Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks

burningmetal · 09-11-2012, 04:31 AM

With all that said, I was equally disgusted with every position yesterday. I can't remember being more disappointed in a team. But those tackles were particularly bad, and with the offense struggling like that, I think it took the wind out of everyone's collective sail. There's no excuse for it, but let's hope they regroup and find a way to mask those problems once more.

jeanpierre · 09-11-2012, 06:18 AM

It was their defensive ends that were pinning their ears back and meeting in the middle...

Seattle playoff game two seasons ago? Bushrod and Strief looked like turnstyles and those Seattle DEs should be sending Christmas Cards to our tackles thanking them for their big paydays...

49ers Aldon Smith was annointed the way he handled our OTs last year in the playoffs...

That's why I asked whose decision it was to say we were fine at OT...

It was a total team loss yesterday - but the OT problem has been a concern...

TheOak · 09-11-2012, 06:34 AM

Originally Posted by jeanpierre

It was their defensive ends that were pinning their ears back and meeting in the middle...

Seattle playoff game two seasons ago? Bushrod and Strief looked like turnstyles and those Seattle DEs should be sending Christmas Cards to our tackles thanking them for their big paydays...

49ers Aldon Smith was annointed the way he handled our OTs last year in the playoffs...

That's why I asked whose decision it was to say we were fine at OT...

It was a total team loss yesterday - but the OT problem has been a concern...

I brought up Bushrod getting man handled against the Patriots in preseason and was told it was preseason....didnt matter.

BS- Its now regular season. and it didn't go away. BOTH batted balls were Bushrods guy and Bushrod was 3 feet from him... I could have batted those balls with no one in my face.

lee909 · 09-11-2012, 07:29 AM

The worry is that with Brees eating up so much cap room the money isn't there to get better players.Its always going to be either a young player just drafted or cast offs from elsewhere and trying to find a system to keep Brees safe.
I'm not dating we shouldn't have paid him but it will cost is elsewhere.

Joker · 09-11-2012, 08:01 AM

What's up with the guy from USC Charles Brown, can he play better than what we have now. I've always thought that Bushrod was not a left tackle and wouldn't want him protecting my 100 million dollar QB's blind side. Paid a kings ransom for Bree's the least you can do is protect him and let him earn that big money, on the other hand had to pay a lot to get him sacrifices will have to be made somewhere just not on the O Line.
As I was reminded by a friend it's just the first game, they have time to get it fixed no worries as of now but after week 3 or 4 I would start to get worried.

Looking back at that pitiful performance it was a team effort, penalties,dropped passes,fumbles,blown assignments on the defense all the way around so it's not just the offensive line although a good left tackle wouldn't be bad.

FinSaint · 09-11-2012, 08:03 AM

Originally Posted by lee909

The worry is that with Brees eating up so much cap room the money isn't there to get better players.Its always going to be either a young player just drafted or cast offs from elsewhere and trying to find a system to keep Brees safe.
I'm not dating we shouldn't have paid him but it will cost is elsewhere.

And they seem willing to allow for some edge pressure, as long as the interior of the line holds up and allows Brees to step up to make a pass.

Because of that it's very logical that they are paying their guard pair the big bucks because they are the ones keeping that interior from not collapsing on Brees.

Buhsrod will more than likely be gone after this season, he has a cap hit of $6.75M this year and if he is looking anywhere near that figure for his next contract... he might as well start looking around the league for someone foolish enough to pay him that, because I think someone might be willing to pay him that based on the fact that he has been a part of this offense and this O-line.

Strief is ok as a backup, but shouldn't really be starting. But like lee909 said, it's about balancing out who you would like to have on your team and who you can afford to have on your team.

I do hope that they'll use next year's 1st round pick to draft a stud of a LT, and if there's a certain player they like very much for that position - I wouldn't necessarily be against them trading up to get him or trading down if he can be had at a lower pick. I'd be willing to see them use couple of picks to get a stud of an LT if that is what it requires.

dizzle88 · 09-11-2012, 08:06 AM

Originally Posted by Joker

What's up with the guy from USC Charles Brown, can he play better than what we have now. I've always thought that Bushrod was not a left tackle and wouldn't want him protecting my 100 million dollar QB's blind side. Paid a kings ransom for Bree's the least you can do is protect him and let him earn that big money, on the other hand had to pay a lot to get him sacrifices will have to be made somewhere just not on the O Line.
As I was reminded by a friend it's just the first game, they have time to get it fixed no worries as of now but after week 3 or 4 I would start to get worried.

Looking back at that pitiful performance it was a team effort, penalties,dropped passes,fumbles,blown assignments on the defense all the way around so it's not just the offensive line although a good left tackle wouldn't be bad.

Charles brown was the reason brees got sacked 5 times vs rams last season, hard to believe but he's worse than bushrod

FinSaint · 09-11-2012, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by Joker

What's up with the guy from USC Charles Brown, can he play better than what we have now.

He has had all of those injuries, which have really hampered his development process, and because of that he probably will never be starter material in the league.

He is the backup for Bushrod in the depth chart, and he did play LT with the second string O-line during the preseason - with Marcel Jones as the RT - but I didn't personally see anything spectacular out of him in those games.

