IS MIKE VICK A COACH KILLER????????????

blacksaint · 01-06-2007, 12:15 AM

I for one don't like where this thought process is going. Vick is not a great QB, but give me a break, you mean to tell me that Vick is not a better QB than some of the QB's in the league right now. I mean, you don't think Minnesota, Oakland, Detroit, Cleveland, and a few other teams at lest wouldn't mind Vick as their QB. As far as Kordell goes, when the Steelers played a certain style of football they was successful, when they started listening to suggestions and criticism from the media, and change their style they started losing. Like Vick, Kordell had to go through several offensive coaching styles and techniqes. Vick can be compared to a lot of QB's other than Stewart, and Brooks. Vick didn't have that bad of a year, 10th in td's with 20, 13 int's, 20th in passer rating with 75.7, belive it or not, he did better than a few QB's experts thought where tops in the league, for instance, Rothlisberger, Brunell, Warner, and a bunch of other's, Steve Young was trash in the early part of his career. So, i won't say he's not a QB just yet, just not a great one. I think the Falcons front office is as much to blame as Vick for Atlanta's problems.

Bobaganoosh · 01-06-2007, 02:33 AM

I think that was a weak arguement blacksaint. I dont think he is the worst QB in the league, but there is no way you can tell me that he is earning his paycheck. He is the 2nd highest paid QB in the league. With that comes expectations, and being ranked 20th in passer rating isnt going to cut it. Of course he is better than Charlie Frye, Brad Johnson, Cleo Lemon, Andrew Walter, Bruce Gradkowski and maybe a handful of other guys, but they arent expected to be great and they arent being paid to be great. Not only are Vick's passing numbers below average, his team isnt winning. I would take probably 15 other QB's before Vick and he is supposed to be better than that. Plain and simple, unless something changes, he is going to win between 7 and 9 games a year and fail to live up to his contract or his expectations.

SaintPauly · 01-06-2007, 08:51 AM

Steve Young was a pocket passer first, and a runner second. Vick is the other way around. He was the same way at VT, and he hasn't changed one bit. He is fast, and he is athletic, and you are right, he is in the top 25 qb's in the league right now. The bottom end of that 25. Let's face it, there aren't alot of "great" QBs in the league either.

He is overpaid, overhyped, and overdue, for some extreme criticism. He has had his butt kissed since he became a pro, and with the exception of one trip to the NFC championship, hasn't shown much else. McNabb is a ten times better QB than Vick, and has the stats, as well as the wins, to prove it, but still Vick gets all of the attention.

Michael Vick is the second coming of Kordell Stewart. I said it when he came into the league, and I haven't changed my mind about it. He will be a Falcon, for about two more years, and then, just like Culpepper, who is also a bust, he will be traded, and eventually, forgotten. IMO.

SapperSaint · 01-06-2007, 09:06 AM

AMEN!

RDOX · 01-06-2007, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by kurtrus

Brooks and Vick have similarities. They have both killed their coaches. They both have athleticism that people mistake for superior QB skills. They both openly critisize their team instead of show quiet, focused leadership. They both have this thing called potential that is always prefaced with "if" and "but" and never quite realized. They both have phenomenal moments and sometimes complete games but can't quite parlay that into consistency. They both will end their careers with the label "mediocre".

You forgot one other coach killer in Randy (run over da cops to hide da dope) Moss. When you add Vick, Fumbles, and Moss up and shake the bag, all you get coming out is a small amount of Reggie Bush's pubic hair. All three of these dweebs represent almost everything about what is seriously wrong with the NFL. Guys like Baby Mora, Mike Tice, and Art Shell were decent, class guys until faced with these stooges. I forgot one other, but he (it) is a class of his (its) own: Terrell Owens.

The day that we got rid of Fumbles (stats and all) was a day that the Saint's organization began to ascend.

blacksaint · 01-06-2007, 11:47 PM

Originally Posted by saintpaul25

Steve Young was a pocket passer first, and a runner second. Vick is the other way around. He was the same way at VT, and he hasn't changed one bit. He is fast, and he is athletic, and you are right, he is in the top 25 qb's in the league right now. The bottom end of that 25. Let's face it, there aren't alot of "great" QBs in the league either.

He is overpaid, overhyped, and overdue, for some extreme criticism. He has had his butt kissed since he became a pro, and with the exception of one trip to the NFC championship, hasn't shown much else. McNabb is a ten times better QB than Vick, and has the stats, as well as the wins, to prove it, but still Vick gets all of the attention.

Michael Vick is the second coming of Kordell Stewart. I said it when he came into the league, and I haven't changed my mind about it. He will be a Falcon, for about two more years, and then, just like Culpepper, who is also a bust, he will be traded, and eventually, forgotten. IMO.

Look you guys are missing the point. I just said I'm not ready to say that he's not a QB, you have to be some type of QB to throw for 20 tds in this league. As for being over paid, i thought that the minute they gave him that contract "ridiculous". And as fas as being over hyped, of course he is, but that can go for a hell of a lot of players in this league. And please, you must have forgotten about Steve Young earlier years, he would run out of the pocket before he even set his feet. Young didn't start being a great QB until he ***** and whined his way into the starting lineup and pave the way for the great Joe Montana to leave and go to K.C. And he still wasn't great until another great Jerry Rice pulled him to the side and told him to stay in pocket and throw the DAM ball to the receivers. Last time i checked Vick, Steward, and everybody else that was mentioned didn't have the weapons that Young had, and he still had to be told by the players to stay in the pocket and go through his progressions.

