Looking for a new head coach?

BoudinSandwich · 12-31-2007, 05:10 PM

I've had my hand in some SP bashing, especially on this site. That said, the man deserves another year, atleast.

I still want him as our coach, no matter how much bad things I've said about him. I think he's great - just someone needs to slap his hands and tell him "No!" when he gets too excited.

hagan714 · 12-31-2007, 05:51 PM

Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled?

Euphoria · 12-31-2007, 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by hagan714

Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled?

Yes FICKLED. After next season then sure FIRE away.

LongTimeFan · 12-31-2007, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by hagan714

Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled?

I have a friend who says he's a big LSU fan, when we lost to Kentucky he said that Miles should be fired and Flenn was a joke, later when he found out that we were going to play in the BCS Championship game he now wants to throw an LSU party at his house, I told him I have other plans.

Go Figure..

SaintFanInATLHELL · 01-01-2008, 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by hagan714

Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled?

Payton has his faults. See my signature.

The biggest problem is the defense. If Payton wants to be a successful HC in this league, he has to understand that a solid defense is the foundation that you build elite teams upon. I just got off the phone with my brother, who incidentally will not be satisfied with any defense less than the 1991 Saints Dome Patrol, and pointed out 4 goals that the Saints defense needs to accomplish moving forward:

1. Stop the run (actually pretty good at that this past season)

2. Consistently shut down 3rd down (awful)

3. Do not give up the big play (really awful)

4. Generate turnovers (awful)

This is going to require all of Payton's attention and I fear that he may not be willing to give this area of the team the attention that it needs in order to be successful.

This is my issue with him as HC. He needs to coach the entire team, not just the offense.

SFIAH

abutler · 12-31-2007, 06:30 PM

I understand that we all believe we have an opportunity here. Can we remember that we have never had this opportunity before? Are we betting that we will have this kind of team in the future?
You must not be from here to bring up 3-13 the year before last. Katrina hit, remember?

What we have right now is an NFL dream offense. We need alot of help on defense. We saw 0 improvement from our defense from last year. We were exploited big time this year. Everyone knew our weakness. Why didn't we see improvement? Who dropped the ball?
Let's all be realists and not just optimists. I don't like getting people upset. I love the Saints and will always stomp and scream when I'm at Dome. Especially when the opposition is in the huddle.
Nobody has yet to explain why our coach showed up Saturday night for a Sunday Championship in Chicago. I don't think its explainable. It was the truth of our coach's lack of judgement revealed. And we're all seeing what we want...what we hope..still after another year of bad play calls, timeouts, and a self destructive search for some spark.
I love the Saints and believe in our team. We have a long history of mediocre coaches. Sean had his run, blew it, and did not improve the next year. We went backwards. I'm sorry but I've seen enough. That's just me.
I'll keep singing the songs supporting our team no matter what. I've been going through this for 20 years.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 01-01-2008, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by abutler

I understand that we all believe we have an opportunity here. Can we remember that we have never had this opportunity before? Are we betting that we will have this kind of team in the future?
You must not be from here to bring up 3-13 the year before last. Katrina hit, remember?

What we have right now is an NFL dream offense.

Which matters not a single lick. Championships in the NFL are won on the defensive side of the ball. In the past 25 years the SB champion has been out of the top 10 in scoring defense exactly 2 times, the 1983 Raiders and the 2006 Colts. And the 2006 Colts played championship caliber defense during the playoff run and have continued into this season finishing with the #1 scoring defense in the NFL. In fact just looking over the stats 10 of 11 of the top scoring defenses this season are in the playoffs.

We need alot of help on defense. We saw 0 improvement from our defense from last year. We were exploited big time this year. Everyone knew our weakness. Why didn't we see improvement? Who dropped the ball?
Let's all be realists and not just optimists. I don't like getting people upset. I love the Saints and will always stomp and scream when I'm at Dome. Especially when the opposition is in the huddle.
Nobody has yet to explain why our coach showed up Saturday night for a Sunday Championship in Chicago. I don't think its explainable. It was the truth of our coach's lack of judgement revealed. And we're all seeing what we want...what we hope..still after another year of bad play calls, timeouts, and a self destructive search for some spark.

I was at the NFC championship game last January. The weather wasn't the problem. The problem was twofold: suspect defense and a lack of determination to run the ball against the Bears. As proven just last week, you can't win when you throw the ball 60 times a game.

BTW I would like to point out that without Payton, we don't have that special offense that you are crowing about. He's an essential component (along with Brees, Colston, and Bush) to making the thing go.

What's missing is that Jim Johnson, Monte Kiffen type assistant HC for defense that has complete control of the defense and the personnel and scheme to make it work.

