Ingram, what's wrong.

TheOak · 10-23-2012, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by voodooido

these are the years stats. The REAL stats:

RUSHINGATTYDSAVGTDPierre Thomas502144.31Mark Ingram441272.91
RUSHINGATTYDSAVGTDPierre Thomas502144.31Mark Ingram441272.91PT- 50 carries for 214 yards for a 4.3 avg
MIA- 44 carries for 127 yards for a 2.9 avg

Apparently REAL stats mane no sense.

Beastmode · 10-23-2012, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by MatthewT

One problem I see is the Saints are trying to use Mark Ingram in about the same role they used Deuce McAllister, to a degree. Ingram is a 215lb back, McAllister was listed at around 230, more likely around 250. McAllister simply did not go down easy and got his yards. Ingram is tough as nails, but seriously doesn't really have the bulk to be a short down power back. But like most running backs, gotta give the man the ball in order to get going. Until/if the Saints find a way to get Ingram the ball around 20 times per game, we should all refrain from judgment.

Ingram has also stated that he is not that kind of RB. Can't remember where I read it but he said something to that effect. They compare him to Emmitt Smith but Smith was actually smaller and for much of his career had the Moose. Even he will admit, much of his success was directly due to that tandem.

I've seen enough to know Ingram will contunie to get small gains unless something changes. Probably not going to get help with a FB but direct snaps, flee flickers...I would like to see them at least try some other options. Getting a dedicated O-line coach should help some but I'm not holding my breath.

Budsdrinker · 10-23-2012, 09:48 AM

We need to use him more on shotgun sets where it's 50-50 run vs pass.
Let him stay in as a blocker a couple times, let him catch a couple swing passes then let him take a delayed hand off. We have to mix it up with him in the game not just run up the gut. And by the way on the goal line stop, the Bucs tried to run behind Nicks twice and it didn't work.

Marlboro Man · 10-23-2012, 11:36 AM

His pass blocking is no better than Ivory's, case in point look at the Chargers game, he went outside to chip the DE while the S was blitzing. Totally missed the blitzer, Brees got hit, fumbled the ball and Ingram was lucky to be in the right place at the right time to pick up that fumble to save his poor play. We need to bring the hammer when we run the ball and that means activating Ivory. Fumbling in practice and fumbling in a game are two different things and I think Ivory knows that is why he's not being activated and I think he will take care of the ball if given the chance.

st thomas · 10-23-2012, 11:49 AM

krommer needs a run blocking retool. we have to change something.

Danno · 10-23-2012, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by Marlboro Man

His pass blocking is no better than Ivory's, .

Yes, it is.

subguy · 10-23-2012, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by Marlboro Man

His pass blocking is no better than Ivory's

Man i respectfully beg to differ

Ashley · 10-23-2012, 02:26 PM

Well we all are making good points about him. I can see it from both sides. But they said they needed to run him in the Bucs game. Then they didn't, we will never know as the real reason I guess.
But they need to do something with him, we need to feature him and work his butt off. Not just this up the middle crap for 3 yards or less.

Shoe. · 10-23-2012, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by st thomas

krommer needs a run blocking retool. we have to change something.

This may be something that Kromer just hasn't been able to work on enough due to time constraints, given whatever added responsibilities he had to nail down as IHC. Hopefully we see a little bit of a change moving forward now that Khrome should have a little more time w his boys.

Either way, I'd like to see Chris Ivory given a chance to make something happen in a game. If he fumbles, so be it, take your ass back to the bench, you had your chance. But if he doesn't and we find a 'tween the tackles runner who can operate with a degree of success, Ingram, as talented as he may be, could find himself as the odd man out.

Lifer · 10-23-2012, 03:13 PM

The issue isn't who is running the ball it is how the Saints run the ball. The Saints are a pass first team. Drew Brees is by far the best player. The offensive philosophy is to run just enough to keep the defense off balance so Brees can get passing lanes off of play action. The Saints are only committed to the run to the extent that they don't get too one dimensional. But that's completely different than some other teams, like for example the 49ers who are a run first team. If you put Pierre Thomas or Mark Ingram on the 49ers their stats would improve dramatically. What I question is given the way the Saints use the run, why did they give up a 1st round pick on Ingram. To me, that makes no sense.

10-23-2012, 09:22 AM	#31
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,026	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. Originally Posted by voodooido these are the years stats. The REAL stats: RUSHINGATTYDSAVGTDPierre Thomas502144.31Mark Ingram441272.91 RUSHINGATTYDSAVGTDPierre Thomas502144.31Mark Ingram441272.91PT- 50 carries for 214 yards for a 4.3 avg MIA- 44 carries for 127 yards for a 2.9 avg Apparently REAL stats mane no sense. UK_WhoDat and Boutte like this.

