Haz on Tebucky..........

WhoDat · 07-18-2003, 12:59 PM

See, now I am confused. Two years ago Sammy Knight went to the Pro Bowl. Thus, it stands to reason that he was one of the top five safeties at his position in the league. Last year he had MORE tackles and one less INT (I think). Was the defense worse? Yes, and that affected his play as well. It\'s a domino effect that starts as a ripple up front and ends up a tital wave by the time you get to the safety.

So, what happened last year? B/c from what I\'m seeing, Sammy\'s play didn\'t drop off all that much last year from the previous year (one in which he went to the Pro Bowl). So did 20 other safeties get that much better? How did he go from top five to below 20 with no real drop off in play?

BillyCarpenter1 · 07-18-2003, 01:17 PM

See, now I am confused. Two years ago Sammy Knight went to the Pro Bowl. Thus, it stands to reason that he was one of the top five safeties at his position in the league. Last year he had MORE tackles and one less INT (I think). Was the defense worse? Yes, and that affected his play as well. It\'s a domino effect that starts as a ripple up front and ends up a tital wave by the time you get to the safety.

So, what happened last year? B/c from what I\'m seeing, Sammy\'s play didn\'t drop off all that much last year from the previous year (one in which he went to the Pro Bowl). So did 20 other safeties get that much better? How did he go from top five to below 20 with no real drop off in play?

It\'s easy to see when a safety makes an interception or a tackle. What is not easy to see is when a safety wasn\'t in position to help out on a pass play and you think that it\'s all a cornerback\'s fault. How many passes went for completions because Knight wasn\'t fast enough to get there? What\'s more benificial, to make 6ints per year or to stop 5 or 6 completions per game?

Tebucky might need to improve in some areas and has the ability to do that. Sammy needs to be faster and that is an impossible task.

coastalkid · 07-18-2003, 01:38 PM

Bellamey or Knight really doesn\'t matter Tebuckey is still an upgrade from either. But you are correct in saying that Tebuckey replaces Bellamey and Mel is slated to replace Knight. Bellamey is still on the team for now as a back up. Tebuckey has the speed and talent to roam freely in the secondary. Mel has the mean streak to intimidate any receiver with his passion for hard hits. Bottom line is with the changes made to BOTH safety positions we have improved dramatically from last years squad. Maybe Knights stats didn\'t drop off that much but I can\'t count the times I saw a receiver open in the end zone catching a td pass and THEN seeing Knight close up on him....just too slow to get there!

WhoDat · 07-18-2003, 04:21 PM

So how many times was Knight out of position last season? All these experts on this board talk about how out of position Knight was. Name a time please. And who is to say that was Knight\'s fault? Could it have been the system, at least in part? Could it be that he was forced on almost every play to choose between stepping up and supporting our piss-poor DTs and LBs against the run versus dropping back into coverage?

I simply don\'t understand how for years Knight was considered a model player, a leader on this defense, a guy we wished we had more of, a hard worker, a playmaker, and a Pro Bowler. Then, we have one season in which the ENTIRE defense sucks - Knight is one of three guys whose numbers don\'t disappoint (Grant and Howard are those other two by the way and we all seem to love them... ), yet all of a sudden he is one of the major problems on our defense.

Pardon my french, but bullsh*t!! Knight will be a stud again this season. With the front 7 he\'ll have in Miami he\'ll be able to go back to doing what he does best... head hunting and ball hawking... and you know what? He\'ll be very very good at it.

BillyCarpenter1 · 07-18-2003, 04:43 PM

WhoDat,

Sammy Knight\'s main asset was being in the right time at the right place. He was an opportunistic player. He was very good at it or else he wouldn\'t have made the probowl.

Like I said it\'s hard to tell how many times Knight was out of position but one would think that the coaches know and that\'s the reason he\'s not a Saint anymore.

WhoDat · 07-18-2003, 05:20 PM

The Saints also said that La\'Roi Glover couldn\'t cut it and that we needed to get bigger at DT. That plan worked out great right?

My point above is that coaches aren\'t always right. Clemons, who is a very good OLB, and Sammy Knight, who is a very good SS, are scapegoats right now. I do think the Tebucky trade was a good move for the Saints. I also think giving Mitchell a shot is the right thing to do. However, that doesn\'t mean that Knight is all of a sudden a bum. He\'ll be back in the top five or ten in the league this year in Miami.

