Simple better than complex!!

GumboBC · 02-17-2005, 12:09 PM

[/quote:b45a6541ef]The excessive plays and the mind-boggling number of options of those plays, along with the wordy terminology, Haslett said, contributed to the mental errors and pre-snap penalties that have plagued the offense. The Saints led the NFL in penalty yards (1,141) and committed the second-most penalties (129) last season.

"Jim's philosophy is to simplify things, and his basis for that was the way our defense played the last four games (in 2004)," Sheppard said. "The simpler they got, the better those guys played. I believe that's true in all phases." [quote:b45a6541ef]

Read More

I like the fact that they are going to simplify the offense and the defense.

Notice that they said Jim Haslett simplified the defense over the last 4 games. I'm very encouraged.

Check out the rest of the article. Very good read.

baronm · 02-17-2005, 12:15 PM

see to me this says-our quarterback is not smart enough to grasp the playbook so we have to dumb it down..

I hate hearing the \"simplify\" excuse...

GumboBC · 02-17-2005, 12:17 PM

Does anyone have any thoughts on this article? Besides the usual \"Brooks is stupid \" remarks?

How \'bout it?

saintswhodi · 02-17-2005, 12:20 PM

I\'m with you baron. But I applaud Haslett for recognizing the fact, and making the effort to change it. Who knows, maybe we will see a new guy.

FrenzyFan · 02-17-2005, 12:22 PM

I agree. In my opinion, making things simpler is the only way to help the players we have at the moment. Quick thinking under pressure is not an apparent strength on this club. Clear, easy instructions plays to our strengths (athletics) and attempts to minimize our weaknesses (smarts, intuition, what-have-you). I call that a good coaching move.

I am also encouraged by the fact that this implies that Haslett had a more intrusive hand in the end-of-year defense. Maybe this had something to do with their improved performance. If this is the case, however, I am wondering why Venturi is out the door. Seems obvious at least to me that he is borderline incompetent, and if the above is true, there is evidence to support it.

The new question becomes; can athletic teams defeat intelligent (complex) teams? To me, the answer depends on how big the athetic gap is. If you compare Randy Moss against most corners - the gap is big enough. If you compare Michael Vick to most D-line, also big enough. I am somewhat doubtful that a team-wide athletic gap can achieve the level of victory I would like to see.

But in a genuflection to my own drop in standards and expections, if we managed to even go to the playoffs - I would call it a major success.

saintfan · 02-17-2005, 12:25 PM

see to me this says-our quarterback is not smart enough to grasp the playbook so we have to dumb it down..

Or it could be missed blocking assignments (I saw Deuce wiff on many attempts this year) or poor route running, etc etc.

Saint_LB · 02-17-2005, 12:27 PM

I believe that it is better to keep things simple and let the players have more time and confidence to utilize their God-given talent. I have experienced both sides of this coin, how be it on a much smaller and insignificant level. In high school, as a strong safety, my DB coach had many exceptions to the rule when in zone coverage. Usually I would be keying on the tight-end, and my responsibility depended on his first move. Our coach, however, had many exceptions to the rule, and I found myself kinda stuck in the middle thinking on many plays, instead of simply reacting. When I moved on to JC, the rules became much simpler...just watch his first movement, and then react accordingly...no exceptions. I found myself playing with a lot more confidence and enthusiasm, thus making a lot more plays and not standing around trying to make a decision.

I know things have to be a lot more complicated in the NFL, but I think the more you allow a player to use his ability and less his brain, you are going to get a lot better results...JMO.

ScottyRo · 02-17-2005, 01:04 PM

What\'s wrong with simplification? If it helps, I say use it. Not to mention we don\'t know from what point to what point they\'re talking about. For all we know we could have had the most complex game plans in the NFL. Making it simpler may just put us in the middle of the pack in complexity. Suggesting the team as a whole is dumb isn\'t fair.

Think of it like this...What if we decided for a day to only use highly technical terms and highly proper grammar on this board? Do you think we\'d be able to get our points across as effectively? I don\'t.

Saying that McCarthy\'s system was too complex, perhaps too wordy, seems correct to me. I, along with others, have speculated for a while that this was a cause of many wasted timeouts and delay of game penalties. It doesn\'t mean AB or anyone else is dumb. It indicates there was more going on than was necessary.

Danno · 02-17-2005, 01:26 PM

Saying that McCarthy\'s system was too complex, perhaps too wordy, seems correct to me. I, along with others, have speculated for a while that this was a cause of many wasted timeouts and delay of game penalties. It doesn\'t mean AB or anyone else is dumb. It indicates there was more going on than was necessary.

And perhaps why an extremely talented young LSU WR never saw the field?

ScottyRo · 02-17-2005, 01:51 PM

Perhaps, but I\'m gonna chalk his not making the field to three things (not in any particular order of importance):

1. he\'s not as extremely talented as LSU fans would like to believe;
2. offense was too complex for him; and
3. Haslet held a grudge against him for holding out.