Gibbs has had two years to make this defense work. It hasn't. I'd personally be calling Rex Ryan up on the phone trying to get him down here if it were me.

I love the Saints and believe in our team. We have a long history of mediocre coaches. Sean had his run, blew it, and did not improve the next year. We went backwards. I'm sorry but I've seen enough. That's just me.
I'll keep singing the songs supporting our team no matter what. I've been going through this for 20 years.

The problem is thinking that if you fire Payton, that magically someone who will take you to the promised land will appear in his place.

Sean Payton is the only coach in Saints history to lead them to the NFC championship game. He's shown me that he's willing to learn. Though I was disappointed with taking 4 cracks running the ball at Philly at the goal line and failing, at least he filling manned up and ran the ball. He's publically stated that the reverse at the end of the TB game was a mistake and that he wouldn't repeat it. His offense has run the ball more consistently and efficiently in the latter stages of the season.

All this points to me is that the guy is capable of adapting. That's a crucial element in being a successful HC in this league.

Let's forget about firing Payton and work on the real problem: How can we make this Saints defense capable enough to crack the top 10 in scoring? That's all. That's the only fix this team needs.

So get to work!

SFIAH

hagan714 · 12-31-2007, 06:47 PM

When I see Sean starting to gut our team like Haz did then I will agree. But as long as he is moving forward with the team I have his back. This team despite it record is better than last years. I hate to be redundant. Offense is deeper and the defense has improved. despite all the injuries. We have learned that our WR are not as deep as we thought. So the Meachem pick makes more sense. RB is deeper than we thought and keeping PT was the right move. So all the moves did work but some are clear as day. Sean in his sophomore season has learned a lot. I doubt Drew will be going for the passing record again next year. Colston will have help at WR. Our secondary will be addressed and YOUNG WILL NOT BE THE LONE YOUNG CB ON THE ROSTER. So on and so on. I have faith in things changing again and once again all in the right direction. FORWARD

SaintFanInATLHELL · 01-01-2008, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by hagan714

When I see Sean starting to gut our team like Haz did then I will agree. But as long as he is moving forward with the team I have his back. This team despite it record is better than last years. I hate to be redundant. Offense is deeper and the defense has improved. despite all the injuries.

Hagan,

I can't see the defensive side of your equation. Every time I see the Saints defense all I see is poor scheme, poor technique, and poor personnel choices. It's obvious to everyone except the Saints coaching staff that:

1) David, Simineaux,. Shanlee, and Bullucks are awful.

2) The Saints secondary cannot cover a rock, much less NFL WRs.

3) The lack of pressure makes NFL jouneymen (and insurance salesmen) elevate to the likes of Montana, Elway, Farve, and Manning.

4) The defense cannot get off the field, get a turnover, stop a 3rd down ever, or stop the big play.

Everytime the defense trotted out on the field this season, I cringed. They never got better, never adjusted, never pressured, nothing.

So explain it to me.

We have learned that our WR are not as deep as we thought. So the Meachem pick makes more sense. RB is deeper than we thought and keeping PT was the right move. So all the moves did work but some are clear as day. Sean in his sophomore season has learned a lot. I doubt Drew will be going for the passing record again next year. Colston will have help at WR. Our secondary will be addressed and YOUNG WILL NOT BE THE LONE YOUNG CB ON THE ROSTER. So on and so on. I have faith in things changing again and once again all in the right direction. FORWARD

I don't see it on the defensive side. The defense needs to be blown up and rebuilt from scratch. The Saints need to spend every dime, every pick, every free agent meeting, every coaching change, EVERYTHING on defense this offseason. Fire Gibbs and get someone in here that understands pressure. Get staff in here that can evaluate defensive talent. Spend the money on big time talent.

Do it differently because the defensive product on the field now isn't working.

SFIAH

dwiley21 · 12-31-2007, 06:47 PM

No way you fire payton now! he is a young coach! He is still learning, and the team is still learning how to win. did he make mistakes Yes, but the whole team made mistakes. This was a tough year, I expect many changes to be made and the roster to look vastly different next year! They now know that just because you make the nfc championship game one year that the playoffs aren't guaranteed the next! Its time to grind this offseason. Payton will learn! I feel the biggest mistake of last season was the draft! That is where the biggest improvement needs to come!

12-31-2007, 05:51 PM	#2
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: Looking for a new head coach? Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled?

12-31-2007, 06:30 PM	#3
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Re: Looking for a new head coach? Originally Posted by hagan714 Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled? Yes FICKLED. After next season then sure FIRE away.