10-23-2012, 09:43 AM	#32
Beastmode 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 9,126	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. Originally Posted by MatthewT One problem I see is the Saints are trying to use Mark Ingram in about the same role they used Deuce McAllister, to a degree. Ingram is a 215lb back, McAllister was listed at around 230, more likely around 250. McAllister simply did not go down easy and got his yards. Ingram is tough as nails, but seriously doesn't really have the bulk to be a short down power back. But like most running backs, gotta give the man the ball in order to get going. Until/if the Saints find a way to get Ingram the ball around 20 times per game, we should all refrain from judgment. Ingram has also stated that he is not that kind of RB. Can't remember where I read it but he said something to that effect. They compare him to Emmitt Smith but Smith was actually smaller and for much of his career had the Moose. Even he will admit, much of his success was directly due to that tandem. I've seen enough to know Ingram will contunie to get small gains unless something changes. Probably not going to get help with a FB but direct snaps, flee flickers...I would like to see them at least try some other options. Getting a dedicated O-line coach should help some but I'm not holding my breath.
Beastmode 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 9,126

10-23-2012, 09:48 AM	#33
Budsdrinker A Cajun Transforming TX Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Woodlands, Texas Posts: 2,787	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. We need to use him more on shotgun sets where it's 50-50 run vs pass. Let him stay in as a blocker a couple times, let him catch a couple swing passes then let him take a delayed hand off. We have to mix it up with him in the game not just run up the gut. And by the way on the goal line stop, the Bucs tried to run behind Nicks twice and it didn't work.

10-23-2012, 11:36 AM	#34
Marlboro Man 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,469	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. His pass blocking is no better than Ivory's, case in point look at the Chargers game, he went outside to chip the DE while the S was blitzing. Totally missed the blitzer, Brees got hit, fumbled the ball and Ingram was lucky to be in the right place at the right time to pick up that fumble to save his poor play. We need to bring the hammer when we run the ball and that means activating Ivory. Fumbling in practice and fumbling in a game are two different things and I think Ivory knows that is why he's not being activated and I think he will take care of the ball if given the chance. Ashley likes this.

10-23-2012, 11:49 AM	#35
st thomas Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: lafayette Posts: 7,753	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. krommer needs a run blocking retool. we have to change something.

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10-23-2012, 02:05 PM	#36
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,720	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. Originally Posted by Marlboro Man His pass blocking is no better than Ivory's, . Yes, it is.

10-23-2012, 02:11 PM	#37
subguy 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: FL Posts: 2,095	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. Originally Posted by Marlboro Man His pass blocking is no better than Ivory's Man i respectfully beg to differ

10-23-2012, 02:26 PM	#38
Ashley Site Donor Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Colorado Springs Co Posts: 2,760	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. Well we all are making good points about him. I can see it from both sides. But they said they needed to run him in the Bucs game. Then they didn't, we will never know as the real reason I guess. But they need to do something with him, we need to feature him and work his butt off. Not just this up the middle crap for 3 yards or less.

10-23-2012, 02:47 PM	#39
Shoe. 500th Post Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Hub City Posts: 576	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. Originally Posted by st thomas krommer needs a run blocking retool. we have to change something. This may be something that Kromer just hasn't been able to work on enough due to time constraints, given whatever added responsibilities he had to nail down as IHC. Hopefully we see a little bit of a change moving forward now that Khrome should have a little more time w his boys. Either way, I'd like to see Chris Ivory given a chance to make something happen in a game. If he fumbles, so be it, take your ass back to the bench, you had your chance. But if he doesn't and we find a 'tween the tackles runner who can operate with a degree of success, Ingram, as talented as he may be, could find himself as the odd man out.

10-23-2012, 03:13 PM	#40
Lifer Registered Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 69	Re: Ingram, what's wrong. The issue isn't who is running the ball it is how the Saints run the ball. The Saints are a pass first team. Drew Brees is by far the best player. The offensive philosophy is to run just enough to keep the defense off balance so Brees can get passing lanes off of play action. The Saints are only committed to the run to the extent that they don't get too one dimensional. But that's completely different than some other teams, like for example the 49ers who are a run first team. If you put Pierre Thomas or Mark Ingram on the 49ers their stats would improve dramatically. What I question is given the way the Saints use the run, why did they give up a 1st round pick on Ingram. To me, that makes no sense.
Lifer Registered Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 69

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