02-17-2005, 12:09 PM	#1
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Simple better than complex!! [/quote:b45a6541ef]The excessive plays and the mind-boggling number of options of those plays, along with the wordy terminology, Haslett said, contributed to the mental errors and pre-snap penalties that have plagued the offense. The Saints led the NFL in penalty yards (1,141) and committed the second-most penalties (129) last season. "Jim's philosophy is to simplify things, and his basis for that was the way our defense played the last four games (in 2004)," Sheppard said. "The simpler they got, the better those guys played. I believe that's true in all phases." [quote:b45a6541ef] Read More I like the fact that they are going to simplify the offense and the defense. Notice that they said Jim Haslett simplified the defense over the last 4 games. I'm very encouraged. Check out the rest of the article. Very good read.
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-17-2005, 12:15 PM	#2
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954	Simple better than complex!! see to me this says-our quarterback is not smart enough to grasp the playbook so we have to dumb it down.. I hate hearing the \"simplify\" excuse...
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954

02-17-2005, 12:17 PM	#3
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Simple better than complex!! Does anyone have any thoughts on this article? Besides the usual \"Brooks is stupid \" remarks? How \'bout it?
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-17-2005, 12:20 PM	#4
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Simple better than complex!! I\'m with you baron. But I applaud Haslett for recognizing the fact, and making the effort to change it. Who knows, maybe we will see a new guy.

02-17-2005, 12:22 PM	#5
FrenzyFan 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 406	Simple better than complex!! I agree. In my opinion, making things simpler is the only way to help the players we have at the moment. Quick thinking under pressure is not an apparent strength on this club. Clear, easy instructions plays to our strengths (athletics) and attempts to minimize our weaknesses (smarts, intuition, what-have-you). I call that a good coaching move. I am also encouraged by the fact that this implies that Haslett had a more intrusive hand in the end-of-year defense. Maybe this had something to do with their improved performance. If this is the case, however, I am wondering why Venturi is out the door. Seems obvious at least to me that he is borderline incompetent, and if the above is true, there is evidence to support it. The new question becomes; can athletic teams defeat intelligent (complex) teams? To me, the answer depends on how big the athetic gap is. If you compare Randy Moss against most corners - the gap is big enough. If you compare Michael Vick to most D-line, also big enough. I am somewhat doubtful that a team-wide athletic gap can achieve the level of victory I would like to see. But in a genuflection to my own drop in standards and expections, if we managed to even go to the playoffs - I would call it a major success.
FrenzyFan 100th Post Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 406	\"The AB brand of TP will hurt your O-ring.\" - BlackandBlue http://www.darrylbercegeay.com/wsmith1.jpg

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02-17-2005, 12:25 PM	#6
saintfan Donated Plasma Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 18,556 Blog Entries: 5	Simple better than complex!! see to me this says-our quarterback is not smart enough to grasp the playbook so we have to dumb it down.. Or it could be missed blocking assignments (I saw Deuce wiff on many attempts this year) or poor route running, etc etc.

02-17-2005, 12:27 PM	#7
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Simple better than complex!! I believe that it is better to keep things simple and let the players have more time and confidence to utilize their God-given talent. I have experienced both sides of this coin, how be it on a much smaller and insignificant level. In high school, as a strong safety, my DB coach had many exceptions to the rule when in zone coverage. Usually I would be keying on the tight-end, and my responsibility depended on his first move. Our coach, however, had many exceptions to the rule, and I found myself kinda stuck in the middle thinking on many plays, instead of simply reacting. When I moved on to JC, the rules became much simpler...just watch his first movement, and then react accordingly...no exceptions. I found myself playing with a lot more confidence and enthusiasm, thus making a lot more plays and not standing around trying to make a decision. I know things have to be a lot more complicated in the NFL, but I think the more you allow a player to use his ability and less his brain, you are going to get a lot better results...JMO.
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Whether you think you can or think you can't...you're right!

02-17-2005, 01:04 PM	#8
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	Simple better than complex!! What\'s wrong with simplification? If it helps, I say use it. Not to mention we don\'t know from what point to what point they\'re talking about. For all we know we could have had the most complex game plans in the NFL. Making it simpler may just put us in the middle of the pack in complexity. Suggesting the team as a whole is dumb isn\'t fair. Think of it like this...What if we decided for a day to only use highly technical terms and highly proper grammar on this board? Do you think we\'d be able to get our points across as effectively? I don\'t. Saying that McCarthy\'s system was too complex, perhaps too wordy, seems correct to me. I, along with others, have speculated for a while that this was a cause of many wasted timeouts and delay of game penalties. It doesn\'t mean AB or anyone else is dumb. It indicates there was more going on than was necessary.

02-17-2005, 01:26 PM	#9
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,720	Simple better than complex!! Saying that McCarthy\'s system was too complex, perhaps too wordy, seems correct to me. I, along with others, have speculated for a while that this was a cause of many wasted timeouts and delay of game penalties. It doesn\'t mean AB or anyone else is dumb. It indicates there was more going on than was necessary. And perhaps why an extremely talented young LSU WR never saw the field?

02-17-2005, 01:51 PM	#10
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	Simple better than complex!! Perhaps, but I\'m gonna chalk his not making the field to three things (not in any particular order of importance): 1. he\'s not as extremely talented as LSU fans would like to believe; 2. offense was too complex for him; and 3. Haslet held a grudge against him for holding out.