I just want to make sure that the guy gets the credit he deserves. He was with NO for what? 6 years? Have we had a more solid performer year in year out on defense over that time? Respect the guy and be thankful for what he did for this team. Jones and Mitchell should be an upgrade, but Knight is no slouch.

[Edited on 18/7/2003 by WhoDat]

BillyCarpenter1 · 07-18-2003, 05:25 PM

I agree with that Whodat.

All I know is the pre-season is almost here and I\'m ready to see how this defense is going to do. If you have the defense-well, you get the picture..................

[Edited on 18/7/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]

WhoDat · 07-18-2003, 05:28 PM

Stop the presses! We agree... oh, I see why it happened. That last post was your 666th post. The devil has you... that\'s why we agree.

tweeky · 07-18-2003, 07:22 PM

Could it be that he was forced on almost every play to choose between stepping up and supporting our piss-poor DTs and LBs against the run versus dropping back into coverage?
Pardon my french, but bullsh*t!! Knight will be a stud again this season. With the front 7 he\'ll have in Miami he\'ll be able to go back to doing what he does best... head hunting and ball hawking... and you know what? He\'ll be very very good at it.

Who Dat. you nailed it! If we had Tampa\'s or Miami\'s front seven, Knight would still be here. He\'ll do good in Miami because their front seven won\'t give their opponents time to expose his weaknesses.
We don\'t have that kind of front 7 so Knight just didn\'t fit in with our 2003 plans. Other teams would have the extra 2 seconds needed for a WR to take advantage of Knights lack of speed. His lightning quick mental game will fit in well with Miami though.

I wish him well, like I\'ve always said... If every Saint had his Heart and Head, we\'d be defending our 3-peat this year.

BillyCarpenter1 · 07-18-2003, 07:25 PM

Who Dat. you nailed it! If we had Tampa\'s or Miami\'s front seven, Knight would still be here. He\'ll do good in Miami because their front seven won\'t give their opponents time to expose his weaknesses.

LOL..........Excellent, Excellent....keep it coming......

07-18-2003, 12:59 PM	#21
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Haz on Tebucky.......... See, now I am confused. Two years ago Sammy Knight went to the Pro Bowl. Thus, it stands to reason that he was one of the top five safeties at his position in the league. Last year he had MORE tackles and one less INT (I think). Was the defense worse? Yes, and that affected his play as well. It\'s a domino effect that starts as a ripple up front and ends up a tital wave by the time you get to the safety. So, what happened last year? B/c from what I\'m seeing, Sammy\'s play didn\'t drop off all that much last year from the previous year (one in which he went to the Pro Bowl). So did 20 other safeties get that much better? How did he go from top five to below 20 with no real drop off in play?
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

07-18-2003, 01:17 PM	#22
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Haz on Tebucky.......... See, now I am confused. Two years ago Sammy Knight went to the Pro Bowl. Thus, it stands to reason that he was one of the top five safeties at his position in the league. Last year he had MORE tackles and one less INT (I think). Was the defense worse? Yes, and that affected his play as well. It\'s a domino effect that starts as a ripple up front and ends up a tital wave by the time you get to the safety. So, what happened last year? B/c from what I\'m seeing, Sammy\'s play didn\'t drop off all that much last year from the previous year (one in which he went to the Pro Bowl). So did 20 other safeties get that much better? How did he go from top five to below 20 with no real drop off in play? It\'s easy to see when a safety makes an interception or a tackle. What is not easy to see is when a safety wasn\'t in position to help out on a pass play and you think that it\'s all a cornerback\'s fault. How many passes went for completions because Knight wasn\'t fast enough to get there? What\'s more benificial, to make 6ints per year or to stop 5 or 6 completions per game? Tebucky might need to improve in some areas and has the ability to do that. Sammy needs to be faster and that is an impossible task.
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

07-18-2003, 01:38 PM	#23
coastalkid 100th Post Join Date: May 2003 Location: Spain Posts: 287	Haz on Tebucky.......... Bellamey or Knight really doesn\'t matter Tebuckey is still an upgrade from either. But you are correct in saying that Tebuckey replaces Bellamey and Mel is slated to replace Knight. Bellamey is still on the team for now as a back up. Tebuckey has the speed and talent to roam freely in the secondary. Mel has the mean streak to intimidate any receiver with his passion for hard hits. Bottom line is with the changes made to BOTH safety positions we have improved dramatically from last years squad. Maybe Knights stats didn\'t drop off that much but I can\'t count the times I saw a receiver open in the end zone catching a td pass and THEN seeing Knight close up on him....just too slow to get there!

