Shaun Rogers ranked 7th

blackangold · 02-26-2012, 06:15 PM

Originally Posted by FinSaint

But that is the perception I was trying to disprove...

Franklin produced at the level at which all the indicators - before the Saints signed him - showed he should, so I can't accept a statement like "he under performed" purely because of that fact.

Franklin has never been a pass rushing DL - he has always been a run stopping DL - so if the Saints signed him to be a pass rusher, it is not Franklin's fault he didn't live up to that role.

Rogers was supposed to be the one to create the interior push and pass rush out of the two FA DT signings, and that is why I would not want them to re-sign him.

No matter how much we all would like to see an improvement in the interior pass rush next season, the Saints still need guys that are strong against the run, so that the opposition is forced to throw the ball. That is why I like D-linemen like Franklin and Jordan, who are very good at defending the run.

It seems to me that many fans have had misguided beliefs about what type of players both Franklin and Jordan were/are, which has led to many expressing their disappointment at their performances when I personally think that both of them did a fine job in their respective roles.

I understand that Jordan was never considered a pass rushing DE during his collegiate career however given the amount of sacks he got (1) for the season considering the playing time he got does not make me happy about the decision to draft him. Consider this, the sack he managed to get was against Cam Newton who was running out of the pocket, not to mention when Jordan made the tackle it was a personal foul (horse collar). Also, Jordan played in every game but but had 2 less sacks then McBride who only played in 3 games. I hope Jordan finds the ability to get to the QB or gets moved to DT.

Fantasy world:
We draft Ingram with the Jordan pick and retain our pick for the upcoming draft, look what LB is there at that position .... Hightower...

I really do hope Jordan pans out because Hightower looks to be a stud LB

Danno · 02-27-2012, 08:02 AM

Originally Posted by FinSaint

It seems to me that many fans have had misguided beliefs about what type of players both Franklin and Jordan were/are, which has led to many expressing their disappointment at their performances when I personally think that both of them did a fine job in their respective roles.

Nailed it.

Franklin did exactly what I thought he'd do, and probably did what the coaches expected as well. Stop the run in order for our 3-tech DT's to penetrate. Franklin held up his end of the deal. Our 3-techs... not so much.

Rogers didn't play as well as I'd hoped, but he wasn't terrible either. I expected much more out of him since he was in a rotation that should have kept him fresh, but he often looked fatigued.

Rugby Saint II · 02-26-2012, 01:41 PM

Surely there's a rookie or UDFA out there that can do it cheaper. Then we use that money to help fix our defense. Give a big fat guy the league minimum and then go get another one for the rotation. We're still saving money and can afford to upgrade the LB'ers in free agency.

FinSaint · 02-26-2012, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II

Surely there's a rookie or UDFA out there that can do it cheaper. Then we use that money to help fix our defense. Give a big fat guy the league minimum and then go get another one for the rotation. We're still saving money and can afford to upgrade the LB'ers in free agency.

I seriously doubt that there's an UDFA out there with better run stopping ability than Franklin, definitely cheaper ones, but not as good.

If the Saints are lucky, Franklin could be had for as little as $2.5-3M for a single season, and for that price he'd be really good value for the money - that's like 2% of the cap.

Danno · 02-26-2012, 02:29 PM

Franklin played well
Rogers played OK

I'd resign Franklin and let Rogers walk.

hagan714 · 02-26-2012, 08:20 PM

both FA DT were disappointing to say the least

CharityMike · 02-26-2012, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by hagan714

both FA DT were disappointing to say the least

^^THIS^^

And the lengths some are going, to try and make me think they were even decent, is funny.

FinSaint · 02-26-2012, 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by CharityMike

^^THIS^^

And the lengths some are going, to try and make me think they were even decent, is funny.

ScottF · 02-27-2012, 10:06 AM

what am missing here with Rogers? including post season, he had 23 tackles and zero sacks
he is way past guaranteed money just for potential

papz · 02-27-2012, 10:29 AM

Our system and lack of off season could have played a big part in both Rogers and Franklin having average years. If they price is right, which is no where near what they each made last season, I'd be very interested in bringing Franklin back and I'd kick the tires on Rogers. Our defense as a whole played poorly last year... doesn't mean these guys are talented.

