Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense?

BillyCarpenter1 · 09-20-2003, 11:33 AM

While I agree that I would like to have that one special guy on defense Rusta brings up a good point. Remember the 72 Dolphins??

rusta · 09-20-2003, 11:34 AM

i understand lummox

i never said i didn\'t want a spikes, hell i probably woulda peed my pants if we had got spikes

but i think we will be ok for now, with all the corners out there next year hopefully we can make some big pickups next year

lumm0x · 09-20-2003, 11:40 AM

You could say the same about any great defense. The Bears, Steelers, Raiders, Vikings, Rams...of old of course. There were so many seemingly dominant players that it was hard to distinguish a superstar from a coat rider. The 72 Dolphins defense was so solid that there didn\'t appear to be a weak link. But they got the no name defense moniker strictly because Tom Landry had altzheimer\'s, not because there was no standouts. They had 4 defenders go to the All NFL defense in 72. That 4 of 11 of the best defenders in the NFL.

lumm0x · 09-20-2003, 11:41 AM

You betcha.....standout CB for next year.

BrooksMustGo · 09-20-2003, 11:43 AM

You guys watch, we\'re taking an offensive lineman from Georgia in the first round next year.

BillyCarpenter1 · 09-20-2003, 11:50 AM

LummOx --

I don\'t think that because every player on a defense is solid that it would keep a domiante player from being recognized. Ed too Tall Jones comes to mind, and Charles Haley too. Both players played on solid defenses but were recongized as being dominate.

I am speaking about those elite players you said you would like to see on our defense. Not solid players.

nocloning · 09-20-2003, 12:26 PM

I agree with rusta. Once you have solid players at every position and people have trust in each other, it gives individuals the chance to shine and become playmakers. And so far we aren\'t solid all around in my opinion.
I\'m not sold on our defense yet. The Titans and Colts will provide a real test. If they are still ranked 9th after these games, I might reconsider, but right now they just look so improved because the Seahawks didn\'t have to score more points and the defense played as well as possible against a Texans team that came of an emotional high.
Back to the thread title: Venturi surprised me and the Texans offense with some of the things he did. So yes, he is - so far - indeed doing a better job with the defense. But that game was played near 100% by the players and we\'ll see if they can keep it up.
I\'m the disbelieving Thomas here and need more proof that it\'s not just a fluke.

lumm0x · 09-20-2003, 01:16 PM

This is just for fun, but how would you classify the career of an elite individual player?

NFL records?
Team records?
Hall of fame?
League leading?

If a player set a team or NFL record, is he considered elite? If a player makes the hall of fame is he considered elite? If he leads the league in a statistical category is he considered elite?

SuperbowlSaints · 09-20-2003, 02:00 PM

hey lumm0x, what about this, what if a player makes it to the Probowl a certain number of times, or how many suberbowl rings he has, what about all of the awards the player has received, like Offensive rookie of the year that kind of stuff, i agree with you lumm0x, every one has a different defnition of what makes a player elite, don\'t you guys think there should be a common definition?

BillyCarpenter1 · 09-20-2003, 02:11 PM

This is just for fun, but how would you classify the career of an elite individual player?

NFL records?
Team records?
Hall of fame?
League leading?

If a player set a team or NFL record, is he considered elite? If a player makes the hall of fame is he considered elite? If he leads the league in a statistical category is he considered elite?

The ability to take over a game to me defines an elite player.

As far as what defines an elite career. I think you have to split that up in in a few catergories.

1. Individual success.

2.. Team success.

3. length of career.

Individual success (stats) weigh heavily on how one\'s career is looked at.

Team success -- (superbowls) Turns good or great players into legends.

Length of career -- Allows players to break all time records, such as the running or passing records, and turns them into legands.

So to anwser your question lummOx all of it.

