Evaluating the Defense

ScottyRo · 01-31-2005, 04:05 PM

Since there's an offense evaluation out there, I thought I'd start one for the D. Let's keep AB out of this, PLEASE! Even if you believe the offense caused some or all of the D's woes. Stay on this side of the ball!

DE: A
Grant started off with a problem against the run but seemed to be coached into staying on guard for that. Howard had an OK year, but was strong at the end. Smith was a nice surprise in preseason and excellent coming in as a replacement. unfortunately, we probably can't afford to keep all 3 and Howard is likely the odd man out.

DT: D+
Young didn't impress me except for his "motor". He did chase down plays, but I want him to make those plays at the line or behind it. Tony wahts-his-name was probably next best at DT. Hopefully he'll be resigned. After that Benson needs to hold a "fire sale". Everything must go!

MLB: C
I was encouraged by Watson, but he made many, many rookie mistakes and was caught out of position several times. I was glad to see him in though because experience can only help him.

OLB: D+
A 7th round pick starting should tell us something. Bockwoldt's got heart. I hope he can match it with skill in the coming years. Another position for a fire sale.

CB: D-/B
D minus for the first part of the year. Thomas got paid and lost his heart. Ambrose was too slow in '03. Did they expect him to get any faster in '04? / MM and Brown looked much better. I don't know about Craft...he was injured and in the pre-season he missed some plays I thought he should have made. He did make a few plays after getting back on the field.

S: C-

This position kind of typifies this organization: We give up on a player with heart and football instincts (Knight) for a guy with none of that, but plenty of athleticism (Jones). I was pretty critical of Jones after '03, but I am pleased with his progress since. It's not enough but it's a start. The you got Mtichell getting hurt in '03 and being replaced by a vet that looked awful the previous season as a starter but who looked good early in replacement of Mitchell. Problem was they didn't give Mitchell his job back. If Bellamy played that good in '03 I can only imagine how good Mitchell would have been if not for that idiot Sage Rosenfels. He better win his job back this year or things wont get better at S.

saintswhodi · 01-31-2005, 04:19 PM

Again. Nice analysis Scotty. I would give our corners more towards a C than a D-/B. What does that mean anyway, either or? If so, just go with the C.

Also, if AB didn\'t............Just kidding. Nice work bud.

ScottyRo · 01-31-2005, 05:25 PM

The D- Minus is for the Thomas-Ambrose combo. The B was for MM-Brown combo. I put a \"/\" to point out the shift, but obviously that wasn\'t clear. Thanks for the kind words.

GumboBC · 01-31-2005, 05:32 PM

No disagreement from me, Scotty. Nice job.

For the first 11 or 12 games, I thought the Saints defense was one of the worst I had EVER seen. And I\'m serious. Not joking at all.....

Man, it\'s really hard for me to evaluate a lot of players individually.

I think the D-line didn\'t keep the blockers off the linebackers in the first 11 or 12 games. Then, to me, it seemed the D-linemen started playing more disciplinced. Started taking care of their gap responsiblities and the linebackers were able to make some plays. To me, that was the big thing over the last 4 weeks.

Then there was the secondary....

They played just awful for most of the season. Then, they started playing man-coverage and quit playing zone. I suppose McKenzie finally got his wish. It was McKenzie who bugged the hell out of Venturi to play man coverage.

Anyway, when we played man-coverage, the cornerbacks were able to think less and were able to play more instinctively. It was a huge difference in their play.

The only grade I would add is:

Rick Venturi: F

saintswhodi · 01-31-2005, 05:33 PM

Notice how noone flocks to talk about the D? But then people wanna ask why do we talk about AB so much? Cause that is the biggest hot button topic on here. But I appreciate you taking the effort to bring out the D Scotty. Again, nice job, and thanks for clarifying the shift, I still think it should just round to a C. lol

ScottyRo · 01-31-2005, 05:39 PM

They probably do deserve a C, but I bet I was blinded by the fact that they were so much better than Thomas and Ambrose. It skewed my perception a bit.

Saint_LB · 01-31-2005, 05:46 PM

I have one question....when is recess?

WD52 · 01-31-2005, 05:49 PM

I say the position that upsets me the most on the d is Tackles.

Young was a one man show that was kinda short all year.
OMG jonathan sullivan you PISS me off!!!!!!!!

With that said, if we could bring in Chris Hovan from the Vikes
along with Young I think the tackles will be ok..

WD52 · 01-31-2005, 05:52 PM

I say the position that upsets me the most on the d is Tackles.

Young was a one man show that was kinda short all year.
OMG jonathan sullivan you PISS me off!!!!!!!!

With that said, if we could bring in Chris Hovan from the Vikes
along with Young I think the tackles will be ok.. DT: D+
Young didn\'t impress me except for his \"motor\". He did chase down plays, but I want him to make those plays at the line or behind it. Tony wahts-his-name was probably next best at DT. Hopefully he\'ll be resigned. After that Benson needs to hold a \"fire sale\". Everything must go!

How much was Young double teamed any one remember?

saintswhodi · 01-31-2005, 05:55 PM

I like the idea of getting Hovan WD.

Scotty, your idea was better to mark a line in the difference after the chnage was made. Kudos.

