Fans Blindness and our Defense.

WhoDatQB · 10-22-2007, 03:43 PM

Well, I must say that game was not pretty, but a win is a win and I am happy and pulling for the Saints like crazy.

First off there are some issues I must bring up.

1. Euphoria is not a crazy man.

2. A good CB or LB will do you no good without a good D line.

The position of CB is a REACTION position. You react to the offensive players actions, whether the offensive player isthe QB(zone) or WR (M2M). NO corner can hold up for as long as some QB's are getting to pass on us. With our current defensive line you could have CHamp Bailey in the backfield in his prime and imbue him with ESP and he would get beat if no pressure is put on the QB. Good DT's which get pressure and help the DE's get pressure will make Fred look like an above average CB and McKenzie look like a pro bowler.

The position of DE is reliant on the DT's for almost all pass plays. Most DE's either speed or bull rush. When your DT's do not get any push beyond the line of scrimmage all a QB has to do is step up to avoid the rush of the DE's from the outside and deliver the ball. Good DT's give your DE's pro bowl years.

A great LB is virtually ineffective if the DT's cannot occupy blocks, look at Urlacher this year. He is a great LB, but with his DT's either hurt, fired or not playing well he has become pedestrian. Look how they have been run on this year. It happens everywhere when a "great" LB looses his guys upfront. Good DT's will make Simoneau look like a pro bowler.

Some talk about how "great" our Run defense has become this year. Well teams see that our DT's cannot get movement towards the QB and they throw on us. Plain and simple. We are playing the run better, but the idea is to get movement towards the QB AND mind your gaps. Our DT's cannot do it. Hollis is good, but does not have that motor you need, Young has the motor but not the talent.

Great DT's make your LB, CB, and DE's look good. I will take two great DT's over and above any position on defense everytime.

papz · 10-22-2007, 04:45 PM

Uhh... I don't see how any of what you just said can equate to us fans being blind... blind to what? Blind to the fact our offensive line and defensive line has played better in each of the past 3 weeks? No one has denied it hasn't been a problem the first 3 weeks. Some people are having a problem acknowledging we are getting better.

xan · 10-22-2007, 05:22 PM

Jason Craft and Fred Thomas were born with swivels where their heads should be. No matter what a D line does, if the corner gets his jock juked around his ankles on every play, the defense will get smeared every time.

iceshack149 · 10-22-2007, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by WhoDatQB

Well, I must say that game was not pretty, but a win is a win and I am happy and pulling for the Saints like crazy.

First off there are some issues I must bring up.

1. Euphoria is not a crazy man.

2. A good CB or LB will do you no good without a good D line.

The position of CB is a REACTION position. You react to the offensive players actions, whether the offensive player isthe QB(zone) or WR (M2M). NO corner can hold up for as long as some QB's are getting to pass on us. With our current defensive line you could have CHamp Bailey in the backfield in his prime and imbue him with ESP and he would get beat if no pressure is put on the QB. Good DT's which get pressure and help the DE's get pressure will make Fred look like an above average CB and McKenzie look like a pro bowler.

The position of DE is reliant on the DT's for almost all pass plays. Most DE's either speed or bull rush. When your DT's do not get any push beyond the line of scrimmage all a QB has to do is step up to avoid the rush of the DE's from the outside and deliver the ball. Good DT's give your DE's pro bowl years.

A great LB is virtually ineffective if the DT's cannot occupy blocks, look at Urlacher this year. He is a great LB, but with his DT's either hurt, fired or not playing well he has become pedestrian. Look how they have been run on this year. It happens everywhere when a "great" LB looses his guys upfront. Good DT's will make Simoneau look like a pro bowler.

Some talk about how "great" our Run defense has become this year. Well teams see that our DT's cannot get movement towards the QB and they throw on us. Plain and simple. We are playing the run better, but the idea is to get movement towards the QB AND mind your gaps. Our DT's cannot do it. Hollis is good, but does not have that motor you need, Young has the motor but not the talent.

Great DT's make your LB, CB, and DE's look good. I will take two great DT's over and above any position on defense everytime.

No has ever stated that Euphoria was crazy. I don't think that he's even disliked.