02-26-2012, 06:15 PM	#1
blackangold 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 3,422	Originally Posted by FinSaint But that is the perception I was trying to disprove... Franklin produced at the level at which all the indicators - before the Saints signed him - showed he should, so I can't accept a statement like "he under performed" purely because of that fact. Franklin has never been a pass rushing DL - he has always been a run stopping DL - so if the Saints signed him to be a pass rusher, it is not Franklin's fault he didn't live up to that role. Rogers was supposed to be the one to create the interior push and pass rush out of the two FA DT signings, and that is why I would not want them to re-sign him. No matter how much we all would like to see an improvement in the interior pass rush next season, the Saints still need guys that are strong against the run, so that the opposition is forced to throw the ball. That is why I like D-linemen like Franklin and Jordan, who are very good at defending the run. It seems to me that many fans have had misguided beliefs about what type of players both Franklin and Jordan were/are, which has led to many expressing their disappointment at their performances when I personally think that both of them did a fine job in their respective roles. I understand that Jordan was never considered a pass rushing DE during his collegiate career however given the amount of sacks he got (1) for the season considering the playing time he got does not make me happy about the decision to draft him. Consider this, the sack he managed to get was against Cam Newton who was running out of the pocket, not to mention when Jordan made the tackle it was a personal foul (horse collar). Also, Jordan played in every game but but had 2 less sacks then McBride who only played in 3 games. I hope Jordan finds the ability to get to the QB or gets moved to DT. Fantasy world: We draft Ingram with the Jordan pick and retain our pick for the upcoming draft, look what LB is there at that position .... Hightower... I really do hope Jordan pans out because Hightower looks to be a stud LB

02-27-2012, 08:02 AM	#2
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,758	Originally Posted by FinSaint It seems to me that many fans have had misguided beliefs about what type of players both Franklin and Jordan were/are, which has led to many expressing their disappointment at their performances when I personally think that both of them did a fine job in their respective roles. Nailed it. Franklin did exactly what I thought he'd do, and probably did what the coaches expected as well. Stop the run in order for our 3-tech DT's to penetrate. Franklin held up his end of the deal. Our 3-techs... not so much. Rogers didn't play as well as I'd hoped, but he wasn't terrible either. I expected much more out of him since he was in a rotation that should have kept him fresh, but he often looked fatigued.

02-26-2012, 01:41 PM	#3
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,200	Surely there's a rookie or UDFA out there that can do it cheaper. Then we use that money to help fix our defense. Give a big fat guy the league minimum and then go get another one for the rotation. We're still saving money and can afford to upgrade the LB'ers in free agency. ScottF likes this.

02-26-2012, 01:57 PM	#4
FinSaint Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Finland... formerly Southern Virginia Posts: 4,964	Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II Surely there's a rookie or UDFA out there that can do it cheaper. Then we use that money to help fix our defense. Give a big fat guy the league minimum and then go get another one for the rotation. We're still saving money and can afford to upgrade the LB'ers in free agency. I seriously doubt that there's an UDFA out there with better run stopping ability than Franklin, definitely cheaper ones, but not as good. If the Saints are lucky, Franklin could be had for as little as $2.5-3M for a single season, and for that price he'd be really good value for the money - that's like 2% of the cap.

02-26-2012, 02:29 PM	#5
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,758	Franklin played well Rogers played OK I'd resign Franklin and let Rogers walk. Turbo Saint and FinSaint like this.

02-26-2012, 08:20 PM	#6
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	both FA DT were disappointing to say the least

02-26-2012, 09:29 PM	#7
CharityMike Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Mid City, New Orleans Posts: 3,556	Originally Posted by hagan714 both FA DT were disappointing to say the least ^^THIS^^ And the lengths some are going, to try and make me think they were even decent, is funny.

02-26-2012, 09:59 PM	#8
FinSaint Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Finland... formerly Southern Virginia Posts: 4,964	Originally Posted by CharityMike ^^THIS^^ And the lengths some are going, to try and make me think they were even decent, is funny. CharityMike likes this.

02-27-2012, 10:06 AM	#9
ScottF 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 6,324	what am missing here with Rogers? including post season, he had 23 tackles and zero sacks he is way past guaranteed money just for potential

02-27-2012, 10:29 AM	#10
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,799	Our system and lack of off season could have played a big part in both Rogers and Franklin having average years. If they price is right, which is no where near what they each made last season, I'd be very interested in bringing Franklin back and I'd kick the tires on Rogers. Our defense as a whole played poorly last year... doesn't mean these guys are talented.

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