12-31-2007, 06:33 PM	#4
LongTimeFan Moderator Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Louisiana Posts: 2,403	Re: Looking for a new head coach? Originally Posted by hagan714 Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled? I have a friend who says he's a big LSU fan, when we lost to Kentucky he said that Miles should be fired and Flenn was a joke, later when he found out that we were going to play in the BCS Championship game he now wants to throw an LSU party at his house, I told him I have other plans. Go Figure..

01-01-2008, 10:10 AM	#5
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,783	Re: Looking for a new head coach? Originally Posted by hagan714 Agreed oldies. This is the same bunch that was signing his praise last year. can you say fickled? Payton has his faults. See my signature. The biggest problem is the defense. If Payton wants to be a successful HC in this league, he has to understand that a solid defense is the foundation that you build elite teams upon. I just got off the phone with my brother, who incidentally will not be satisfied with any defense less than the 1991 Saints Dome Patrol, and pointed out 4 goals that the Saints defense needs to accomplish moving forward: 1. Stop the run (actually pretty good at that this past season) 2. Consistently shut down 3rd down (awful) 3. Do not give up the big play (really awful) 4. Generate turnovers (awful) This is going to require all of Payton's attention and I fear that he may not be willing to give this area of the team the attention that it needs in order to be successful. This is my issue with him as HC. He needs to coach the entire team, not just the offense. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

12-31-2007, 06:30 PM	#6
abutler since 86 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Long Beach MS Posts: 23 Blog Entries: 2	Re: Looking for a new head coach? I understand that we all believe we have an opportunity here. Can we remember that we have never had this opportunity before? Are we betting that we will have this kind of team in the future? You must not be from here to bring up 3-13 the year before last. Katrina hit, remember? What we have right now is an NFL dream offense. We need alot of help on defense. We saw 0 improvement from our defense from last year. We were exploited big time this year. Everyone knew our weakness. Why didn't we see improvement? Who dropped the ball? Let's all be realists and not just optimists. I don't like getting people upset. I love the Saints and will always stomp and scream when I'm at Dome. Especially when the opposition is in the huddle. Nobody has yet to explain why our coach showed up Saturday night for a Sunday Championship in Chicago. I don't think its explainable. It was the truth of our coach's lack of judgement revealed. And we're all seeing what we want...what we hope..still after another year of bad play calls, timeouts, and a self destructive search for some spark. I love the Saints and believe in our team. We have a long history of mediocre coaches. Sean had his run, blew it, and did not improve the next year. We went backwards. I'm sorry but I've seen enough. That's just me. I'll keep singing the songs supporting our team no matter what. I've been going through this for 20 years.

12-31-2007, 05:10 PM	#1
BoudinSandwich OldiesDJ Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Scott, LA Posts: 951 Blog Entries: 12	Re: Looking for a new head coach? I've had my hand in some SP bashing, especially on this site. That said, the man deserves another year, atleast. I still want him as our coach, no matter how much bad things I've said about him. I think he's great - just someone needs to slap his hands and tell him "No!" when he gets too excited.

01-01-2008, 10:29 AM	#7
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,783	Re: Looking for a new head coach? Originally Posted by abutler I understand that we all believe we have an opportunity here. Can we remember that we have never had this opportunity before? Are we betting that we will have this kind of team in the future? You must not be from here to bring up 3-13 the year before last. Katrina hit, remember? What we have right now is an NFL dream offense. Which matters not a single lick. Championships in the NFL are won on the defensive side of the ball. In the past 25 years the SB champion has been out of the top 10 in scoring defense exactly 2 times, the 1983 Raiders and the 2006 Colts. And the 2006 Colts played championship caliber defense during the playoff run and have continued into this season finishing with the #1 scoring defense in the NFL. In fact just looking over the stats 10 of 11 of the top scoring defenses this season are in the playoffs. We need alot of help on defense. We saw 0 improvement from our defense from last year. We were exploited big time this year. Everyone knew our weakness. Why didn't we see improvement? Who dropped the ball? Let's all be realists and not just optimists. I don't like getting people upset. I love the Saints and will always stomp and scream when I'm at Dome. Especially when the opposition is in the huddle. Nobody has yet to explain why our coach showed up Saturday night for a Sunday Championship in Chicago. I don't think its explainable. It was the truth of our coach's lack of judgement revealed. And we're all seeing what we want...what we hope..still after another year of bad play calls, timeouts, and a self destructive search for some spark. I was at the NFC championship game last January. The weather wasn't the problem. The problem was twofold: suspect defense and a lack of determination to run the ball against the Bears. As proven just last week, you can't win when you throw the ball 60 times a game. BTW I would like to point out that without Payton, we don't have that special offense that you are crowing about. He's an essential component (along with Brees, Colston, and Bush) to making the thing go. What's missing is that Jim Johnson, Monte Kiffen type assistant HC for defense that has complete control of the defense and the personnel and scheme to make it work. Gibbs has had two years to make this defense work. It hasn't. I'd personally be calling Rex Ryan up on the phone trying to get him down here if it were me. I love the Saints and believe in our team. We have a long history of mediocre coaches. Sean had his run, blew it, and did not improve the next year. We went backwards. I'm sorry but I've seen enough. That's just me. I'll keep singing the songs supporting our team no matter what. I've been going through this for 20 years. The problem is thinking that if you fire Payton, that magically someone who will take you to the promised land will appear in his place. Sean Payton is the only coach in Saints history to lead them to the NFC championship game. He's shown me that he's willing to learn. Though I was disappointed with taking 4 cracks running the ball at Philly at the goal line and failing, at least he filling manned up and ran the ball. He's publically stated that the reverse at the end of the TB game was a mistake and that he wouldn't repeat it. His offense has run the ball more consistently and efficiently in the latter stages of the season. All this points to me is that the guy is capable of adapting. That's a crucial element in being a successful HC in this league. Let's forget about firing Payton and work on the real problem: How can we make this Saints defense capable enough to crack the top 10 in scoring? That's all. That's the only fix this team needs. So get to work! SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