01-06-2007, 12:15 AM	#21
blacksaint DARE TO ENTER Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Home Sweet Home, NEW ORLEANS, La. Posts: 1,154	I for one don't like where this thought process is going. Vick is not a great QB, but give me a break, you mean to tell me that Vick is not a better QB than some of the QB's in the league right now. I mean, you don't think Minnesota, Oakland, Detroit, Cleveland, and a few other teams at lest wouldn't mind Vick as their QB. As far as Kordell goes, when the Steelers played a certain style of football they was successful, when they started listening to suggestions and criticism from the media, and change their style they started losing. Like Vick, Kordell had to go through several offensive coaching styles and techniqes. Vick can be compared to a lot of QB's other than Stewart, and Brooks. Vick didn't have that bad of a year, 10th in td's with 20, 13 int's, 20th in passer rating with 75.7, belive it or not, he did better than a few QB's experts thought where tops in the league, for instance, Rothlisberger, Brunell, Warner, and a bunch of other's, Steve Young was trash in the early part of his career. So, i won't say he's not a QB just yet, just not a great one. I think the Falcons front office is as much to blame as Vick for Atlanta's problems.
	saint4life (504)

01-06-2007, 02:33 AM	#22
Bobaganoosh PorkchopExpress Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 608 Blog Entries: 2	I think that was a weak arguement blacksaint. I dont think he is the worst QB in the league, but there is no way you can tell me that he is earning his paycheck. He is the 2nd highest paid QB in the league. With that comes expectations, and being ranked 20th in passer rating isnt going to cut it. Of course he is better than Charlie Frye, Brad Johnson, Cleo Lemon, Andrew Walter, Bruce Gradkowski and maybe a handful of other guys, but they arent expected to be great and they arent being paid to be great. Not only are Vick's passing numbers below average, his team isnt winning. I would take probably 15 other QB's before Vick and he is supposed to be better than that. Plain and simple, unless something changes, he is going to win between 7 and 9 games a year and fail to live up to his contract or his expectations.
	It's all in the reflexes.

01-06-2007, 05:58 PM	#25
RDOX 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 264	Originally Posted by kurtrus Brooks and Vick have similarities. They have both killed their coaches. They both have athleticism that people mistake for superior QB skills. They both openly critisize their team instead of show quiet, focused leadership. They both have this thing called potential that is always prefaced with "if" and "but" and never quite realized. They both have phenomenal moments and sometimes complete games but can't quite parlay that into consistency. They both will end their careers with the label "mediocre". You forgot one other coach killer in Randy (run over da cops to hide da dope) Moss. When you add Vick, Fumbles, and Moss up and shake the bag, all you get coming out is a small amount of Reggie Bush's pubic hair. All three of these dweebs represent almost everything about what is seriously wrong with the NFL. Guys like Baby Mora, Mike Tice, and Art Shell were decent, class guys until faced with these stooges. I forgot one other, but he (it) is a class of his (its) own: Terrell Owens. The day that we got rid of Fumbles (stats and all) was a day that the Saint's organization began to ascend.
RDOX 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 264

01-06-2007, 11:47 PM	#26
blacksaint DARE TO ENTER Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Home Sweet Home, NEW ORLEANS, La. Posts: 1,154	Originally Posted by saintpaul25 Steve Young was a pocket passer first, and a runner second. Vick is the other way around. He was the same way at VT, and he hasn't changed one bit. He is fast, and he is athletic, and you are right, he is in the top 25 qb's in the league right now. The bottom end of that 25. Let's face it, there aren't alot of "great" QBs in the league either. He is overpaid, overhyped, and overdue, for some extreme criticism. He has had his butt kissed since he became a pro, and with the exception of one trip to the NFC championship, hasn't shown much else. McNabb is a ten times better QB than Vick, and has the stats, as well as the wins, to prove it, but still Vick gets all of the attention. Michael Vick is the second coming of Kordell Stewart. I said it when he came into the league, and I haven't changed my mind about it. He will be a Falcon, for about two more years, and then, just like Culpepper, who is also a bust, he will be traded, and eventually, forgotten. IMO. Look you guys are missing the point. I just said I'm not ready to say that he's not a QB, you have to be some type of QB to throw for 20 tds in this league. As for being over paid, i thought that the minute they gave him that contract "ridiculous". And as fas as being over hyped, of course he is, but that can go for a hell of a lot of players in this league. And please, you must have forgotten about Steve Young earlier years, he would run out of the pocket before he even set his feet. Young didn't start being a great QB until he ***** and whined his way into the starting lineup and pave the way for the great Joe Montana to leave and go to K.C. And he still wasn't great until another great Jerry Rice pulled him to the side and told him to stay in pocket and throw the DAM ball to the receivers. Last time i checked Vick, Steward, and everybody else that was mentioned didn't have the weapons that Young had, and he still had to be told by the players to stay in the pocket and go through his progressions.
	saint4life (504)

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01-06-2007, 08:51 AM	#23
SaintPauly Senior Citizen Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Gulfport, MS Posts: 3,180 Blog Entries: 1	Steve Young was a pocket passer first, and a runner second. Vick is the other way around. He was the same way at VT, and he hasn't changed one bit. He is fast, and he is athletic, and you are right, he is in the top 25 qb's in the league right now. The bottom end of that 25. Let's face it, there aren't alot of "great" QBs in the league either. He is overpaid, overhyped, and overdue, for some extreme criticism. He has had his butt kissed since he became a pro, and with the exception of one trip to the NFC championship, hasn't shown much else. McNabb is a ten times better QB than Vick, and has the stats, as well as the wins, to prove it, but still Vick gets all of the attention. Michael Vick is the second coming of Kordell Stewart. I said it when he came into the league, and I haven't changed my mind about it. He will be a Falcon, for about two more years, and then, just like Culpepper, who is also a bust, he will be traded, and eventually, forgotten. IMO.

01-06-2007, 09:06 AM	#24
SapperSaint Pink Nightmare Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 3,028 Blog Entries: 7	AMEN!