01-31-2005, 04:05 PM	#1
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	Evaluating the Defense Since there's an offense evaluation out there, I thought I'd start one for the D. Let's keep AB out of this, PLEASE! Even if you believe the offense caused some or all of the D's woes. Stay on this side of the ball! DE: A Grant started off with a problem against the run but seemed to be coached into staying on guard for that. Howard had an OK year, but was strong at the end. Smith was a nice surprise in preseason and excellent coming in as a replacement. unfortunately, we probably can't afford to keep all 3 and Howard is likely the odd man out. DT: D+ Young didn't impress me except for his "motor". He did chase down plays, but I want him to make those plays at the line or behind it. Tony wahts-his-name was probably next best at DT. Hopefully he'll be resigned. After that Benson needs to hold a "fire sale". Everything must go! MLB: C I was encouraged by Watson, but he made many, many rookie mistakes and was caught out of position several times. I was glad to see him in though because experience can only help him. OLB: D+ A 7th round pick starting should tell us something. Bockwoldt's got heart. I hope he can match it with skill in the coming years. Another position for a fire sale. CB: D-/B D minus for the first part of the year. Thomas got paid and lost his heart. Ambrose was too slow in '03. Did they expect him to get any faster in '04? / MM and Brown looked much better. I don't know about Craft...he was injured and in the pre-season he missed some plays I thought he should have made. He did make a few plays after getting back on the field. S: C- This position kind of typifies this organization: We give up on a player with heart and football instincts (Knight) for a guy with none of that, but plenty of athleticism (Jones). I was pretty critical of Jones after '03, but I am pleased with his progress since. It's not enough but it's a start. The you got Mtichell getting hurt in '03 and being replaced by a vet that looked awful the previous season as a starter but who looked good early in replacement of Mitchell. Problem was they didn't give Mitchell his job back. If Bellamy played that good in '03 I can only imagine how good Mitchell would have been if not for that idiot Sage Rosenfels. He better win his job back this year or things wont get better at S.

01-31-2005, 04:19 PM	#2
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Evaluating the Defense Again. Nice analysis Scotty. I would give our corners more towards a C than a D-/B. What does that mean anyway, either or? If so, just go with the C. Also, if AB didn\'t............Just kidding. Nice work bud.

01-31-2005, 05:25 PM	#3
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	Evaluating the Defense The D- Minus is for the Thomas-Ambrose combo. The B was for MM-Brown combo. I put a \"/\" to point out the shift, but obviously that wasn\'t clear. Thanks for the kind words.

01-31-2005, 05:32 PM	#4
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Evaluating the Defense No disagreement from me, Scotty. Nice job. For the first 11 or 12 games, I thought the Saints defense was one of the worst I had EVER seen. And I\'m serious. Not joking at all..... Man, it\'s really hard for me to evaluate a lot of players individually. I think the D-line didn\'t keep the blockers off the linebackers in the first 11 or 12 games. Then, to me, it seemed the D-linemen started playing more disciplinced. Started taking care of their gap responsiblities and the linebackers were able to make some plays. To me, that was the big thing over the last 4 weeks. Then there was the secondary.... They played just awful for most of the season. Then, they started playing man-coverage and quit playing zone. I suppose McKenzie finally got his wish. It was McKenzie who bugged the hell out of Venturi to play man coverage. Anyway, when we played man-coverage, the cornerbacks were able to think less and were able to play more instinctively. It was a huge difference in their play. The only grade I would add is: Rick Venturi: F
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

01-31-2005, 05:33 PM	#5
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Evaluating the Defense Notice how noone flocks to talk about the D? But then people wanna ask why do we talk about AB so much? Cause that is the biggest hot button topic on here. But I appreciate you taking the effort to bring out the D Scotty. Again, nice job, and thanks for clarifying the shift, I still think it should just round to a C. lol

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01-31-2005, 05:39 PM	#6
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	Evaluating the Defense They probably do deserve a C, but I bet I was blinded by the fact that they were so much better than Thomas and Ambrose. It skewed my perception a bit.

01-31-2005, 05:46 PM	#7
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Evaluating the Defense I have one question....when is recess?
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894

01-31-2005, 05:49 PM	#8
WD52 Registered Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 80	Evaluating the Defense I say the position that upsets me the most on the d is Tackles. Young was a one man show that was kinda short all year. OMG jonathan sullivan you PISS me off!!!!!!!! With that said, if we could bring in Chris Hovan from the Vikes along with Young I think the tackles will be ok..
WD52 Registered Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 80

01-31-2005, 05:52 PM	#9
WD52 Registered Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 80	Evaluating the Defense I say the position that upsets me the most on the d is Tackles. Young was a one man show that was kinda short all year. OMG jonathan sullivan you PISS me off!!!!!!!! With that said, if we could bring in Chris Hovan from the Vikes along with Young I think the tackles will be ok.. DT: D+ Young didn\'t impress me except for his \"motor\". He did chase down plays, but I want him to make those plays at the line or behind it. Tony wahts-his-name was probably next best at DT. Hopefully he\'ll be resigned. After that Benson needs to hold a \"fire sale\". Everything must go! How much was Young double teamed any one remember?
WD52 Registered Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 80

01-31-2005, 05:55 PM	#10
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Evaluating the Defense I like the idea of getting Hovan WD. Scotty, your idea was better to mark a line in the difference after the chnage was made. Kudos.