He was drafted mainly because he supposedly had great movement off the line with really quick and precise foot work and with good long hands, but it might be that all of those injuries have left their mark on his movement skills for good.

SaintsBro · 09-11-2012, 10:46 AM

I always felt like what happened was, Jamaal Brown went down in '09, obviously unexpectedly, and Bushrod jumped in. I know I was panicking, back at that time. And the coaches were kinda like, winging it and flying by the seat of the pants. But it was sorta working. And then, it became a classic case of "hey, we won a Super Bowl with this thing" syndrome. So then it's like, OK, that's how we roll now -- Bushrod is now THE guy, never mind that it looks kinda sloppy and funky out there, never mind that teams with big guys like the Cowboys and Redskins can totally manhandle us on Bushrod's side, never mind that he's not a Pro Bowler or that Drew is looking jittery back there, when he used to look so smooth and fluid. Never mind all that, look away from it, look over here at the shiny object -- we just passed for eight zillion yards! Jimmy Graham! Sproles! Too many weapons! and all that jazz.

And then for a while, a lot of people (myself included) were like, "we have these TWO GREAT ALL PRO GUARDS, NICKS AND EVANS, we don't even need a left tackle out there" and then eventually, the fans and maybe even the coaches wind up in La-La Land, and reality starts to set in, about that left tackle slot. The temporary, stopgap, seat-of-the-pants, duct-tape and spit solution, Bushrod and Strief, has become the "new normal" out there.

I believe it's actually quite Payton-esque, in a way. To me, that's always kinda been sorta his temperament, or how he rolls. Like, short attention span man -- what's this, OK, stick a band aid on it, problem solved, everybody keep rolling -- he's on to the next thing. I'm thinking if we had been 8-8 or 9-7 in '09, no way Bushrod would still be here, probably Strief too.

Rugby Saint II · 09-11-2012, 12:30 PM

So, you're saying our tackles aren't as good as we need them to be. The problem is if we draft a tackle then we don't have that draft pick to use on our pathetic defense. Spags definitely needs ALL the draft picks because the talent on D is subpar.
I'm a little concerned about de la Puenta. I'm wondering if Nicks helped him more than we realized?

09-11-2012, 04:31 AM	#21
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,905 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks With all that said, I was equally disgusted with every position yesterday. I can't remember being more disappointed in a team. But those tackles were particularly bad, and with the offense struggling like that, I think it took the wind out of everyone's collective sail. There's no excuse for it, but let's hope they regroup and find a way to mask those problems once more.

09-11-2012, 06:18 AM	#22
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks It was their defensive ends that were pinning their ears back and meeting in the middle... Seattle playoff game two seasons ago? Bushrod and Strief looked like turnstyles and those Seattle DEs should be sending Christmas Cards to our tackles thanking them for their big paydays... 49ers Aldon Smith was annointed the way he handled our OTs last year in the playoffs... That's why I asked whose decision it was to say we were fine at OT... It was a total team loss yesterday - but the OT problem has been a concern...

09-11-2012, 06:34 AM	#23
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 18,978	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks Originally Posted by jeanpierre It was their defensive ends that were pinning their ears back and meeting in the middle... Seattle playoff game two seasons ago? Bushrod and Strief looked like turnstyles and those Seattle DEs should be sending Christmas Cards to our tackles thanking them for their big paydays... 49ers Aldon Smith was annointed the way he handled our OTs last year in the playoffs... That's why I asked whose decision it was to say we were fine at OT... It was a total team loss yesterday - but the OT problem has been a concern... I brought up Bushrod getting man handled against the Patriots in preseason and was told it was preseason....didnt matter. BS- Its now regular season. and it didn't go away. BOTH batted balls were Bushrods guy and Bushrod was 3 feet from him... I could have batted those balls with no one in my face.

09-11-2012, 08:01 AM	#25
Joker Site Donor Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Lafayette Posts: 408 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks What's up with the guy from USC Charles Brown, can he play better than what we have now. I've always thought that Bushrod was not a left tackle and wouldn't want him protecting my 100 million dollar QB's blind side. Paid a kings ransom for Bree's the least you can do is protect him and let him earn that big money, on the other hand had to pay a lot to get him sacrifices will have to be made somewhere just not on the O Line. As I was reminded by a friend it's just the first game, they have time to get it fixed no worries as of now but after week 3 or 4 I would start to get worried. Looking back at that pitiful performance it was a team effort, penalties,dropped passes,fumbles,blown assignments on the defense all the way around so it's not just the offensive line although a good left tackle wouldn't be bad.