12-31-2007, 06:47 PM	#8
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: Looking for a new head coach? When I see Sean starting to gut our team like Haz did then I will agree. But as long as he is moving forward with the team I have his back. This team despite it record is better than last years. I hate to be redundant. Offense is deeper and the defense has improved. despite all the injuries. We have learned that our WR are not as deep as we thought. So the Meachem pick makes more sense. RB is deeper than we thought and keeping PT was the right move. So all the moves did work but some are clear as day. Sean in his sophomore season has learned a lot. I doubt Drew will be going for the passing record again next year. Colston will have help at WR. Our secondary will be addressed and YOUNG WILL NOT BE THE LONE YOUNG CB ON THE ROSTER. So on and so on. I have faith in things changing again and once again all in the right direction. FORWARD
	"We may have lost the game, but you'll be hurting tomorrow." Doug Atkins

01-01-2008, 11:18 AM	#9
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,783	Re: Looking for a new head coach? Originally Posted by hagan714 When I see Sean starting to gut our team like Haz did then I will agree. But as long as he is moving forward with the team I have his back. This team despite it record is better than last years. I hate to be redundant. Offense is deeper and the defense has improved. despite all the injuries. Hagan, I can't see the defensive side of your equation. Every time I see the Saints defense all I see is poor scheme, poor technique, and poor personnel choices. It's obvious to everyone except the Saints coaching staff that: 1) David, Simineaux,. Shanlee, and Bullucks are awful. 2) The Saints secondary cannot cover a rock, much less NFL WRs. 3) The lack of pressure makes NFL jouneymen (and insurance salesmen) elevate to the likes of Montana, Elway, Farve, and Manning. 4) The defense cannot get off the field, get a turnover, stop a 3rd down ever, or stop the big play. Everytime the defense trotted out on the field this season, I cringed. They never got better, never adjusted, never pressured, nothing. So explain it to me. We have learned that our WR are not as deep as we thought. So the Meachem pick makes more sense. RB is deeper than we thought and keeping PT was the right move. So all the moves did work but some are clear as day. Sean in his sophomore season has learned a lot. I doubt Drew will be going for the passing record again next year. Colston will have help at WR. Our secondary will be addressed and YOUNG WILL NOT BE THE LONE YOUNG CB ON THE ROSTER. So on and so on. I have faith in things changing again and once again all in the right direction. FORWARD I don't see it on the defensive side. The defense needs to be blown up and rebuilt from scratch. The Saints need to spend every dime, every pick, every free agent meeting, every coaching change, EVERYTHING on defense this offseason. Fire Gibbs and get someone in here that understands pressure. Get staff in here that can evaluate defensive talent. Spend the money on big time talent. Do it differently because the defensive product on the field now isn't working. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

12-31-2007, 06:47 PM	#10
dwiley21 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 216	Re: Looking for a new head coach? No way you fire payton now! he is a young coach! He is still learning, and the team is still learning how to win. did he make mistakes Yes, but the whole team made mistakes. This was a tough year, I expect many changes to be made and the roster to look vastly different next year! They now know that just because you make the nfc championship game one year that the playoffs aren't guaranteed the next! Its time to grind this offseason. Payton will learn! I feel the biggest mistake of last season was the draft! That is where the biggest improvement needs to come!
dwiley21 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 216	Forget the past, The Future is NOW! Time to Shine! Geaux Saints!