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If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Get vaccaro on the field, that guy is going to put someone on the ground...

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Old 09-02-2013, 04:16 AM   #21
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Get vaccaro on the field, that guy is going to put someone on the ground
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Old 09-02-2013, 05:05 AM   #22
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If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Originally Posted by DISPLACEDFAN View Post
I don't see anyone of those guys starting all of them are going to platoon.
Vaccaro should start but probably wont granted he'll see a lot of time
J.Jenkins may start at some point as well
Haralson and Foster and Johnson is going to come in off the bench
K.lewis is the only real starter that we have new starting
I just don't expect to see a big difference but hey we can't be any worse than were last yr
Everyone says we only need to be middle of the pack. Well that's hunky dory and good. I want a nasty mean rip your head off turnover causing unit were we don't have to score 40 points and sit on the edge of my seat hoping its gonna be enough for the win
I wanna see some 40-3 games or some shut outs .Don't you guys get tired of standing around the water cooler at work talking about how good the offense is but have to make excuses for the defense
I don't make excuses for crap. In the day of salary cap you can either afford an epic offense, an epic defense, or good of both. The rare year where a team has the top offense and defense is an anomaly ... Go back and look, most of your SB winning teams are lopsided.


You define "starter" as in on the first play but defense doesn't work that way, it's about packages and who has to be in to cover what for a good many of those positions. EG we don't sub on defense just to give someone a breather, a lot of it is to put the right package in.

So to tell me someone is going to be in 80% of the time but isn't a starter doesn't compute.

Can we get a snap in regular season play before we are polling the next defensive coordinator?
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Old 09-02-2013, 05:20 AM   #23
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

im not sure but that sounds like a excuse. the salary cap don't allow it
tell that to the pats always a top offense and almost always a top 10 def same with the giants,broncos,pitts,packers


I said in the beginning I was giving him the benefit of the doubt

i'm just saying I haven't seen much improvement only way we get pressure is with the blitz
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Old 09-02-2013, 05:57 AM   #24
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Originally Posted by DISPLACEDFAN View Post
im not sure but that sounds like a excuse. the salary cap don't allow it
tell that to the pats always a top offense and almost always a top 10 def same with the giants,broncos,pitts,packers


I said in the beginning I was giving him the benefit of the doubt

i'm just saying I haven't seen much improvement only way we get pressure is with the blitz
How did we get pressure with Greg Williams? Yea... Blitz

Haven't seen much improvement? You haven't seen much of anything, we have only played preseason... Base defense for a grand total of 5.5 quarters.

What it sounds like is someone needs to visit nfl.com and refresh their memory on the top and bottom of the piles.

2012
defensive rankings 32nd Saints, 31st Giants, 25th Pats, 24th Falcons.

2011
Defensive rankings 32nd Packers, 31st Pats, 27th Giants 24th Saints

2010
Defensive rankings 25th Pats

2009
Defensive rankings 25th Saints

Pats haven't had a top 24 defense since 2009 and then it wasn't top 10 which is top 1/3rd.

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Old 09-02-2013, 06:12 AM   #25
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Again why so combative we are on the same side you know

I want a defense plain and simple they can have any ranking stat wise i don't care as long as they get off the field on 3rd and 6,7,8,9 without allowing some weak arse crap over the top would be ok with me but it gets old watching my team sucking arse on the defensive side of the ball yr in and yr out

a sack or two would be nice
a interception,fumble something other than a high school defense
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Old 09-02-2013, 06:42 AM   #26
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

I see what you are getting at here with wanting more on defence. Sure, we all want that. Maybe starting the thread alluding to who we will be replacing Rob Ryan with after 1 year if things don't work out, was a little out of kilter.

With everything as it is now, Rob Ryan is absolutely safe for more than just a year as long as we show 'some' sign of progress. If we break our own NFL worst records then maybe there is a discussion to be had. But as all the pieces are back, we are in huge transition and there are personnel shifts, it is a learning curve.

As regards what Oak is saying, I couldn't agree more with him. In the days of Salary Cap, typically you have a team who is very good on offence OR very good on defence OR reasonable across the board.