Your statements are pretty much how we all feel. I am comfortable with the defensive line. O.K., so it's not great. Not many teams have great d-lines. I do expect more from the the end position and know that the tackles are underwhelming.
All that said, we have one good linebacker, one good corner and two safeties that are playing really well right now.

Most of us are not blind. So I guess that maybe you're blind to think that we are.

WhoDatQB · 10-22-2007, 09:20 PM

Originally Posted by iceshack149

No has ever stated that Euphoria was crazy. I don't think that he's even disliked.

Your statements are pretty much how we all feel. I am comfortable with the defensive line. O.K., so it's not great. Not many teams have great d-lines. I do expect more from the the end position and know that the tackles are underwhelming.
All that said, we have one good linebacker, one good corner and two safeties that are playing really well right now.

Most of us are not blind. So I guess that maybe you're blind to think that we are.

===================

No what I am saying is we have people left and right calling out that all we need is a good CB and good LB. People are BLIND to the fact that a great CB is not going to help with how our DT's are not getting the push consistently to help out the DE's. Every time someone calls out for a CB or a LB in the draft it shows out that they are not watching the game carefully enough and just see what they want.

Without pressure the best CB in the league will get beat every time. Without good DT's LB's will get blocked by offensive linemen and no matter how good a LB you are you are not going to consistently shed a block by an offensive lineman.

I would like a good CB or good LB too, but a great D line will solve more problems with fewer people than a CB or LB will.

Basically I am saying we have gotten better but rather than trying for the quick fix and adding a LB or CB that can play well when our D line has a good game we could get a good DT that will help both of those positions. Saying we need a CB or LB is just what I said, BLINDNESS.

papz · 10-22-2007, 09:31 PM

I'm pretty sure we can all agree to that... it's only logical.

10-22-2007, 03:43 PM	#1
WhoDatQB Boondock Saint Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: F***ing Atlanta Posts: 322	Fans Blindness and our Defense. Well, I must say that game was not pretty, but a win is a win and I am happy and pulling for the Saints like crazy. First off there are some issues I must bring up. 1. Euphoria is not a crazy man. 2. A good CB or LB will do you no good without a good D line. The position of CB is a REACTION position. You react to the offensive players actions, whether the offensive player isthe QB(zone) or WR (M2M). NO corner can hold up for as long as some QB's are getting to pass on us. With our current defensive line you could have CHamp Bailey in the backfield in his prime and imbue him with ESP and he would get beat if no pressure is put on the QB. Good DT's which get pressure and help the DE's get pressure will make Fred look like an above average CB and McKenzie look like a pro bowler. The position of DE is reliant on the DT's for almost all pass plays. Most DE's either speed or bull rush. When your DT's do not get any push beyond the line of scrimmage all a QB has to do is step up to avoid the rush of the DE's from the outside and deliver the ball. Good DT's give your DE's pro bowl years. A great LB is virtually ineffective if the DT's cannot occupy blocks, look at Urlacher this year. He is a great LB, but with his DT's either hurt, fired or not playing well he has become pedestrian. Look how they have been run on this year. It happens everywhere when a "great" LB looses his guys upfront. Good DT's will make Simoneau look like a pro bowler. Some talk about how "great" our Run defense has become this year. Well teams see that our DT's cannot get movement towards the QB and they throw on us. Plain and simple. We are playing the run better, but the idea is to get movement towards the QB AND mind your gaps. Our DT's cannot do it. Hollis is good, but does not have that motor you need, Young has the motor but not the talent. Great DT's make your LB, CB, and DE's look good. I will take two great DT's over and above any position on defense everytime.

10-22-2007, 04:45 PM	#2
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,744	Re: Fans Blindness and our Defense. Uhh... I don't see how any of what you just said can equate to us fans being blind... blind to what? Blind to the fact our offensive line and defensive line has played better in each of the past 3 weeks? No one has denied it hasn't been a problem the first 3 weeks. Some people are having a problem acknowledging we are getting better.

