We should know who we are

SaintsBro · 11-04-2013, 11:12 AM

Serious question: does anybody KNOW for sure if Sean Payton still "scripts" the first 10 to 14 plays of the game, beforehand?? Because if he does, that was a pretty ridiculous, extremely pass-happy script. Pierre got 4 yards on one of them, but why abandon it?

I've often felt that the "pass happy" or "abandoning the run" thing comes from, Payton scripts those first dozen or so plays, and if he does not get the results he wants from the scripted runs, if it doesn't get huge chunks of yardage, he gets impatient, that "OCD" part of his personality kicks in and takes over, and he starts passing the ball all over the place. That's what I always felt from 2006-2009 when the whole "pass happy" thing was at its biggest argument.

The first quarter, you had Pierre for 4. Ingram for 2. Pierre for 0. And 20 passes. Sheez Louise.

Also wondering, if maybe Sproles being out, caused Payton to get out the Sharpie and scratch a bunch of planned running plays off the playsheet, that required Sproles to work, either as running back or decoy. It could have been some specific schemes and plays where "next man up" really didn't hold true because there was NO next man up, who could do the specific job of Sproles. I dunno.

Halo · 11-04-2013, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by SaintsBro

Serious question: does anybody KNOW for sure if Sean Payton still "scripts" the first 10 to 14 plays of the game, beforehand?? Because if he does, that was a pretty ridiculous, extremely pass-happy script. Pierre got 4 yards on one of them, but why abandon it?

I've often felt that the "pass happy" or "abandoning the run" thing comes from, Payton scripts those first dozen or so plays, and if he does not get the results he wants from the scripted runs, if it doesn't get huge chunks of yardage, he gets impatient, that "OCD" part of his personality kicks in and takes over, and he starts passing the ball all over the place. That's what I always felt from 2006-2009 when the whole "pass happy" thing was at its biggest argument.

The first quarter, you had Pierre for 4. Ingram for 2. Pierre for 0. And 20 passes. Sheez Louise.

Also wondering, if maybe Sproles being out, caused Payton to get out the Sharpie and scratch a bunch of planned running plays off the playsheet, that required Sproles to work, either as running back or decoy. It could have been some specific schemes and plays where "next man up" really didn't hold true because there was NO next man up, who could do the specific job of Sproles. I dunno.

Yeah, next man up is Cadet, but he hardly makes an appearance. Why scrap the game plan and go with full throttle passing? Even Sproles is more receiver than runningback. I'm with you on the confusion of the play-calls. I think SP is the final decision maker, but Carmichael also contributes. I just think they need to wake up - they've done it before.

Why the lack of confidence in Cadet? Why feel so low self esteem to run a reverse with the tight end? Not even Moore or.... blah.

Supertek · 11-04-2013, 01:54 PM

I was screaming QB sneek comeonman you could roll on the ground for a couple of inches at least. Being out played is one thing but stupidity is another. I think Payton needs to step off a bit and let the OC do his job.

Rugby Saint II · 11-05-2013, 01:52 PM

We also just barely won several games.

skymike · 11-05-2013, 08:03 PM

This game looks like 1 or 2 games we have every year. The home team
& crowd is all psyched up. They smother Drew & our offense. We get
ambushed by a St. Louis Rams. We have sucked at short yardage the entire
Payton era, since Deuce retired.

Nothings really changed, except our O-line looks a little worse, and we
'werent able to pull out the magic at the end.

exile · 11-05-2013, 08:05 PM

Originally Posted by skymike

This game looks like 1 or 2 games we have every year. The home team
& crowd is all psyched up. They smother Drew & our offense. We get
ambushed by a St. Louis Rams. We have sucked at short yardage the entire
Payton era, since Deuce retired.

Nothings really changed, except our O-line looks a little worse, and we
'werent able to pull out the magic at the end.

Agreed Mike. And typically the next game we roll over someone. Here come dem Cowboys!

SaintsBro · 11-05-2013, 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II

We also just barely won several games.

And yet we are #6 in the league in point differential, #11 in points scored, and #4 in points allowed.

skymike · 11-06-2013, 11:56 AM

Where is Jim Mora's mouth, when we need it.

Mora Coulda Woulda Shoulda - YouTube

Anybody remember what happened the next 3 weeks after he
made this speech? (hint, they did something they had never done
3 weeks in a row in history)

dueceloose · 11-06-2013, 05:32 PM

If the TE reverse worked we would be praising Sean just like the onside kick. If it didn't work we'd be bashing him like it seems we are doing now. I honestly thing Sean was afraid of running against the jets didn't want to waste time and downs so he passed.

Would you guys be just as upset if he ran 20 times and wasnt effective?

skymike · 11-06-2013, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by dueceloose

If the TE reverse worked we would be praising Sean just like the onside kick. If it didn't work we'd be bashing him like it seems we are doing now. I honestly thing Sean was afraid of running against the jets didn't want to waste time and downs so he passed.

Would you guys be just as upset if he ran 20 times and wasnt effective?

Man, we were the skin of the ball away. I'll tell you... I could see
taking a shot at the endzone. How bout a flea-flicker, a la the 1929 NFL Championship. It just seemed so obvious.