09-11-2012, 08:03 AM	#26
FinSaint Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Finland... formerly Southern Virginia Posts: 4,955	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks Originally Posted by lee909 The worry is that with Brees eating up so much cap room the money isn't there to get better players.Its always going to be either a young player just drafted or cast offs from elsewhere and trying to find a system to keep Brees safe. I'm not dating we shouldn't have paid him but it will cost is elsewhere. And they seem willing to allow for some edge pressure, as long as the interior of the line holds up and allows Brees to step up to make a pass. Because of that it's very logical that they are paying their guard pair the big bucks because they are the ones keeping that interior from not collapsing on Brees. Buhsrod will more than likely be gone after this season, he has a cap hit of $6.75M this year and if he is looking anywhere near that figure for his next contract... he might as well start looking around the league for someone foolish enough to pay him that, because I think someone might be willing to pay him that based on the fact that he has been a part of this offense and this O-line. Strief is ok as a backup, but shouldn't really be starting. But like lee909 said, it's about balancing out who you would like to have on your team and who you can afford to have on your team. I do hope that they'll use next year's 1st round pick to draft a stud of a LT, and if there's a certain player they like very much for that position - I wouldn't necessarily be against them trading up to get him or trading down if he can be had at a lower pick. I'd be willing to see them use couple of picks to get a stud of an LT if that is what it requires.
	"I'm not bashing people, I'm bashing their opinions because in my opinion their opinion is wrong" - Danno

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09-11-2012, 07:29 AM	#24
lee909 Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Watford England Posts: 8,716 Blog Entries: 1	The worry is that with Brees eating up so much cap room the money isn't there to get better players.Its always going to be either a young player just drafted or cast offs from elsewhere and trying to find a system to keep Brees safe. I'm not dating we shouldn't have paid him but it will cost is elsewhere.

09-11-2012, 08:06 AM	#27
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 10,838	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks Originally Posted by Joker What's up with the guy from USC Charles Brown, can he play better than what we have now. I've always thought that Bushrod was not a left tackle and wouldn't want him protecting my 100 million dollar QB's blind side. Paid a kings ransom for Bree's the least you can do is protect him and let him earn that big money, on the other hand had to pay a lot to get him sacrifices will have to be made somewhere just not on the O Line. As I was reminded by a friend it's just the first game, they have time to get it fixed no worries as of now but after week 3 or 4 I would start to get worried. Looking back at that pitiful performance it was a team effort, penalties,dropped passes,fumbles,blown assignments on the defense all the way around so it's not just the offensive line although a good left tackle wouldn't be bad. Charles brown was the reason brees got sacked 5 times vs rams last season, hard to believe but he's worse than bushrod

09-11-2012, 08:10 AM	#28
FinSaint Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Finland... formerly Southern Virginia Posts: 4,955	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks Originally Posted by Joker What's up with the guy from USC Charles Brown, can he play better than what we have now. He has had all of those injuries, which have really hampered his development process, and because of that he probably will never be starter material in the league. He is the backup for Bushrod in the depth chart, and he did play LT with the second string O-line during the preseason - with Marcel Jones as the RT - but I didn't personally see anything spectacular out of him in those games. He was drafted mainly because he supposedly had great movement off the line with really quick and precise foot work and with good long hands, but it might be that all of those injuries have left their mark on his movement skills for good.
	"I'm not bashing people, I'm bashing their opinions because in my opinion their opinion is wrong" - Danno

09-11-2012, 10:46 AM	#29
SaintsBro Site Donor Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: in line with my ridiculous CLEAR PLASTIC BAG Posts: 3,650 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks I always felt like what happened was, Jamaal Brown went down in '09, obviously unexpectedly, and Bushrod jumped in. I know I was panicking, back at that time. And the coaches were kinda like, winging it and flying by the seat of the pants. But it was sorta working. And then, it became a classic case of "hey, we won a Super Bowl with this thing" syndrome. So then it's like, OK, that's how we roll now -- Bushrod is now THE guy, never mind that it looks kinda sloppy and funky out there, never mind that teams with big guys like the Cowboys and Redskins can totally manhandle us on Bushrod's side, never mind that he's not a Pro Bowler or that Drew is looking jittery back there, when he used to look so smooth and fluid. Never mind all that, look away from it, look over here at the shiny object -- we just passed for eight zillion yards! Jimmy Graham! Sproles! Too many weapons! and all that jazz. And then for a while, a lot of people (myself included) were like, "we have these TWO GREAT ALL PRO GUARDS, NICKS AND EVANS, we don't even need a left tackle out there" and then eventually, the fans and maybe even the coaches wind up in La-La Land, and reality starts to set in, about that left tackle slot. The temporary, stopgap, seat-of-the-pants, duct-tape and spit solution, Bushrod and Strief, has become the "new normal" out there. I believe it's actually quite Payton-esque, in a way. To me, that's always kinda been sorta his temperament, or how he rolls. Like, short attention span man -- what's this, OK, stick a band aid on it, problem solved, everybody keep rolling -- he's on to the next thing. I'm thinking if we had been 8-8 or 9-7 in '09, no way Bushrod would still be here, probably Strief too. TheOak likes this.

09-11-2012, 12:30 PM	#30
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 23,718	Re: Ben Grubbs vs. Carl Nicks So, you're saying our tackles aren't as good as we need them to be. The problem is if we draft a tackle then we don't have that draft pick to use on our pathetic defense. Spags definitely needs ALL the draft picks because the talent on D is subpar. I'm a little concerned about de la Puenta. I'm wondering if Nicks helped him more than we realized?

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