10-22-2007, 05:22 PM	#3
xan Professor Crab and Site Donor 2014 Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Princeton Posts: 3,369 Blog Entries: 34	Re: Fans Blindness and our Defense. Jason Craft and Fred Thomas were born with swivels where their heads should be. No matter what a D line does, if the corner gets his jock juked around his ankles on every play, the defense will get smeared every time.

10-22-2007, 06:09 PM	#4
iceshack149 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fairbanks, AK Posts: 4,258 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Fans Blindness and our Defense. Originally Posted by WhoDatQB Well, I must say that game was not pretty, but a win is a win and I am happy and pulling for the Saints like crazy. First off there are some issues I must bring up. 1. Euphoria is not a crazy man. 2. A good CB or LB will do you no good without a good D line. The position of CB is a REACTION position. You react to the offensive players actions, whether the offensive player isthe QB(zone) or WR (M2M). NO corner can hold up for as long as some QB's are getting to pass on us. With our current defensive line you could have CHamp Bailey in the backfield in his prime and imbue him with ESP and he would get beat if no pressure is put on the QB. Good DT's which get pressure and help the DE's get pressure will make Fred look like an above average CB and McKenzie look like a pro bowler. The position of DE is reliant on the DT's for almost all pass plays. Most DE's either speed or bull rush. When your DT's do not get any push beyond the line of scrimmage all a QB has to do is step up to avoid the rush of the DE's from the outside and deliver the ball. Good DT's give your DE's pro bowl years. A great LB is virtually ineffective if the DT's cannot occupy blocks, look at Urlacher this year. He is a great LB, but with his DT's either hurt, fired or not playing well he has become pedestrian. Look how they have been run on this year. It happens everywhere when a "great" LB looses his guys upfront. Good DT's will make Simoneau look like a pro bowler. Some talk about how "great" our Run defense has become this year. Well teams see that our DT's cannot get movement towards the QB and they throw on us. Plain and simple. We are playing the run better, but the idea is to get movement towards the QB AND mind your gaps. Our DT's cannot do it. Hollis is good, but does not have that motor you need, Young has the motor but not the talent. Great DT's make your LB, CB, and DE's look good. I will take two great DT's over and above any position on defense everytime. No has ever stated that Euphoria was crazy. I don't think that he's even disliked. Your statements are pretty much how we all feel. I am comfortable with the defensive line. O.K., so it's not great. Not many teams have great d-lines. I do expect more from the the end position and know that the tackles are underwhelming. All that said, we have one good linebacker, one good corner and two safeties that are playing really well right now. Most of us are not blind. So I guess that maybe you're blind to think that we are.
	"...it's good to have friends, no matter where they are."--JOESAM2002

10-22-2007, 09:20 PM	#5
WhoDatQB Boondock Saint Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: F***ing Atlanta Posts: 322	Re: Fans Blindness and our Defense. Originally Posted by iceshack149 No has ever stated that Euphoria was crazy. I don't think that he's even disliked. Your statements are pretty much how we all feel. I am comfortable with the defensive line. O.K., so it's not great. Not many teams have great d-lines. I do expect more from the the end position and know that the tackles are underwhelming. All that said, we have one good linebacker, one good corner and two safeties that are playing really well right now. Most of us are not blind. So I guess that maybe you're blind to think that we are. =================== No what I am saying is we have people left and right calling out that all we need is a good CB and good LB. People are BLIND to the fact that a great CB is not going to help with how our DT's are not getting the push consistently to help out the DE's. Every time someone calls out for a CB or a LB in the draft it shows out that they are not watching the game carefully enough and just see what they want. Without pressure the best CB in the league will get beat every time. Without good DT's LB's will get blocked by offensive linemen and no matter how good a LB you are you are not going to consistently shed a block by an offensive lineman. I would like a good CB or good LB too, but a great D line will solve more problems with fewer people than a CB or LB will. Basically I am saying we have gotten better but rather than trying for the quick fix and adding a LB or CB that can play well when our D line has a good game we could get a good DT that will help both of those positions. Saying we need a CB or LB is just what I said, BLINDNESS.

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10-22-2007, 09:31 PM	#6
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,744	Re: Fans Blindness and our Defense. I'm pretty sure we can all agree to that... it's only logical.