Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

Jalen Carter had a pff grade of 90 and is reguarded as one of the best rookies out of that class and had only 1.5 sacks more and one less penalty than Bresee. You made a valiant effort with your points, but I’m sticking to my opinion on this one

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

I don't think Daniels is realistic with the other moves we are making and our needs. We are already over the 2025 salary cap and moving on from Carr in 2025 would entail an about $50 million dead cap hit. We badly need oline to protect Carr or any other QB and pass rush to combine with our good secondary to make our defense work, and if we use our 1st round pick and other picks trading up to land Daniels, we can't use any of those picks on oline or pass rush this draft or even next draft.

So what would be the play here? Go into 2024 and 2025 with a QB controversy? Pay Taysom Hill $10 million to be the joker QB, Derek Carr $40 million to be the pocket QB, and spend two years of 1st round picks and more on Daniels who could be both in the future, but can't be either now unless we bench one of those highly paid guys? We would be spending more resources on the QB position than any team in the NFL while dividing those resources 3 ways and ignoring glaring weaknesses in the trenches for multiple years. And the same would likely continue in 2025 given our cap situation. Then maybe in 2026 if we made a lot of cap sacrifices we could eventually go through a 2 year rebuild to pay off the dead cap of cutting Carr and Hill in the 2026 offseasons and emerge able to start adding the oline and pass rush pieces to compete with Daniels from 2028-2029. Meanwhile if Daniels works out, we completely miss the ability to use his rookie contract years to our advantage? It makes no sense. Either rebuild and be able to purge Carr's salary at least by 2025 by not restructuring him this year (we already restructured him) or ride with Carr and take a QB with the early pick we get later if he crashes, or we lose a lot during a rebuild year after cutting him.

I don't even think Loomis or DA are seriously considering taking Daniels. What I think they are doing is PR. Keeping the fans interested. It was a rough season. The Saints were not fun to watch. LSU was. The idea of Daniels is the bread crumbs to tide fans over with excitement for a few months of the offseason while the reality of restructuring Carr, Ram, and a bunch of past their prime players with another year of DA as head coach sets in. We don't actually need to draft Daniels for speculation of a move to excite fans. It's like a celebrity dating rumor, it keeps our name in the news even if it has no basis in fact. It's free advertising for Mickey Loomis' Ford Pinto.

Meanwhile DA and Loomis may actually be thinking of trading up for a flashier oline or pass rusher to mortgage the future and win an extra game or two now to buy themselves an extra year. Another Marcus Davenport or Trevor Penning style hail mary to save their jobs. That might not be palatable to fans. But if they sell the idea of trading up with the shiny prospect of drafting fan favorite Daniels, even if its unrealistic, that will force many fans to accept the idea of the Saints trading up, and they can bait and switch the move to trade up for Daniels into trading up for their next Davenport. In reality we should stand pat and draft at our original position so that if we fail, there is an insurance policy in the form of a high 2025 draft pick so that our GM and HC job openings are actually attractive to candidates when they open up. Of course Loomis and DA would probably rather trade our future picks to make those jobs unattractive so that we will have to retain them because "who else can we get, we won't be high on anyone's list."

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

Agree to disagree. I think PFF are generally professionals and although they cannot factor in certain intangibles like how a player performs in clutch situations and the postseason, they are the best metric we have.

Carter also added two forces fumbles and a fumble recovery. Given that Carter is a heavier and more stout in stature, its not unreasonable to speculate that he may have been much better against the run, and the Saints regressed against the run this year. Meanwhile Carter also added a bit more sacks with a bit less penalties.

The Saints also played a historically easy schedule and the easiest part of the Saints schedule was the QBs, playing an incredible cast of D-list backup, lame duck, journeyman, and draft bust QBs. The particular weakness of the Saints super easy schedule was the offenses they faced, as many of their opponents had closer to average defenses. The Eagles schedule was more average all around. Bresee was essentially out there hunting minnows for his 4.5 sacks. Also, you can't sack the QB if a teammate does it first. That put Bresee in a foot race with a bunch of tortoises on our pass rush while Carter was in an olympic sprint with the Eagles defense. The folks at PFF actually watch all the plays multiple times in slow motion. They likely timed how fast Bresee actually got to the QB, and maybe they were not so impressed if he got to Tommy Devito in 10 seconds or got Baker Mayfield to hold the ball a little too long. Actually 4 of Bresee's 4.5 sacks were against Devito and Mayfield who earned a combined $5 million salary. You just can't judge an entire rookie season 5 plays and break out the anointing oil. To me, I have high hopes for Bresee, I see the potential, but the jury is still out. 4.5 sacks and a 45 PFF is not the second coming of Warren Sapp just yet.

When guys like Kamara and Lattimore tore it up with crazy PFF numbers their rookie year we believed it. We should not pick and choose and dismiss PFF when we don't like the number. Especially for a position like DT that does not rely on anyone throwing the the ball or blocking for them and is in a position to make their own luck by beating their man. Carter consistently beat his man. Bresee sacked Devito twice and Mayfield twice and stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

Haters gonna hate.

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

You’re really splitting hairs here, but good news is theres something we both found common ground on, and that’s agree to disagree

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

Rd 1, Saints pick #14.

Olumuyiwa Fashanu, OL

Penn State

Hadn't allowed a sack in his 3-year college career and is only 21. We really need someone to solidify the tackle position for the next 7-10 years.
He's athletic (over 6'6" tall) & has superior pass protection qualities.

All Big 10, All Big Ten Academic

Maybe Kubiak moves Trevor Penning inside to guard?

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

I actually had that same thought about moving Penning to G. I wonder if he can thrive there

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

Re: Official 2024 Saints Draft Discussion
 

I think it's safe to say Turner is a top 10 talent who could fall especially if there's a run on QBs. I don't think anyone expects him to be there at 14 so yeah, it make sense we'd have to trade.

I'd hate to lose Lattimore but again, it depends on the return.

Imagine if we land another pick in the top 75 for Lattimore.