It is very easy to get suckered in to the Seahawks and the 49ers at the moment. They both have lights out Defences. The thing is, because they have QBs coming off of one season of running about like idiots and they are the current darlings of the NFL, everyone thinks they have outstanding offences. They simply do not. The receiving corps for both is pretty weak (with the exception of Harvin who is injured, always, anyway). They both have solid ground games but my lord do they need that working to get points on the board.

The one possible exception on paper is Denver who do look solid across the board. Once again though, let's see how they copy for 6 games without Miller and how many times does Champ Bailey get burned this season? Their backfield by committee is anything but stellar.

In reality, we could have a more balanced team but it would likely come at the expense of the offence. As things stand, I have more than enough confidence in my offence that if we can keep the points conceded to under 24, we are in with a shot of winning every single game. And I think that is achievable without putting too much pressure on the offence and without asking too much of the defence at this point.
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Old 09-02-2013, 07:08 AM   #27
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Well... I'd like to see how it pans out first. I was hoping for Romeo, but since RR is here I am routing for him. Get it done Rob
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Old 09-02-2013, 08:28 AM   #28
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Originally Posted by DISPLACEDFAN View Post
I'm going into the season giving Rob Ryan the benefit of the doubt that he will but if he doesn't .I think they should go and see if they can get Lovie Smith. I really wanted Lovie this Year but I guess he was holding out for a HC job
...Doublechecking the calendar... Isn't it Labor Day? This sure sounds like a after the season discussion, not a before the season one.

Like most defenses in the NFL today, the Saints defense this year only needs to do 4 things:

1. Get off the field on 3rd down.
2. Take the ball away. Occasionally is good. Often would be great.
3. Defend in the Red Zone and try to hold the opposition to field goals.
4. Most important: DO NOT GIVE UP THE BIG PLAY!

Surprisingly the Saints were in the middle of the pack (15th) last year in the first category. The Red Zone defense was adequate. It's point #4 that was the killer. If the defense can cut out that single factor and force teams to drive the field, then the defense will instantly be better.

The team gave up 28.4 points per game last year (454 pts in 16 games). Note this included blanking Tampa Bay last December, so it's really over 30 PPG in competitive games. In the previous 7 years the offense has scored no less than 23 PPG (28.8 PPG last season). So it's just simple arithmetic. If the Saints defense can cut down on the big plays and slow scoring a bit (24 PPG would be enough, 20-21 PPG would be outstanding) then the team will be fine.

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Old 09-02-2013, 08:44 AM   #29
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Originally Posted by DISPLACEDFAN View Post
I don't know I guess I've always been defensive guy.i just like a defense that goes out and knocks your _______ in the dirt. Its just not something we have never had in the last 30+ yrs
What you are looking for simply doesn't exist in the NFL anymore. All the talent, and all the rules favor the offense. Like it or not, most fans enjoy the scoring and the League has accommodated that. 30 years ago it was possible to knock out QBs and receivers with impunity. In today's league pretty much anything other than pushing an offensive player down, and only after they have received the ball, results in a huge penalty.

In short defenses are hamstrung. So when the rules change, play to the rules. And the Saints have had that in spades over the last 7 years.

The 1985 Bears and the 2000 Ravens could not function in the 2013 NFL.

So like all teams today, you have to work with what you have. For the Saints, it's using scheme to slow down the opposition. It's improving personnel on the back end (Lewis, Vaccaro) to better defend the back end in wide open sets. It's opening up lanes for edge rushers to get to the QB.

The only consistent theme that has persevered is that defenses have to be able to stop the run. If a team can run consistently on a defense, then it is toast. I believe that the D-line is now a strength, not a liability in that area.

SFIAH
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:03 AM   #30
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Re: If Rob Ryan fails to fix the Defense Who's Next DC?

Originally Posted by DISPLACEDFAN View Post
dome patrol was 25-30 yrs ago we haven't had one since and i'll give them till 86-92 was the last yr after 93 all but mills was gone I didn't forget im just saying why cant we ever have another one
Two words: salary cap.

You can have the Dome Patrol, or you can have Drew Brees. It's your choice

SFIAH
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