Aid while you find out who is available after the season. There should be some young up and coaching coaches for the front office next year. No need to rush DA out the door. But I do agree with the idea that change to the old ways might be appropriate now. What we have going now is stale and is simply regurgitating Sean Paytons' formula back again. However, it's too early to make a decision on whether to cut bait with DA just yet. Do you demote DA back to DC? How would the defense react to that? We can't demote DA to DC or we would have to demote two co-DC's or have 3 DCs. He would have to go. I am generally all for promoting from within but what unit on the team is performing well to deserve a promotion? I feel like we have been disappointing in every area. Doug Marrone has been a head coach but was not very good and his oline unit is stinking it up. The defense is better but the pass rush and coverage are both having an off year. I guess they could interview everyone and see who has fresh answers. I worry that we will not be an attractive destination to young promising outside head coaches in the offseason because we have no solution at qb, no first round pick or big cap space to get one, one of the oldest teams in the league, the highest over the salary cap, a GM on borrowed time if he is retained, etc. We could only get candidates that have no other offers. However I said before and will say again Flores is a good option. No other team will take him because it would anger King Roger but he can't be more angry at us so it would actually make it harder for him to act out against us due to more eyes and media narrative on the situation. Same reason we should lure JC Tretter out of retirement if he or McCoy could play guard. F Roger.
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