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Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by stockman311 One last thing on Sharper. I love the guy, but let's take a look at who he got is 9 picks on last year. 2 INT's against Matthew Stafford, making his first career NFL start 1 ...

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Old 03-08-2010, 11:47 AM   #1
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by stockman311 View Post

One last thing on Sharper. I love the guy, but let's take a look at who he got is 9 picks on last year.

2 INT's against Matthew Stafford, making his first career NFL start
1 INT against Kevin Kolb, making his first career NFL start
2 INT's against Mark Sanchez, making his 4th career NFL start
1 INT against Matt Ryan, in his second NFL season
1 INT against Tom Brady, when the Patriots where in full pass come from behind mode
1 INT against Josh Freeman, making his 15th career NFL start.

With the exception of Ryan and Brady, who I classify as excellent competition, Sharper feasted on Rookies and Second year QB's and I would say was pedestrian at best against quality QB's in the playoffs. I would actually classify his play in the playoffs as poor. 10 solo tackles and 1 Pass Defensed total against Arizona, Minny, and Indy combined.
I understand what you are saying, but, at the same time, other safeties in the NFL also played against rookies, first-time starters, and teams coming from behind during the regular season, and they didn't intercept 9 balls and scored 3 TDs.

As for Sharper's playoff performance, first, the playoff teams made it to the playoffs because they don't make many mistakes to begin with. And, a lot of times you really can't argue just numbers when talking defense. For example, Tracy Porter made 2 crucial interceptions and scored a TD in the playoffs and SB, and Greer made none. So who had the better run? Sure Tracy made 2 heady plays in reading the QBs and routes and his highlights were all over ESPN and the NFL Network, but the opposing QB's reluctance to throwing the ball to Greer's side gave Tracy the opportunity to make those plays. So just like shying away from Greer, Warner, Farve, Manning, they probably also shied away from Sharper because they knew of his skills, and thus giving Tracy the chance to become the Legend Slayer ..

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Old 03-08-2010, 11:50 AM   #2
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
I understand what you are saying, but, at the same time, other safeties in the NFL also played against rookies, first-time starters, and teams coming from behind during the regular season, and they didn't intercept 9 balls and scored 3 TDs.

As for Sharper's playoff performance, first, the playoff teams made it to the playoffs because they don't make many mistakes to begin with. And, a lot of times you really can't argue just numbers when talking defense. For example, Tracy Porter made 2 crucial interceptions and scored a TD in the playoffs and SB, and Greer made none. So who had the better run? Sure Tracy made 2 heady plays in reading the QBs and routes and his highlights were all over ESPN and the NFL Network, but the opposing QB's reluctance to throwing the ball to Greer's side gave Tracy the opportunity to make those plays. So just like shying away from Greer, Warner, Farve, Manning, they probably also shied away from Sharper because they knew of his skills, and thus giving Tracy the chance to become the Legend Slayer ..
I know for a fact that both Greer and Porter are EXCELLENT players and both had fantastic postseasons. I also know that our pass Defense dropped from 9th to 23rd in pass defense rankings when they were both out. It's the exact reason why I think Sharper is overated. Without Porter, Greer, and Gay in the lineup Sharper is not the same player. They make him better, not the other way around.
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Old 03-08-2010, 11:52 AM   #3
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by stockman311 View Post
I know for a fact that both Greer and Porter are EXCELLENT players and both had fantastic postseasons. I also know that our pass Defense dropped from 9th to 23rd in pass defense rankings when they were both out. It's the exact reason why I think Sharper is overated. Without Porter, Greer, and Gay in the lineup Sharper is not the same player. They make him better, not the other way around.
Well wont Greer and Porter be back???...and wouldnt Sharper teamed with them be e pretty good secondary?..i think so ..so whats your point?
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Old 03-08-2010, 11:54 AM   #4
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by stockman311 View Post
Without Porter, Greer, and Gay in the lineup Sharper is not the same player. They make him better, not the other way around.
I think it is a two way street. It takes a good 5 players to make a good secondary. But yes our corners did help Sharper quite a bit. And our corners were helped by having Sharper instead of Kaesviharn behind them.
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Old 03-08-2010, 11:56 AM   #5
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by exile View Post
I think it is a two way street. It takes a good 5 players to make a good secondary. But yes our corners did help Sharper quite a bit. And our corners were helped by having Sharper instead of Kaesviharn behind them.
If you look at Greer's DVOA numbers from last year he was the second highest rated CB in the league last year behind only Darell Revis. I.E. He helped Sharper much more than Sharper helped him. As I said I really like Sharper, but age is age and players don't generally get better at FS as they get closer to 35. They get worse.