11-04-2013, 11:12 AM	#21
SaintsBro Site Donor Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: in line with my ridiculous CLEAR PLASTIC BAG Posts: 3,650 Blog Entries: 3	Re: We should know who we are Serious question: does anybody KNOW for sure if Sean Payton still "scripts" the first 10 to 14 plays of the game, beforehand?? Because if he does, that was a pretty ridiculous, extremely pass-happy script. Pierre got 4 yards on one of them, but why abandon it? I've often felt that the "pass happy" or "abandoning the run" thing comes from, Payton scripts those first dozen or so plays, and if he does not get the results he wants from the scripted runs, if it doesn't get huge chunks of yardage, he gets impatient, that "OCD" part of his personality kicks in and takes over, and he starts passing the ball all over the place. That's what I always felt from 2006-2009 when the whole "pass happy" thing was at its biggest argument. The first quarter, you had Pierre for 4. Ingram for 2. Pierre for 0. And 20 passes. Sheez Louise. Also wondering, if maybe Sproles being out, caused Payton to get out the Sharpie and scratch a bunch of planned running plays off the playsheet, that required Sproles to work, either as running back or decoy. It could have been some specific schemes and plays where "next man up" really didn't hold true because there was NO next man up, who could do the specific job of Sproles. I dunno. hagan714 likes this.

11-04-2013, 11:24 AM	#22
Halo Site Donor MONTHLY Join Date: May 2002 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 20,602 Blog Entries: 45	Re: We should know who we are Originally Posted by SaintsBro Serious question: does anybody KNOW for sure if Sean Payton still "scripts" the first 10 to 14 plays of the game, beforehand?? Because if he does, that was a pretty ridiculous, extremely pass-happy script. Pierre got 4 yards on one of them, but why abandon it? I've often felt that the "pass happy" or "abandoning the run" thing comes from, Payton scripts those first dozen or so plays, and if he does not get the results he wants from the scripted runs, if it doesn't get huge chunks of yardage, he gets impatient, that "OCD" part of his personality kicks in and takes over, and he starts passing the ball all over the place. That's what I always felt from 2006-2009 when the whole "pass happy" thing was at its biggest argument. The first quarter, you had Pierre for 4. Ingram for 2. Pierre for 0. And 20 passes. Sheez Louise. Also wondering, if maybe Sproles being out, caused Payton to get out the Sharpie and scratch a bunch of planned running plays off the playsheet, that required Sproles to work, either as running back or decoy. It could have been some specific schemes and plays where "next man up" really didn't hold true because there was NO next man up, who could do the specific job of Sproles. I dunno. Yeah, next man up is Cadet, but he hardly makes an appearance. Why scrap the game plan and go with full throttle passing? Even Sproles is more receiver than runningback. I'm with you on the confusion of the play-calls. I think SP is the final decision maker, but Carmichael also contributes. I just think they need to wake up - they've done it before. Why the lack of confidence in Cadet? Why feel so low self esteem to run a reverse with the tight end? Not even Moore or.... blah.

11-04-2013, 01:54 PM	#23
Supertek 500th Post Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Harvey La. Posts: 611	Re: We should know who we are I was screaming QB sneek comeonman you could roll on the ground for a couple of inches at least. Being out played is one thing but stupidity is another. I think Payton needs to step off a bit and let the OC do his job.

11-05-2013, 01:52 PM	#24
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,052	Re: We should know who we are We also just barely won several games.

11-05-2013, 08:03 PM	#25
skymike E. Side Cholo Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: The Barrio, H-town Posts: 6,089	Re: We should know who we are This game looks like 1 or 2 games we have every year. The home team & crowd is all psyched up. They smother Drew & our offense. We get ambushed by a St. Louis Rams. We have sucked at short yardage the entire Payton era, since Deuce retired. Nothings really changed, except our O-line looks a little worse, and we 'werent able to pull out the magic at the end. saintfan likes this.

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11-05-2013, 08:05 PM	#26
exile Cake or Death? Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 3,608	Re: We should know who we are Originally Posted by skymike This game looks like 1 or 2 games we have every year. The home team & crowd is all psyched up. They smother Drew & our offense. We get ambushed by a St. Louis Rams. We have sucked at short yardage the entire Payton era, since Deuce retired. Nothings really changed, except our O-line looks a little worse, and we 'werent able to pull out the magic at the end. Agreed Mike. And typically the next game we roll over someone. Here come dem Cowboys! skymike likes this.
exile Cake or Death? Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 3,608

11-05-2013, 08:17 PM	#27
SaintsBro Site Donor Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: in line with my ridiculous CLEAR PLASTIC BAG Posts: 3,650 Blog Entries: 3	Re: We should know who we are Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II We also just barely won several games. And yet we are #6 in the league in point differential, #11 in points scored, and #4 in points allowed.

11-06-2013, 05:32 PM	#29
dueceloose 500th Post Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 957	Re: We should know who we are If the TE reverse worked we would be praising Sean just like the onside kick. If it didn't work we'd be bashing him like it seems we are doing now. I honestly thing Sean was afraid of running against the jets didn't want to waste time and downs so he passed. Would you guys be just as upset if he ran 20 times and wasnt effective?
dueceloose 500th Post Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 957

11-06-2013, 06:45 PM	#30
skymike E. Side Cholo Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: The Barrio, H-town Posts: 6,089	Re: We should know who we are Originally Posted by dueceloose If the TE reverse worked we would be praising Sean just like the onside kick. If it didn't work we'd be bashing him like it seems we are doing now. I honestly thing Sean was afraid of running against the jets didn't want to waste time and downs so he passed. Would you guys be just as upset if he ran 20 times and wasnt effective? Man, we were the skin of the ball away. I'll tell you... I could see taking a shot at the endzone. How bout a flea-flicker, a la the 1929 NFL Championship. It just seemed so obvious.

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