07-18-2003, 04:21 PM	#24
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Haz on Tebucky.......... So how many times was Knight out of position last season? All these experts on this board talk about how out of position Knight was. Name a time please. And who is to say that was Knight\'s fault? Could it have been the system, at least in part? Could it be that he was forced on almost every play to choose between stepping up and supporting our piss-poor DTs and LBs against the run versus dropping back into coverage? I simply don\'t understand how for years Knight was considered a model player, a leader on this defense, a guy we wished we had more of, a hard worker, a playmaker, and a Pro Bowler. Then, we have one season in which the ENTIRE defense sucks - Knight is one of three guys whose numbers don\'t disappoint (Grant and Howard are those other two by the way and we all seem to love them... ), yet all of a sudden he is one of the major problems on our defense. Pardon my french, but bullsh*t!! Knight will be a stud again this season. With the front 7 he\'ll have in Miami he\'ll be able to go back to doing what he does best... head hunting and ball hawking... and you know what? He\'ll be very very good at it.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

07-18-2003, 04:43 PM	#25
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Haz on Tebucky.......... WhoDat, Sammy Knight\'s main asset was being in the right time at the right place. He was an opportunistic player. He was very good at it or else he wouldn\'t have made the probowl. Like I said it\'s hard to tell how many times Knight was out of position but one would think that the coaches know and that\'s the reason he\'s not a Saint anymore.
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

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07-18-2003, 05:20 PM	#26
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Haz on Tebucky.......... The Saints also said that La\'Roi Glover couldn\'t cut it and that we needed to get bigger at DT. That plan worked out great right? My point above is that coaches aren\'t always right. Clemons, who is a very good OLB, and Sammy Knight, who is a very good SS, are scapegoats right now. I do think the Tebucky trade was a good move for the Saints. I also think giving Mitchell a shot is the right thing to do. However, that doesn\'t mean that Knight is all of a sudden a bum. He\'ll be back in the top five or ten in the league this year in Miami. I just want to make sure that the guy gets the credit he deserves. He was with NO for what? 6 years? Have we had a more solid performer year in year out on defense over that time? Respect the guy and be thankful for what he did for this team. Jones and Mitchell should be an upgrade, but Knight is no slouch. [Edited on 18/7/2003 by WhoDat]
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

07-18-2003, 05:25 PM	#27
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Haz on Tebucky.......... I agree with that Whodat. All I know is the pre-season is almost here and I\'m ready to see how this defense is going to do. If you have the defense-well, you get the picture.................. [Edited on 18/7/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

07-18-2003, 05:28 PM	#28
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Haz on Tebucky.......... Stop the presses! We agree... oh, I see why it happened. That last post was your 666th post. The devil has you... that\'s why we agree.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631

07-18-2003, 07:22 PM	#29
tweeky 500th Post Join Date: May 2003 Location: South Alabama Posts: 779	Haz on Tebucky.......... Could it be that he was forced on almost every play to choose between stepping up and supporting our piss-poor DTs and LBs against the run versus dropping back into coverage? Pardon my french, but bullsh*t!! Knight will be a stud again this season. With the front 7 he\'ll have in Miami he\'ll be able to go back to doing what he does best... head hunting and ball hawking... and you know what? He\'ll be very very good at it. Who Dat. you nailed it! If we had Tampa\'s or Miami\'s front seven, Knight would still be here. He\'ll do good in Miami because their front seven won\'t give their opponents time to expose his weaknesses. We don\'t have that kind of front 7 so Knight just didn\'t fit in with our 2003 plans. Other teams would have the extra 2 seconds needed for a WR to take advantage of Knights lack of speed. His lightning quick mental game will fit in well with Miami though. I wish him well, like I\'ve always said... If every Saint had his Heart and Head, we\'d be defending our 3-peat this year.
	Whether we agree or disagree; its all for Him.

07-18-2003, 07:25 PM	#30
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Haz on Tebucky.......... Who Dat. you nailed it! If we had Tampa\'s or Miami\'s front seven, Knight would still be here. He\'ll do good in Miami because their front seven won\'t give their opponents time to expose his weaknesses. LOL..........Excellent, Excellent....keep it coming......
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209