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Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seer1 (Post 494074)

Meh. Spend the money where it'll have some positive impact.

I really don't care if he's brought back or not, but bringing him back on a non-guaranteed contract doesn't deter us from spending money anywhere else. We aren't spending any money nor would he take a roster spot away from anyone else if he doesn't make the team.

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackangold (Post 494146)

I am no longer surprised by this community's desire to being back/defend players which consistently have not performed. Not sure if its blind loyalty or something else, but this D will never get to where it should be if we keep bring back washed up talent. Statistically Shanle had some great seasons, hell Jason David had some nice int numbers before we let him go, lets bring those guys back too.

Stop looking at what he is payed to come back and remember he'll be taking a roster spot away from a new prospect; a roster spot which he hasn't been worth since 2010.

Shanle was solid, not spectacular. David looked like an elephant on ice skates.

Ellis is far from washed up. And he's not taking up a roster spot until the final 53.

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danno (Post 494132)

Before the Spags disaster, he had 137 tackles, 12-1/2 sacks, 13 Passes defended and 2 forced fumbles in 54 games.

That equates to roughly 34 tackles, 3 sacks and 3 PD's per season

Thats great for vet minimum.

Those numbers aren't very good, but for vet minimum, sure. Problem is this... His decline (hard to think of a guy declining when he wasn't doing much in the first place, but still) began the year before Spags.

What is it with everyone who stinks it up somehow being shrugged off on Spagnuolo. I suppose Drew's interceptions, and Jimmy's drops were Spags' fault too. The guy got one season with a bunch of aging players, and young guys who hadn't been successful before, and some people just don't want to believe that maybe we have some bad players. We have some young, raw talent in the front seven who have a chance to be really good. But Payton wanted to change to the 3-4, and frankly, I've been barking up that tree for years. Can't blame him for making the change, and it's hard to blame it all on Spags when he had limited time to work with these guys.

Spagnuolo failed in that he couldn't improve upon what he had, which is his job regardless of circumstance, and for that he deserves some blame. But what really did he have? Let's be realistic.

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 494160)

what really did he have? Let's be realistic.

Funny, GW had the same players and when he played them to their strengths we had a somewhat respectable defense...

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by papz (Post 494149)

So that money won't count against the cap unless he makes the final fifty-three?

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

I don't see why it would if it's not guaranteed. We sign over 80 players prior to camp and only 53 makes the team.

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

It's easy for me to overreact and see anyone being brought in as already having made the team. As long as he's not a lock then what the hell? Tebow though? Still no.

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by |Mitch| (Post 494163)

Funny, GW had the same players and when he played them to their strengths we had a somewhat respectable defense...

We did not have a somewhat respectable defense. That's pretty absurd. Haven't had one since '09, when we had Sharper and much younger versions of Will Smith, Jabari Greer, Jonathon Vilma and Tracy Porter.

You could maybe (I stress maybe) say that the '10 defense was somewhat adequate, and yet it was not good enough to keep a horrible Seattle offense from scoring 41 in the playoffs, when our offense had to scratch and claw to score 36 without several key players.

Steve Spagnuolo was not hired to come in and run a "GW" all or nothing style defense. He was hired to run HIS system, which brings me back to my original question... What really did he have? He got one year and almost no talent, with the exceptions being the young and unproven Junior Galette, Martez Wilson, and Cam Jordan (Jordan not being known for pass rushing prowess).

No coordinator looks good without good players. Williams runs the same system everywhere he goes, and his success has always depended on his available talent. But some systems work better than others. The Saints decided that GW's wasn't working anymore (they weren't wrong), and brought in Spagnuolo. He needed front four depth to make his four man rush work, yet he didn't even have quality starters.

Now that I've answered my own question, feel free to explain how I'm wrong.

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by burningmetal (Post 494627)

Defending Spagdontknowdefense, no matter how bad the defense was in past years regardless of the circumstances it never set an NFL record for the all time worse defense. OMG, how can you defend this guy?
He had no credentials to speak of as a DC except for the Giant's, anyone on this forum could have coached that defense, loaded from front to back, side to side, top to bottom.REALLY!!!!!!!!!
I've agreed with most of the things you wrote but not when it comes to Spagdontknowdefense, HELL NO!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: Sedrick Ellis in contact with Saints

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joker (Post 494653)

We did have some holes, but I'd guess talent wise we were probably middle of the pack.

I'd say the 2012 disaster was 80% on Spags and his system, and 20% on talent.