Last edited by stockman311; 03-08-2010 at 12:02 PM..
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Old 03-08-2010, 12:59 PM   #6
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by stockman311 View Post
I know for a fact that both Greer and Porter are EXCELLENT players and both had fantastic postseasons. I also know that our pass Defense dropped from 9th to 23rd in pass defense rankings when they were both out. It's the exact reason why I think Sharper is overated. Without Porter, Greer, and Gay in the lineup Sharper is not the same player. They make him better, not the other way around.

But, dude, you take both the starting corners out, especially the type of corners Jabari and Tracy are, and then put a combination of Usama-Jenkins-Gay playing corner, of course your pass defense is going to suffer, regardless of who plays FS for you. None of the replacements at CB can cover routes or re-route receivers like Jabari and Tracy can.

I don't know if Sharper is over-rated or not, or who is over-rating him, but compared against the other FSs in the league, he made the plays when he had the opportunity and the others didn't. That's it.

How much he gets paid, that's not for me to decide. It is not my money, but I am not going to say he does or doesn't deserve a certain amount of money because he plays with better corners or worse corners.

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Old 03-08-2010, 01:04 PM   #7
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
But, dude, you take both the starting corners out, especially the type of corners Jabari and Tracy are, and then put a combination of Usama-Jenkins-Gay playing corner, of course your pass defense is going to suffer, regardless of who plays FS for you. None of the replacements at CB can cover routes or re-route receivers like Jabari and Tracy can.

I don't know if Sharper is over-rated or not, or who is over-rating him, but compared against the other FSs in the league, he made the plays when he had the opportunity and the others didn't. That's it.

How much he gets paid, that's not for me to decide. It is not my money, but I am not going to say he does or doesn't deserve a certain amount of money because he plays with better corners or worse corners.
I can agree with this. However, I will tell you that the Saints just aren't going to overpay for aging veterans. They have already proven they won't with Fujita. IF there had been a cap this year the Saints would have been over it, and I expect them to be fiscally responsible this year in case the cap comes back next year. If another teams comes in at $5MM-$6MM or mutliple years (3 years) on Sharper he is as good as gone IMHO. Thanks for the post.
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Old 03-08-2010, 01:10 PM   #8
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
But, dude, you take both the starting corners out, especially the type of corners Jabari and Tracy are, and then put a combination of Usama-Jenkins-Gay playing corner, of course your pass defense is going to suffer, regardless of who plays FS for you. None of the replacements at CB can cover routes or re-route receivers like Jabari and Tracy can.

I don't know if Sharper is over-rated or not, or who is over-rating him, but compared against the other FSs in the league, he made the plays when he had the opportunity and the others didn't. That's it.
How much he gets paid, that's not for me to decide. It is not my money, but I am not going to say he does or doesn't deserve a certain amount of money because he plays with better corners or worse corners.
Yep i agree..and without thinking of his age that right there is top five safety money..
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Old 03-08-2010, 01:26 PM   #9
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
But, dude, you take both the starting corners out, especially the type of corners Jabari and Tracy are, and then put a combination of Usama-Jenkins-Gay playing corner, of course your pass defense is going to suffer, regardless of who plays FS for you. None of the replacements at CB can cover routes or re-route receivers like Jabari and Tracy can.

I don't know if Sharper is over-rated or not, or who is over-rating him, but compared against the other FSs in the league, he made the plays when he had the opportunity and the others didn't. That's it.

How much he gets paid, that's not for me to decide. It is not my money, but I am not going to say he does or doesn't deserve a certain amount of money because he plays with better corners or worse corners.
I think i agree with what your saying. Sharper is good because he is allowed to play "his" type of game with Jabari and Tracy on the field. That has nothing to do with his ability. I have seen a lot of comments about who he was able to intercept on this season. He was tied with four other players at 9 interceptions to lead the league. Regardless of who he got them on there were what... 60/70 other FS/CB that could not meet the challenge.

Having a FS on the field that lead the league in interceptions makes the QB think twice about some passes.


PS. he would have had the league lead by +1 (total of 10)if not for the roughing the passer called in NY against Vilma which negated his interception.

3 of his Ints were TDs and he had 376 yards. Pay the man. His dynamic is worth it.

It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau
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Old 03-08-2010, 01:29 PM   #10
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Re: Fujita Signs with Browns * MERGE*

Originally Posted by x626xBlack View Post
I think i agree with what your saying. Sharper is good because he is allowed to play "his" type of game with Jabari and Tracy on the field. That has nothing to do with his ability. I have seen a lot of comments about who he was able to intercept on this season. He was tied with four other players at 9 interceptions to lead the league. Regardless of who he got them on there were what... 60/70 other FS/CB that could not meet the challenge.

Having a FS on the field that lead the league in interceptions makes the QB think twice about some passes.


PS. he would have had the league lead by +1 (total of 10)if not for the roughing the passer called in NY against Vilma which negated his interception.

3 of his Ints were TDs and he had 376 yards. Pay the man. His dynamic is worth it.
Thanks for saying what feel also..
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