09-20-2003, 11:33 AM	#11
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? While I agree that I would like to have that one special guy on defense Rusta brings up a good point. Remember the 72 Dolphins??
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

09-20-2003, 11:34 AM	#12
rusta 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 361	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? i understand lummox i never said i didn\'t want a spikes, hell i probably woulda peed my pants if we had got spikes but i think we will be ok for now, with all the corners out there next year hopefully we can make some big pickups next year
rusta 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 361

09-20-2003, 11:40 AM	#13
lumm0x Resident antediluvian Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,026	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? You could say the same about any great defense. The Bears, Steelers, Raiders, Vikings, Rams...of old of course. There were so many seemingly dominant players that it was hard to distinguish a superstar from a coat rider. The 72 Dolphins defense was so solid that there didn\'t appear to be a weak link. But they got the no name defense moniker strictly because Tom Landry had altzheimer\'s, not because there was no standouts. They had 4 defenders go to the All NFL defense in 72. That 4 of 11 of the best defenders in the NFL.

09-20-2003, 11:41 AM	#14
lumm0x Resident antediluvian Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,026	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? You betcha.....standout CB for next year.

09-20-2003, 11:43 AM	#15
BrooksMustGo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,762	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? You guys watch, we\'re taking an offensive lineman from Georgia in the first round next year.

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09-20-2003, 11:50 AM	#16
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? LummOx -- I don\'t think that because every player on a defense is solid that it would keep a domiante player from being recognized. Ed too Tall Jones comes to mind, and Charles Haley too. Both players played on solid defenses but were recongized as being dominate. I am speaking about those elite players you said you would like to see on our defense. Not solid players.
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

09-20-2003, 12:26 PM	#17
nocloning 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 302	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? I agree with rusta. Once you have solid players at every position and people have trust in each other, it gives individuals the chance to shine and become playmakers. And so far we aren\'t solid all around in my opinion. I\'m not sold on our defense yet. The Titans and Colts will provide a real test. If they are still ranked 9th after these games, I might reconsider, but right now they just look so improved because the Seahawks didn\'t have to score more points and the defense played as well as possible against a Texans team that came of an emotional high. Back to the thread title: Venturi surprised me and the Texans offense with some of the things he did. So yes, he is - so far - indeed doing a better job with the defense. But that game was played near 100% by the players and we\'ll see if they can keep it up. I\'m the disbelieving Thomas here and need more proof that it\'s not just a fluke.
nocloning 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 302	\"What is Wal-Mart? Is it like they sell wall stuff?\"

09-20-2003, 01:16 PM	#18
lumm0x Resident antediluvian Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,026	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? This is just for fun, but how would you classify the career of an elite individual player? NFL records? Team records? Hall of fame? League leading? If a player set a team or NFL record, is he considered elite? If a player makes the hall of fame is he considered elite? If he leads the league in a statistical category is he considered elite?

09-20-2003, 02:00 PM	#19
SuperbowlSaints Registered Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 90	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? hey lumm0x, what about this, what if a player makes it to the Probowl a certain number of times, or how many suberbowl rings he has, what about all of the awards the player has received, like Offensive rookie of the year that kind of stuff, i agree with you lumm0x, every one has a different defnition of what makes a player elite, don\'t you guys think there should be a common definition?
SuperbowlSaints Registered Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 90

09-20-2003, 02:11 PM	#20
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Is Rick Venturi Doing A Better Job With The Defense? This is just for fun, but how would you classify the career of an elite individual player? NFL records? Team records? Hall of fame? League leading? If a player set a team or NFL record, is he considered elite? If a player makes the hall of fame is he considered elite? If he leads the league in a statistical category is he considered elite? The ability to take over a game to me defines an elite player. As far as what defines an elite career. I think you have to split that up in in a few catergories. 1. Individual success. 2.. Team success. 3. length of career. Individual success (stats) weigh heavily on how one\'s career is looked at. Team success -- (superbowls) Turns good or great players into legends. Length of career -- Allows players to break all time records, such as the running or passing records, and turns them into legands. So to anwser your question lummOx all of it.
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209